410: Cost of Refitting

[ArtM]

I'm looking for a source of information about the typical or likely cost of refitting a Lagoon 410.
This would be an ex-charter boat with unknown (as of now) maintenance history.

I'm thinking of the cost of replacing lines, sails, engine maintenance (if needed), other wear items, minor repairs, etc.

I don't really know the original quality of this equipment, or how much of it is likely to need replacement. I'm looking at several models from 2004-2006.

Maybe a rough guide as to what is likely to need replacement, what will soon need replacement/repair, and some rough costs?

I am handy, and willing to put in some weekend hours, but I'm not an nautical engineer and do not want a project.

[Alecadi]

By experience : there is no typical costs.. it depends of how far the Admiral would like you to go with the budget !!!
The last expense (so far) is a new stove oven and the Admiral was quite happy....

[Jolly Roger]

You are asking how long is a piece of rope? It is impossible to give an accurate estimate of any boat refit without first knowing roughly what needs doing. Some charter boats are well maintained by their companies, some are not. So engage a good surveyor to go over the vessel to find out what needs fixing. Then estimate the replacement parts costs and double it.

[ArtM]

I'm thinking of something like a spreadsheet that gives some rough numbers, or maybe a sample of the kinds of repairs/maintanance/upgrades that are likely to be required after a charter boat purchase.

Or maybe just something that shows the costs of making such repairs to a certain boat over a certain timespan.

Really, anything at all that would give a headstart over downloading a maintenance manual (if such a thing even exists), then compiling a list of crap I think would be broken down, then looking up a bunch of prices on the internet.

For example, I remember reading once that some ex-charter somewhere was going to need 50k in work. I don't know if that was an exaggeration, or a generalization based on some kind of experience, or if this particular boat was particularly beat up.

My basic assumption is that, given the boat is 6 years old, probably everything that CAN be worn out after 6 years IS worn out, and will need replacement or repair. I'm just trying to figure out how extensive that list of things is that CAN be worn out.

Also, maybe a list of cruiser "must-haves" that a charter boat is not likely to have.

[ArtM]

To put it a different way, what are the likely deferred maintenance items that a charter company would otherwise have taken care of, but will allow to slide during the sunsetting process.

[barnakiel]

List the things that need replacement/refit and ask quotes from companies that you are going to employ. Put an overhead on the figure - many companies tend to under-quote.

You can get a very rough (say +/- 50%) estimate by listing the issues and finding their replacement cost on the web. This is as good a starting point as any, if you are very early in the project (e.g. before the boat has been bought).

Good luck with your project,
Cheers,
b.

[BambooSailor]

There is no universal answer. Cost of refit will heavily depend on what equipment you want to replace/update/add, based on your goals and plans with your boat. For just cruising around Caribbean, you may do well with boat as is, while if you want to go around the world, you may need to invest heavily. The cost of proper/deferred maintenance can differ between charter companies and which base a boat was/is located in. It will also depend on where you want to do the refit. As an example, when we were considering refit of our former charter L410S2, we figured out that it would be cheaper to transfer her from Caribbean to Seattle (at the cost of almost $24k) than to do the refit in Caribbean (we are still working fulltime). We put another $40k+ in material/equipment in last two years. And we have highest discount account with Port Supply (West Marine) and other local merchants (Fisheries, etc.) - sometimes as much as 70% of their regular prices. We did all our work ourselves. Labored for at least 2000 hours (yes, our lives have not been resembling anything normal for these last 2+ years...). It would cost us 2-4 times more if we hired contractors, though admittedly, professionals would work much faster than we did. If interested, look at our blog (svbluelagoon.blogspot.com) for list of improvements we made (this is a preliminary version prior to putting our boat on market).
So, in other words, you can spent only very little, which for good boat with good charter company with good phase-out program from good base can be close to $0, to easily double the boat price.

[ArtM]

$40k - in line with the $50k number I previously heard.

Not excited to hear that you were able to save more than $24,000 by moving the boat nearly halfway around the world.

Was that just repair/maintenance, or was that a total refit with your own list of preferred equipment, accessories, add-on, etc?

I'm planning to keep this boat stock (for now) and add on accessories as my needs grow. I have an eventual plan to do some global cruising, but that is some years off, and very likely may include a model/year upgrade.

[sww914]

We spent as much on the refit as we did on the boat, and that was with as much used stuff as possible. For instance, we paid $250.00 for a used 12" chartplotter rather than $3000.00 and we paid about $300.00 for a used SSB/ tuner instead of $4000.00 for the one that I wanted. The rub is that our boat sat neglected for almost 8 years and NOTHING worked when we started. 6 months of 6-7 days a week and we're cruising.

[ArtM]

Thanks for that info. This seems to be common. I've been a little distressed by the huge variation in costs between apparently similar boats, and attributing to owner-inflation, but it seems that the cost of the hull truly is the smallest part.

After hearing stories like these, it seems more and more reasonable that one boat costing $80k more than another might be the better deal, despite the higher price.

[timbenner]

ArtM,

The first question that I have is are you are going to use the boat as an "Owner's Boat" OR place the boat in charter?? If you're buying the boat to put in charter, you're going to do the minimum to keep it floating, with the least stuff on board for the customer to break.

If you're buying the boat to live aboard or use it as a part time live aboard, then you have a very different situation. Assuming that this is the case, don't buy a used charter boat. Buy a used Owner boat, that already has all of the stuff you'll want (not necessarily need). It will save you a great deal of money, time and effort and you'll get it all at a huge discount. Yes, you'll have to work harder looking, there are less of them, but it will be worth it. And yes it will cost $50,000, $75,000 or maybe more for the same year charter boat, but you'll get $100,000, $150,000 or more of stuff and it's already installed! Not to mention lower engine hours and the constant love and care of the previous owner. If you fit this definition of "Owner", don't just focus on price, focus on what you're getting for the price. Be careful comparing to stripped down charter boats, although they do help drag the price of the Owner's boats down.

By stuff I mean: 3 air conditioning units, SSB radio, extra refrigeration/freezers, generator, inverter, down wind sails, custom built-ins, water maker, etc, etc, etc, HICK-UP - there went $100,000+