Win10 updates overheat Old Laptop?

[rgleason]

Problem: Intermittant Freezeups (5-10x's per day)
Issue: Difficulty determining what is causing it. Hardware or software?
Tried the following:
1. Cleanup registry and machine.
2. Update Windows 10, etc. There are reports of freeze ups due to Win10 updates.
3. Turn off as many startup programs as possible.
4. Remove all addons and extensions for Thunderbird and Firefox and reset Firefox, keeping my settings. There are reports that these can freezeup the computer. It did not seem to be the problem, however.

4. Remove as many old unused programs as possible to reduce CPU load.
5. Run Core Temp and HWmonitor to see what the temps are. Max was often up to 205 degF.
6. Try to figure out how to the get the fans to run more and start sooner, it was stopping and starting a lot, and not running continuous at different speeds.
7. Check Bios for the low speed fan startup setting, there was none.
8. Look into fan cooling pads.--Would rather not.
9. Considered taking apart the laptop for the 3rd time to clean and add new thermal transfer paste.
10. Turn off one of the GPU's to reduce heat preferably the onboard intel hdgraphics 3000. Have not figured that out yet.
11. Laptop has a 500gb SSD so that should have helped.
12. Read on line, this article gave a suggestion.
https://www.drivethelife.com/windows...ow-to-fix.html
13. Went into the power settings and found

• Min CPU power set to 100%
• Max CPU power set to 100%

I think this is totally wrong and don't know how it happened!
Set them to

• Min CPU power set to 90%
• Max CPU power set to 30%

Hasn't frozen up yet, but time will tell.
Havent' had to rewrite this either due to freezeup.


Who/What changed the settings? I think the fan is acting more sensibly and the core temps are much much better. TJ Max 100C and Cores are all pretty constant at 53decC to 68degC. (129F-163F)using less wattage.

I have about 78 "Service Host: _______" in Task Manager and most of them are using very little Memory & CPU resources. Is this normal for Windows 10? I used to get really picky about what loaded, but with Windows 10 I gave up keeping track.


Are there any other suggestions to improve this or identify conclusively?

[44'cruisingcat]

Windows 10 is a disgrace. Our old laptop died and we had to buy a new one with windows 10 on it.

We never use it. It's not useable. Except maybe as a heavyweight frizbee.

[Pete17C]

Do you have any applications or devices that are 'must have' and only available for Windows?

If not, give Linux a try. I set up dual boot (Win10/Linux) and will only use Win10 when there is something I just can't get done in Linux.

I've been using the Debian distro (figure I might as well, as it should help playing with my RaspberryPi, which uses a derivative of Debian) with the Cinnamon desktop (very similar to Win7). You can install to a bootable CD to give it a try.

There are some issues with non-free device drivers, but my printer, scanner, and camera were all supported out of the box.

https://www.debian.org/

[sailing727]

You may have already corrected this, but my similar issue with Win10 on a Toshiba Satellite was dust collecting in the CPU cooling passages. Once cleaned, freezes went away.

[Simi 60]

Time for Linux.
My old destined for the bin laptop has had a new lease of life since I put Linux mint on about 5 years ago.

If I ever had to go back to windows it would be win7 which was OK.

[hellosailor]

rg-
Was this laptop originally shipped with Win10? Did it have a logo-certified sticker on it saying it was intended for Win10? Or is it something you upgraded?
In which case, did you run the upgrade compatibility check tool first?

Did this laptop (especially since you mention GPUs) have any recalls or patches issued because of problems with the GPUs? I know there were a batch of Nvidia overheat problems about 6 years ago, "solved" by OS or BIOS patches that simply turned down the GPU clock speed. I'd wonder if those machines would have a special problem if Win10 ignored that "fix".

It might help to know what the laptop is, and whether it passes internal extensive diagnostics. A long time ago I had a Compaq with overheat issues, it turned out to be a defective internal heat pipe that had leaked out the coolant gas--but it took months for that problem to surface, it could have been co-incidental to all sorts of changes along the way, distracting from the real hardware failure.

[Pete17C]

hello sailor,

Do you have specifics (model #, processor, etc) on that compaq? I've never heard of a mass produced computer with anything but air cooling. Maybe some ducting, but nothing involving any gas.

If all you need are the basics, web browser, email, office suite (wp, ss, db, presentation and I'll throw in audio, video, image editing/playing) it's s all there in Linux.

/for free
//like in free speech
///and free beer 🍻

[rgleason]

Thank you all for the good suggestions. Sometimes these things are hard track down.

Dell Inspiron XPS 15 502L New April 2011 with Win8, compatibility test passed and upgraded to Win10 about 3 years ago I think, upgraded to 500gb SSD.

Ran Memory tests. Perhaps I should run the full set of Dell Diagnostics first. Thanks.

Nvidia Geforce 540M is no longer using Dell drivers, but an updated version from Nvidia that works with the current version of Win10. This is a good card.

Onboard Intel HD Graphics 3000 is working much better now with Intel updates, but it is pretty rudimentary for OpenGL. I should disable it.

I have run DataCAD software (Windows) for 32 years and am somewhat unwilling to give up this essential tool (my parallel rule, adjustable triangle and technical pen).

Dual boot may be an interesting solution.

Setting max power to 90% and min power to 30% helped. Just one freezeup this afternoon. I may have to disassemble, clean and add thermal paste again (third time).

Originally Posted by hellosailor

rg-
Was this laptop originally shipped with Win10? Did it have a logo-certified sticker on it saying it was intended for Win10? Or is it something you upgraded?
In which case, did you run the upgrade compatibility check tool first?

Did this laptop (especially since you mention GPUs) have any recalls or patches issued because of problems with the GPUs? I know there were a batch of Nvidia overheat problems about 6 years ago, "solved" by OS or BIOS patches that simply turned down the GPU clock speed. I'd wonder if those machines would have a special problem if Win10 ignored that "fix".

It might help to know what the laptop is, and whether it passes internal extensive diagnostics. A long time ago I had a Compaq with overheat issues, it turned out to be a defective internal heat pipe that had leaked out the coolant gas--but it took months for that problem to surface, it could have been co-incidental to all sorts of changes along the way, distracting from the real hardware failure.

[Capt.Don]

On my laptop, I went back to Windows 8.1. I tried Windows 10 and couldn't live with the constant updates. Windows 8.1 with Classic Shell menu seems good enough for the ship's laptop.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by Simi 60

Time for Linux.
My old destined for the bin laptop has had a new lease of life since I put Linux mint on about 5 years ago.

If I ever had to go back to windows it would be win7 which was OK.

+1 load a real OS and ditch MicroS**t! Its been garbage since its initial release and still is...cant escape bad "genetics".

[hellosailor]

Pete-
It was an old Compaq Armada (6400? 4800?) known for a collapsing keyboard, where the keys actually lowered down to allow the lid to close and make a thinner machine, but still have full keyboard travel when it was in use. A very high end Compaq machine at the time, which I think they acquired when they bought out the DEC brand, because my support was still with the DEC support crew. (Absolute aces.)
there are a lot of machines using passive gas cooling pipes on the market. Usually copper tubing with a refrigerant gas mis-called "freon" in it. The gas they use (and 3M makes at least one of the ones used in computers now) is like water at room temperature. It boils off the CPU, goes up through the tubing to a cooling plate, turns back into liquid and runs back to the CPU, all by thermal cycling. There's usually a cooling fan to help the cooling plate work under load. Nothing exotic.
Problematic in that sealed copper pipes tend to leak anyway, so a lot of companies don't want to use them--until gas/liquid cooling becomes necessary because of the heat loads and layout.
If all I needed was...Then I would have switched to Linux 40 years ago. Nice little OS after, uh, 60? years of enthusiasts trying to push it? (Or is that full UNIX?) but not the horse for my course.

rg-
THIRD time of cooling paste?? What on earth for? That should be once, very sparingly, and that's enough for forever. There's been a previous issue?
Every time I've dealt with Dell, since their first days, I am reminded of Inspector Clouseau. "Your dog bit me!" But that's not my dog. Dell has consistently proven to be a disappointment for me, either in price, service, or simply equipment. They've done some funky things over the years, and they have many fans--but also, many of us say "Dell hell!" and will never deal with them again.

[Hakan]

No solution but another experience:
I've Win10 on a couple of dated machines, see below.
Since XP Win10 is the best system. Works very good! For the Intel graphic 965 driver I've though used another than what's automatically installed.

HP Elitebook 8460p; 2011,
Lenovo R61i; 2007,
Lenovo R61; ~2007,
Compaq Pressario CQ62; rather new 2012.

[ranger58sb]

Originally Posted by rgleason

Thank you all for the good suggestions. Sometimes these things are hard track down.

Dell Inspiron XPS 15 502L New April 2011 with Win8, compatibility test passed and upgraded to Win10 about 3 years ago I think, upgraded to 500gb SSD.

Have you asked Dell?

-Chris

[hellosailor]

"Since XP Win10 is the best system."
I'd argue that. I've seen fully supported upgrades where Win10 locked the default programs and refused to let the user choose their own. And those regular rolling upgrades sometimes blow away to boot files on the hard drive--leaving a totally bricked system. Microsoft support can't even figure out how to resolve those, although apparently it is a simple re-pointing of the boot partition tables, and fortunately there are third party apps that can do that.
I've never seen Vista (NT6) or Win7 (6.1) trash a system the way that Win10 can and does. And I can't say that Win10 really outperforms them in most significant ways. even the much-hyped Edge Brower (one of the defaults that gets set whether you like it or not) has already been tombstoned, MS is dropping it as a failure and moving out of the browser business.

[Stu Jackson]

rg,



Too bad, too late with this nfo, which I learned right here on CF!!!, bless all your little computing hearts:


I learned to avoid prompts and auto-updates/upgrades (not!) to W10 on my cheapo Compaq plastic W7 laptop. There are two update files that come with W updates: 25994 and 303293 or similar numbers. I learned to never install those and to never set W updates to auto.


http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...-149627-2.html



I like W7, it runs my old MS programs (no cloud crap or yearly signups - yes I know about Open Office but my old Word 2000 still works for me) and I've set it up like XP so I can find my own stuff!


I too use Task Manager, do sometimes overheat, so just clean out the fan inlet and outlet. Don't blow too hard, it messes up the blades.