Brand new Firefly batteries dead

[more]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

Firefly says not a valid warranty claim.

REturn your battery to shop where you bay. Simple say battery failure.
Trader/ if somebody asks you something you Answer
You/ battery failure please give me new set or repair this.
Trader/where you use battery
You/ battery failure please give me new set or repair this.
Trader/where you store a battery
You/ battery failure please give me new set or repair this under warranty.

Trader/What's your name
You/ battery failure please give me new set or repair this under warranty.

[smac999]

Who leaves a boat for 10 months? If you were not in town you should have paid someone to check on the boat every month. which would have including charging batteries each month if there are left connected.

Even disconnected they would have drained some over 10 months. But not to 0.

[stormalong]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

I’m just trying to get an idea as to what happened. If I do any blaming I’d like to have more information thus my original post.
Firefly says not a valid warranty claim.

Originally Posted by Valmika

Good to know about Firefly. I was actually thinking of looking at them based on another post. I have never had a problem with my West Marine AGM where they didn't honor a warranty

No battery manufacturer would honor a warranty claim under these circumstances. The batteries did not just die, they were murdered.

[Maine Sail]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Just because a load stops “running” that doesn't mean it stopped drawing power.

Your batteries should be under warranty.

Battery warranties do not cover abuse. Leaving batteries connected to the vessel for 10 months, with no charging, is abuse/neglect not a warranty situation.

[Redline452]

Are the bilge pumps mechanically switched , or do they have electronic water sensors or off-delay timers? Either of the latter would have a small current draw when idle.
In addition to the analog meter, would explain the draw down to zero.

Also FWIW, though not likely a factor here, many electronic switching-type power supplies will draw constant power, not current, so at lower voltage the input current will actually increase - they are NOT resistive loads.

[Pete7]

I feel the OPs pain and having to write another cheque for the replacements. However, he is not alone.

Here is a set of LifePO4 that went south over 7 months, all down to a little LED on each cell

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j0zcRXTDRk&t=1326s

[BillKny]

Just for reference, I have had warranty claims with Firefly--twice. In each case they were helpful, and stood by their product. In fact they were more generous than the official written warranty policy would have allowed them to be.

They worked with me to try to understand WHY there was an issue. I found it impressive that even after they committed to a payout, they worked to extract as much technical data from the problem as possible. The warranty was not treated simply as a cost of doing business, but an opportunity to learn.

[AlanR]

Quite a small and inexpensive solar panel would keep your batteries charged, if properly connected.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by smac999

Who leaves a boat for 10 months.

Well thread drift

But word out is that Florida yards are currently full of Canadian owner boats no one has visited in over a year and that were put away fast without the owners thinking they weren't going to get back to for so long.

[NPCampbell]

I would expect a 0.75 watt load + 10 months of 2.5% monthly self discharge to burn past the 10.5V level with 700AH of batteries and take it all the way down to 0V.

I've run into this so many times with winterized cars that I now use a cheap 10 watt solar panel sitting on the dashboard plugged into the cigarette lighter. The batteries are typically at 100% come spring.

[Martkimwat]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

Yes all 6 batteries showed 0 volts and tried to recondition the batteries per
Ocean Planet recommendations with no success. Batteries will not hold a charge.
So what parasitic load will draw batteries to 0 volts? Most electronics stop working long before batteries reach 0 volts. I think even an electric motor will stop turning long before 0 volts are reached. A lot of difference between a 10.5 volt flat battery and one of 0 volts.

Even though an electric motor won't turn at below it's operating voltage it will still be pulling a load from the batteries. may I ask, are you using smart bilge pumps like Rule pumps? They pulse for a second every five minutes and if that pulse detects water, they will continue to run until the water has gone. May not sound much but over the period of time you are talking about, along with the high self discharge in high temperatures, could well be enough to take the batteries to 0 volts.

[freshalaska]

I couldn’t get to the boat because of Covid. I did have someone hired to monitor the boat but for some unknown reason he never did his job as promised. When I finally got someone aboard batteries where at 0 volts as measured across the terminals.
The bilge pumps all had float switches and a clamp meter showed no current.

[Mike Banks]

Well, the batteries are not "Brand New: they are at least 12 months old, "Unused" would be a better description.

When all else fails, if you are stuck with them, you may be able to resurrect some of these batteries by connecting a 24 volt charger across the terminals in parallel with a 24 volts headlamp. The headlamp will draw enough current to operate the charger, and the extra volts will force some current through the dead battery.

Every now and then disconnect the battery and test it--when the measured no-load volts exceed nine volts, your ordinary 12 volts charging system will operate and take it from there.

Worth a try--but you need 24 volts initially. That will get something happening--but if all you get is the stench of H2S, then I think it is time to cast some more diving weights.


This might also be of some interest:

https://www.thebackshed.com/forum/up..._gelcell_2.pdf

[BillKny]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

I couldn’t get to the boat because of Covid. I did have someone hired to monitor the boat but for some unknown reason he never did his job as promised. When I finally got someone aboard batteries where at 0 volts as measured across the terminals.
The bilge pumps all had float switches and a clamp meter showed no current.

It should be obvious, but probably needs saying anyway....

If the batteries are at 0 volts even a dead short would draw ZERO current.

Is your clamp meter really sensitive enough to measure 10 or 50 milliamperes?

[mlydon]

That guy killed your batteries dead - that really, really sucks. $3000 sucks.
But unfortunately he killed them. Absolutely all the wrong things to do for battery care. Just about the opposite of every best practice, in fact. You’ll need to start over, presumably wiser. I feel for you. I suppose you could sue the guy, if he’s got any money, to make restitution.

Matt