ODraw - 1.3 beta

[jongough]

Hi Gilletarom,
As long at the combination of OD and WR are working for you that is fine.

If there are other requirements that I can help with between OD and WR or WD just let me know (or raise a flyspray).

Regards
Jon

[jongough]

Hi,
Patch 1.3.22 implements flyspray "FS#2139 - EBL waypoint display of bearing and distance" as well as some slight performance improvements. A windows installable is available from github here:
https://github.com/jongough/ocpn_dra...es/tag/v1.3.22

Jon

[Gilletarom]

Hello JonGogh,

I have a little time today to come back to study the operation of OD, version 1.3.22.

I work with the latest version of the language file in French, following the changes of this morning.

Some items not translated in the last tab of "Preferences / About".

See attached screenshot.

[Gilletarom]

Jon,

Here other item not translated.

And A crash of OCPN45 when I try to move a PIL.

A crash report was send.

[jongough]

Hi Gilletarom,
I have not released a new binary install for OD 1.3 yet as I am still waiting for some translations. I have just checked the latest POT file which should be on Crowdin and it does have all the strings in there ready for translation. The current patch level should be 1.3.24.

Jon

Originally Posted by Gilletarom

Hello JonGogh,

I have a little time today to come back to study the operation of OD, version 1.3.22.

I work with the latest version of the language file in French, following the changes of this morning.

Some items not translated in the last tab of "Preferences / About".

See attached screenshot.

[Gilletarom]

Hello JOngough,

1 °
Yesterday, in my first try, I created a second parallel line for the same PIL. Problem, it was created over the first. I did not understand that. Stupidly, I had created another one more. So I had 3 parallel lines. Hum ... pfuuu ...
Clearly, when creating a new line, it seems to me that it would be desirable that it should not be created on the first line.

2. I begin again. I create a PIL. I put my mouse on the parallel line. Right click, the context menu opens. There is twice the command "Move the line". I use the second. The parallel line disappears. Hum ... Bug. The second line "Move the line" should be:" Delete parallel line "

3. I begin again. I create a PIL. I get the guideline and a parallel line. I move my mouse and then use the keyboard key "Escape" to stop creating.
At this point, the mouse cursor should return to normal. But, it keeps the appearance of the little red cross. This is a detail, I point out. Just a problem with "Refresh".

4. I add an idea. It seems to me that for the same PIL, we will never create more than 2 parallel lines. One will serve as a limit to starboard, the other will serve as a port boundary. And these two parallel lines will serve to delimit a navigation corridor in which the boat will remain.

One could, from the beginning, create a red and the other green. That would be a way of recognizing them immediately.

5. On the other hand, if a PIL with two parallel lines is to be used to delineate a corridor in which the vessel is to remain, the entire corridor must not move from right to left, and vice versa, if the vessel makes zig-zag.

In other words, the center line must be unhooked from the boat. By taking the initial point with the mouse, one could move the whole of the PIL, without changing the direction. By taking the end point of the center line, the PIL could be rotated about the starting point of the center line.

Finally, but this is another story that would concern WD, the two parallel lines should serve as a wall that the ship should never cross.

[jongough]

Hi Gilletarom,
Item one is by design in that you specify an offset etc. in the OD properties panel and that is where and how the PIL is drawn.

Item two is a translation error. In the POT file there is both Move Line and Delete Line and on my system, in English, this is how they are displayed.

Item three I have been trying to solve for some time. For me the little red cross stays until I move the mouse at which time it is redrawn to be the setting the OCPN has set.

Item four I could add as a check box to the OD PIL properties tag, but then I would need to add details of how to draw the second PIL which would fill up the dialog box. I will think about how to implement that.

Item five is about detaching the PIL from the boat, which is doable as it is based on an EBL. But this is moving away from the meaning of Parallel Index Lines as I understand it. Would this confuse users? I will have a think and see if I can make sense of how this will interact with WD, again I don't want to confuse users the way I did with boundries and boundary alarms.

Jon

[Gilletarom]

hello JonGough,

Several questions :

1 °
If a PIL must have multiple parallel lines, what do you think is the maximum number of parallel lines that users will create?

If the answer is "2", then:
- Either you put two lines "Default offset" in the preferences of "OD / Parallel index line." One for each line.
- Either you create the first with the "default offset" and the second with the same value of "default offset", but by changing the sign ", so that it is created symmetrically with respect to the center line.

If the answer is greater than 2, is more complicated ...

2 °
Concerning the error of translation, I apologize. I corrected in Crowdin

3 °
Ok, this is not very serious.

4 °
Ok.

5. If I understand correctly, we do not have the same conception, you and I, what a PIL is.

My design:
It stems from the images I've seen on youtube video. Do not forget that I did not understand the oral explanations. My English, and the state of my ears prevents me. But there is a map and there are dangers on this map, on the port and starboard, in front of the boat.
I understood that two parallel lines serve to delimit a corridor to pass between two danger zones. In this case, the corridor seems to me to be fixed. That's why I proposed to be able to detach it from the boat.

On the other hand, even if the PIL is detached from the boat, it will be necessary that the distances between the boat and each parallel line be known and recalculated at each displacement of the boat, either taking into account the inforamtions coming from the GPS or taking into account the information Which could come from a radar.

Your design:
Can you remind me how you conceive the role of a Pil?

Gilletarom.

[jongough]

Hi Gilletarom,
I have not limited the number of lines that can be created for a PIL. I can see a case where you may need 4, two outer ones to say you are moving into a potential issue, and the inner 2 for when that becomes a reality.

Now, the idea is taken from the use of radar and is used to tell you if you are going to move into danger. The idea being that you draw a line parallel to your current course/heading at a certain distance from your boat, then if that line touches/crosses a headland/shallow patch, then you probably need to take avoiding action, i.e. turn away from the area to get more sea room. Using this technique it is much easier to see when you are actually going to be closer to the point/points at the closest approach well before you get there.


These pictures show how this is displayed when you move closer to the land.

Jon

[jongough]

Hi Gilletarom,
What you are suggesting is a new use for the PIL idea. There has been a suggestion of doing what you are but in a more complicated way. i.e. drawing a line of multiple segments of varying widths and not necessarily parallel, in this way defining a 'channel' that the boat should stay within.

At the moment this can be achieved using boundaries that are defined each side of the 'channel', these boundaries can then be tested through WD to see if you are crossing into them. I know it is not an elegant solution, but I think it is easier than using multiple, non-parallel PIL like lines.

I am happy to be convinced otherwise, I am just mindful that OD is now considered complex, particularly with the WD, AIS and Weather interactions.

Jon

Originally Posted by Gilletarom

hello JonGough,
.....

5. If I understand correctly, we do not have the same conception, you and I, what a PIL is.

My design:
It stems from the images I've seen on youtube video. Do not forget that I did not understand the oral explanations. My English, and the state of my ears prevents me. But there is a map and there are dangers on this map, on the port and starboard, in front of the boat.
I understood that two parallel lines serve to delimit a corridor to pass between two danger zones. In this case, the corridor seems to me to be fixed. That's why I proposed to be able to detach it from the boat.

On the other hand, even if the PIL is detached from the boat, it will be necessary that the distances between the boat and each parallel line be known and recalculated at each displacement of the boat, either taking into account the inforamtions coming from the GPS or taking into account the information Which could come from a radar.

.....
Gilletarom.

[Gilletarom]

Hello Jongough,

I had suspected, by looking a bit on the web, that the principle of PIL was linked to the use of a radar. I had not written it, leaving you to explain it.

So we are discussing the general principles.

There are now two concepts:
1 °: The strip is fixed relative to the map which serves as a geographical reference. The boat moves relative to the geographical landmark and should not leave this strip. The moving object is the boat. In this case, the tool used to position the mobile is the GPS.

2 °: The strip is attached to the boat. The external dangers must not enter the strip. In this case, it is considered that the reference mark is the set (boat, strip). And it is the external objects that are mobile.
In this case, the tool used to position the mobiles is the radar.

I think my reaction comes from the fact that, having no radar on board my ship, and lacking experience in its use, I spontaneously favored the first idea because, as far as I am concerned, Is the GPS that allows me to know where I am.

The whole thing is to know to whom the PIL tool is to be put:
- Or serving those who have a radar ?
- Or serving those who have a GPS ?

It seems to me that, with the "normal" technical capabilities of OpenCPN, the first concept is easier to implement since OpenCPN usually uses GPS data.

For the second concept, it will be necessary to envisage another plugin able to receive the data of the radar and to exploit them. Currently, this plugin does not seem to exist.

[rgleason]

I have seen a Koden radar used in antartica with a tool similar to a PIL but slightly different. The nav/crew would do a kind of dead reconning that involved drawing a line from a headland to a more distant landmark (one side of a small island or iceberg) . Then off setting that line some distance, then checking the charts for any known depths (mostly hand notations from years of travel in those areas). Then using that offset for the ships route.

Can PIL be used in a similar manner or would you suggest using a different tool?

Thanks

[rgleason]

I see Gille's observation that this tool uses GPS now but could also perhaps use radar. I had not been thinking of this above, but was thinking of replacing the radar with charts for drawing the PIL, but initially the pil isnt attached to the ship in this use.

[Gilletarom]

Hello RGleason, Hello Jongough,

You will not be surprised at my reaction: Make it simple. AND as practical as possible.

Should he have two tools or just one?
- Two tools, this implies two names, 7 boxes in the small window of OD which already displays 6, 8 icons total for OD instead of 7 ...
- A tool, this implies preferences more complicated for this tool.

But in any case, it is not enough to create tools, they must be usable. This entails adding more and more possibilities in WD (which is very complicated already already) and can be to develop a plugin to get to communicate with a radar.

It takes a lot of work.

[NAV]

Gilletarom,

For some readable information on Parallel Indexing using radar, see pages 167/181 of Chapter 4 of "Radar Navigation and Maneuvering Board Manual", which is downloadable here:
https://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/S...RNM/310ch4.pdf