600v MPPT Solar Charge Controller

[PacificGreen]

Here we can examine the suitability of TriStar MPPT 600V - Morningstar Corporation and specifically TS-MPPT-60-600V-48-DB relating to solar panel installations on boats.

This charge controller is 97.3 efficient and it solves many combiner box installation requirements when having more than three paralleled solar panels thus requiring over current protection.

The ability to create one large series array and then connect directly to the charge controller with a built in disconnect box is an interesting concept but is it technically possible or prudent in a marine environment?

A good understanding of the TS-MPPT-60=600v-48-DB is found in the manual here: https://www.wholesalesolar.com/cms/m...1016869075.pdf

In terms of an installed system it would look like this:

String Calculator » Morningstar Corporation

vs:

String Calculator » Morningstar Corporation

The later example is what I currently run with a standard (shunting charge controller) so neither pwm or mppt.

Being able to realize more power from the solar array in a more efficient manner is the goal. Some consideration to the installation of the 600v charge controller must be given:

A) Is another external 50amp 600v DC Disconnect Box required.
B) Will the acquisition make the panels more efficient.
C) Grounding the TS-MPPT-60-600v-48-DB to ABYC E-11 standards
D) Implementation of a GFPD required or not

There are various similarities between this model and other models of MorningStar Products. Has anyone installed this model on a boat? What are the thoughts of others using similar MorningStar products on a boat?

[offpist]

The morningstar mppt 60 can already take 150V.
This is usually more than enought..

[PacificGreen]

Originally Posted by offpist

The morningstar mppt 60 can already take 150V.
This is usually more than enought..

Relating to my panels connected in series at 39.8Voc each I can only connect three panels to one of these typical 150voc limited controllers. If you look at the string configuration links you can see the specifications of my panels and certainly why I would be interested in exploring a 600v solar charge controller.

[StuM]

It's probably worth pointing out that the OP has converted a catamaran to EP and has a huge solar array. His use case is not applicable to the vast majority of forum members.

I doubt that anyone else reading here needs a 600V controller.

[smac999]

600v dc would probably be super deadly....

also series panels work way worse in partial shade then parallel. which is normally what happens on boats.

[offpist]

I get that this is an big system but the mppt 60 can handle it at 48V. We have 9.8KW on-grid system on our house and i installed it all myself. But I would not like to have close to 500V DC in an boat.

We have 2 sunpower 235W 60V panels and morningstar mppt 60 on the boat. Tried both series and paralell with added shading and paralell came out best.

[PacificGreen]

Originally Posted by offpist

I get that this is an big system but the mppt 60 can handle it at 48V. We have 9.8KW on-grid system on our house and i installed it all myself. But I would not like to have close to 500V DC in an boat.

We have 2 sunpower 235W 60V panels and morningstar mppt 60 on the boat. Tried both series and paralell with added shading and paralell came out best.

I agree the tristar 60 can handle it for sure but I still end up with the same wiring configuration which then leads me to have a combiner box on the roof of the catamaran which I'm trying to redesign around.

My understanding is that if running 3 or more parallel groups of panels it is required to have over current protection on each current producer.

So far I've looked at individual MC4 in line fuse holders. Does anyone use these. This seems easy to do.

Then I could just do away with the combiner box entirely and just keep my 50 amp breaker disconnect and know that every group of two panels is protected.

Otherwise when installing these Tristar 60's I'm confused by the manual in regards to GFPD and wanted to ask others if they actually installed a GFPD as the manual states and how they worked out their ground with them.

Also in terms of Combiner boxes which one should I use? One for two strings or six strings? There are various models out there on Ebay that I'm interested in. This one seems to have it all:

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Safe-6-String...IAAOSw44BYPnEF

Or should I get something like this:

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Solar-Combine...AAAOSwTapV4dWQ

That is if I keep the same 2 string 6 parallel configuration, which is likely.

Also http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/...come-dangerous

Seems like a good read.

[masonc]

I have one out the Morningstar 600v CC units on my house. Be aware that they are noisy, the FETs make a loud switching sound. If you do buy, get the model with the disconnect.
I would be wary of 600v on a boat, especially if you ground the negative. The potential for tracking would be very high. We do a lot of 1,000V solar installations but the conductors are not ground referenced.
I suggest multiple CCs, one per string, for redundancy.

[smac999]

Originally Posted by PacificGreen

I agree the tristar 60 can handle it for sure but I still end up with the same wiring configuration which then leads me to have a combiner box on the roof of the catamaran which I'm trying to redesign around.

My understanding is that if running 3 or more parallel groups of panels it is required to have over current protection on each current producer.

So far I've looked at individual MC4 in line fuse holders. Does anyone use these. This seems easy to do.

.

it would depend on total draw. the issue is the panels with 10awg should not have a fuse bigger then ~30a or be able to see more then 30a. I think you mentioned you have a 50a breaker at the bottom, so right now your panels with 10awg wire is protected by a 50a breaker which is not correct. if one of those panel wires shorted. if you had a 30a breaker between battery and controller and the total current of all panels didn't exced 30a you could have as many panels as you want. the number wouldn't matter. 3 big ones or 10 small ones. but obviously once you exceeded 30a to the batteries it's not a good solution. if you want a 50a breaker at the bottom then each panel would need a smaller one up top when the big wire (rated for 50a+ split into the smaller panel wires. because if you panels can produce 50a of current, and one of the 10awgs up top shorted. those ~50a from remaining panels are going through that 10awg to ground. which will melt it.

if you have 25a of producing panels and one shorted. you have 25a flowing through 10awg wire and nothing happens. other then lost charging.

if you had two 30a controllers at the bottom and ran the panels in 2 strings then you woudn't need any fusing above deck.

maybe there is a house code that says 3 but there is no code on boats....

[PacificGreen]

Starts to research small efficient mppt controllers. Much appreciate the input/solutions.

Hmm, I've been there before with smaller controllers:

My Voc for a single panel is 39.8voc.

I give. Which is the best combiner box to get from the couple I mentioned.

[offpist]

Instead of having the combiner box on the roof you could pull 6 pairs of cables from the roof down to the charger. This will enable you to have everything inside and it does not have to be waterproof.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by PacificGreen

So far I've looked at individual MC4 in line fuse holders. Does anyone use these. This seems easy to do.

I have a MC4 fuse holder on my panels.

[DotDun]

Originally Posted by smac999

it would depend on total draw. the issue is the panels with 10awg should not have a fuse bigger then ~30a or be able to see more then 30a. I think you mentioned you have a 50a breaker at the bottom, so right now your panels with 10awg wire is protected by a 50a breaker which is not correct. if one of those panel wires shorted. if you had a 30a breaker between battery and controller and the total current of all panels didn't exced 30a you could have as many panels as you want. the number wouldn't matter. 3 big ones or 10 small ones. but obviously once you exceeded 30a to the batteries it's not a good solution. if you want a 50a breaker at the bottom then each panel would need a smaller one up top when the big wire (rated for 50a+ split into the smaller panel wires. because if you panels can produce 50a of current, and one of the 10awgs up top shorted. those ~50a from remaining panels are going through that 10awg to ground. which will melt it.

if you have 25a of producing panels and one shorted. you have 25a flowing through 10awg wire and nothing happens. other then lost charging.

if you had two 30a controllers at the bottom and ran the panels in 2 strings then you woudn't need any fusing above deck.

maybe there is a house code that says 3 but there is no code on boats....

1) ABYC rates 10awg @ 60a (105°C insulation) in a single conductor installation (i.e. MC4).

2) Fusing above deck protects the wire above deck (i.e., wires run thru metal tubes of a bimini top, etc.)

[PacificGreen]

So to do it right each series of 2 panels should have a 10amp fuse because they all end up paralleled at the combiner and this offers protection for each current producing wire.

Looks like I'll have to order the eco-worth box.

[foufou]

As Dotdun explained 50 amps will not melt 10awg wire. Might warm up a tad