450: Purchasing and Commissioning

[Lucky Larry]

So far I've just been reading the posts in this thread and gleaning from all your experiences. We're the happy owners of hull #93. We got it pretty well loaded. I'm wondering if anyone here has replaced their main anchor. I'm looking at using the 55 pound Delta that came with it as a backup and hanging a Manson Supreme or Rocna as the primary. Both the Manson and Rocna web site sizing charts seem to indicate the next size up, which would be a 80 pound Manson or 73 pound Rocna.

Have any of you switched anchors yet? If so, to what and with what results.

[roetter]

Originally Posted by Lucky Larry

I'm wondering if anyone here has replaced their main anchor. I'm looking at using the 55 pound Delta that came with it as a backup and hanging a Manson Supreme or Rocna as the primary. Both the Manson and Rocna web site sizing charts seem to indicate the next size up, which would be a 80 pound Manson or 73 pound Rocna.

Have any of you switched anchors yet? If so, to what and with what results.

I had switched from my CQR-copy on my current 40' mono hull to a Manson Supreme of the same weight. While I dragged the CQR through many anchorages before it would set, the Manson always set within half a boat length, mostly even quicker.
It is very hard to plan your anchoring spot in a small or crowded anchorage when you have no idea when it will finally bite. Also very concerning whould the wind direction change, as a poorly resetting anchor may send you to the rocks.
My broker suggested a Delta 22kg anchor. I refused it and will get a Manson 36kg or Rocna 40kg (depends on what I can get and the price).

[DavefromNZ]

Our Lagoon 450 arrived in Auckland yesterday, so I can't wait to get out on the water. We have fitted a Spade anchor, not sure what weight.

I had a Rocna on my previous Bavaria 39 and (regardless of recent manufacturing issues) I would highly recommend this anchor. The Manson, Rocna and Spade all have a very similar design and so the way they work. The Rocna and Spade have had great write-ups in independent tests.

As to weight I had actually thought 25kg. My concern with a bigger weight anchor is the lifting power of the windlass? I have seen my windlass (1000w) on the Bavaria strain with a 20kg Rocna and 40m chain (in 40m water). How good is the Lagoon 450 windlass - 1700w?

Cheers
Dave

[roetter]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

Our Lagoon 450 arrived in Auckland yesterday, so I can't wait to get out on the water. We have fitted a Spade anchor, not sure what weight.

I had a Rocna on my previous Bavaria 39 and (regardless of recent manufacturing issues) I would highly recommend this anchor. The Manson, Rocna and Spade all have a very similar design and so the way they work. The Rocna and Spade have had great write-ups in independent tests.

As to weight I had actually thought 25kg. My concern with a bigger weight anchor is the lifting power of the windlass? I have seen my windlass (1000w) on the Bavaria strain with a 20kg Rocna and 40m chain (in 40m water). How good is the Lagoon 450 windlass - 1700w?

Cheers
Dave

Hi Dave

Interesting - you switched from a Bavaira Cruiser 39 to the L450. I am just selling my Bavaria Vision 40 and getting my L450 in April. I was trying to get the Rocna for the Bavaria, but my chandlery did not carry it, so I got the Manson instead.

Have fun taking her out. I am just doing number of short good bye trips with my Bavaria.

[DavefromNZ]

Hi Roetter,

I loved my Bavaria, great boat. However an 11 month old daughter changed my thinking and I really didn't want the rock and roll of a keeler.

Since making the mental switch to a big Cat and having done a bit of reading I think this is going to be a fantastic change for the better in almost all respects; Safety, stability, speed, space....

Cheers
Dave

PS and I can party with 29 others on the L450, not so easy to do on a 40ft keeler! (just need a lot more lifejackets!)

[roetter]

Same here. Sometimes I hope my Bavaria will not sell.

My change reason was my wife. I wanted to go offshore, but she said, you can take the boat across oceans and I fly there. She just hates heeling. It is okay if it is steady, but when it gets gusty or when we are not reefed enough and the toe rail goes under, then she gets really scared. I also realized that living on an angle for days at a time is not fun. Since we wanted to go for at least a year a more comfortable boat was important for us.

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by roetter

Same here. Sometimes I hope my Bavaria will not sell.

My change reason was my wife. I wanted to go offshore, but she said, you can take the boat across oceans and I fly there. She just hates heeling. It is okay if it is steady, but when it gets gusty or when we are not reefed enough and the toe rail goes under, then she gets really scared. I also realized that living on an angle for days at a time is not fun. Since we wanted to go for at least a year a more comfortable boat was important for us.

The single most often relayed reason for the change given, i said to my wife it's time to go back sailing as the kid's are all grown up and have left the nest.
She started searching the web and found Leopard Cats and said if we buy one of these then count me in!!!!!
We progressed to a Lagoon and are doing it together, life is good!!!!!! Cheers Frank

[AngeW]

Originally Posted by Kinch

I think what I would have loved to get, before the D-delivery date, is a more detailled preview of the most complex equipments on board. Anything that would help to get ready with the relevant questions while you have the guy with all the answers.
If I was in charge of cutomer relation, I'd play it way more 'web 2.0', by getting all the docs public, and by publicly sharing tips & tricks to improve both the product and the customer satisfaction. From my standpoint, a brand that imagine avoiding customer resentment, just by cutting its communication lines, is just really hidding its head in the sand.
We know that's not exactly Lagoon's views, at least in this thread - bear in mind that for 10 customers sharing their experiences, there will be 10 disatisfied for every satisfied one.
Anyway ...
I have tried to collect most manuals and docs attached to my Lagoon 450 systems. I have attached to this msg the list of these docs. It includes the Lagoon 450 owner's manual, both in french and in english.
I don't think there is any 'doc sharing' around here, but I'd be happy to built one somewhere (Dropbox for instance) and invite anyone who'd like to access these.

Hi Kinch

I'm not sure if you've found your way to the Lagoon Catamaran Owners group on Yahoo, but there is a place for document and image sharing there. Its a bit limited in terms of file architecture, but the sharing and information from other owners is in my mind invaluable - people put up information about modifications etc. I agree totally about the Web 2.0 approach and how useful it would be. I'd love to share what I've been learning and glean from others, as we are all figuring out stuff around new technology and the marine environment.
I've used Evernote a lot for our upcoming trip planning - saving information I find into various notebooks. I've seen a few wikis around, but they seem to be suffering from a lack of buy-in.

cheers, Ange

[DavefromNZ]

Just a heads up that after tracking down our third fresh water system leak I discovered that all, yes all, of the John Guest speed connectors in that compartment were less than even finger tight at the threaded part. Will have to check the whole yacht and there are lots of speed fittings. I suggest any Lagoon owner reading this may wish to check their own.

[careka]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

Just a heads up that after tracking down our third fresh water system leak I discovered that all, yes all, of the John Guest speed connectors in that compartment were less than even finger tight at the threaded part. Will have to check the whole yacht and there are lots of speed fittings. I suggest any Lagoon owner reading this may wish to check their own.

First i did when i got the boat in Sable d-olonnes
Went over every hose, every thing that had a hose clamp on it and did give all a bit more force.
Found only one leak and it was on the heat system (watherheater under the sink in the gally) it was a bit loos and was leaking.

And now 1 year later i have done it again, and it looks good. now.
Tha factory do not give them much force. (if that is the right word to use )

[D&D]

Originally Posted by DavefromNZ

the John Guest speed connectors

Please excuse our ignorance, but what are these 'speed connectors'? What do they do and what do they look like?

We are now >1yr on our L440 with quite a few miles and no fresh water leaks -- salt water leaks is another tale! -- so perhaps we managed a vessel with reasonably tight connectors, but we'd like to check anyway...

[D&D]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

We progressed to a Lagoon and are doing it together, life is good!!!!!! Cheers Frank

Ditto Frank...and cheers to you too!!

[DavefromNZ]

The Lagoon 450 has probably 50 to 80 of the John Guest Speedfit type connectors in the water system, search google or this link:

John Guest Speedfit - The World Leader in Push-fit Fittings, Pipe and Plastic Plumbing Systems - Plumbing Fittings

They are very good and easy to fit and adapt. But do need to be fitted correctly.

[roetter]

We have been now been in Les Sables d'Olonne for over 2 weeks working on our L450, called Next Life. We have now installed our 5 Kyocera KD190 panels for a total of 950 Watt. They are connected in series delivering a maximum of 118V at 8.06A. They are feeding into an Outback Flexmax 80 with a Mate remote.

On the first day of operation we had a stormy day with a mix of sun and cloud. The boat was facing south on the dock, so the panels were partially shaded the full day by the mast and boom. Nevertheless, we measured 218Ah going into the batteries. A great result.

We chose to install them attached to the cockpit roof, extending it further aft. They are not visible from the salon, and barely noticeable form the cockpit sitting area. From the fly bridge they look great. Additional windage should be minimal. All the frame material to support the panels weighs less than 50kg. We have plenty of rain here and the extra rain protection they provide for the cockpit is great.

We had several of the local shops come by and check them out. Robin Marine, a local installer of electrical equipment commented on the nice design. I am sure the local fabricators will copy the design.

[careka]

you do have some angel on them, so the rainwater do leave the panels, if not they will get very dirty, and it is also not so good when you get home and get snow and ice on them.
But it sure do look like a good place to put them. and a real power bank.