Brand new Firefly batteries dead

[freshalaska]

I installed a brand new set of six 12 volt Firefly Oasis batteries in parallel and left them fully charged without any additional charging source and 3 bilge pumps hooked up to the batteries. The boat is on the hard and very little chance of the bilge pumps cycling as almost no water can get into the boat. Nothing else except a analogue volt meter are hooked to the batteries. Batteries where left for around 10 months with no charge source and in Florida heat. I do have sun shield screen over the entire boat but would think temps could get over 80 degrees f.
So my question is how could the set of six brand new batteries all go to 0 volts dc ? Even a bilge pump will stop drawing long before batteries would go anywhere near 0 volts. Is this an indication of a battery failure? That pulls down the rest of the batteries?
I’ve never seen a battery down to 0 volts before, have you and why.
Thanks everyone for any input you can provide in my understanding what happened.

[Maine Sail]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

I installed a brand new set of six 12 volt Firefly Oasis batteries in parallel and left them fully charged without any additional charging source and 3 bilge pumps hooked up to the batteries. The boat is on the hard and very little chance of the bilge pumps cycling as almost no water can get into the boat. Nothing else except a analogue volt meter are hooked to the batteries. Batteries where left for around 10 months with no charge source and in Florida heat. I do have sun shield screen over the entire boat but would think temps could get over 80 degrees f.
So my question is how could the set of six brand new batteries all go to 0 volts dc ? Even a bilge pump will stop drawing long before batteries would go anywhere near 0 volts. Is this an indication of a battery failure? That pulls down the rest of the batteries?
I’ve never seen a battery down to 0 volts before, have you and why.
Thanks everyone for any input you can provide in my understanding what happened.

Hard lesson learned.. If storing the boat in warm weather the batteries should ideally be removed from the vessel. In cold weather they can be left on-board but should be 100% disconnected from the vessel and each other. The combo of parasitic loads and heat lead to much faster self discharge than parasitic loads and cold but any parasitic load left for 12 months is not good.

For storage, disconnect them from each other (if in parallel) and the vessel. A battery failure is typically one bad cell. Parasitic loads cause 0.00V..

[sailorboy1]

All are 0 volts using a held held meter?

I would start by disconnecting them from each other and recharging and see if they hold voltage.

I would also call/connect Ocean Plant Energy about them https://oceanplanetenergy.com/advanc...asis-group-31/

[freshalaska]

Yes all 6 batteries showed 0 volts and tried to recondition the batteries per
Ocean Planet recommendations with no success. Batteries will not hold a charge.
So what parasitic load will draw batteries to 0 volts? Most electronics stop working long before batteries reach 0 volts. I think even an electric motor will stop turning long before 0 volts are reached. A lot of difference between a 10.5 volt flat battery and one of 0 volts.

[BillKny]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

Yes all 6 batteries showed 0 volts and tried to recondition the batteries per
Ocean Planet recommendations with no success. Batteries will not hold a charge.
So what parasitic load will draw batteries to 0 volts? Most electronics stop working long before batteries reach 0 volts. I think even an electric motor will stop turning long before 0 volts are reached. A lot of difference between a 10.5 volt flat battery and one of 0 volts.

You are correct in assuming that a motor will stop turning before 0 volts but that does NOT mean that current flow stops. Even without turning, it will continue to draw power right on down to 0.0 volts.

While there is a lot of VOLTAGE difference between a 10.5 volt battery and a 0 volt one, there is actually very little energy difference. That's why a 10.5V battery is consider practically dead!

You have a 684 Amp Hour battery bank you left unattended, uncharged--but connected--for 10 months (10*30*24 = 7200 hours) 684 Amp-hours / 7200 hours = an average draw of just 0.1 Amps. to draw it down dead.

That's a really tiny amount of current, and could be ANYTHING, even just a stray current your bonding system.

This is not a battery problem, this is a battery management problem. Do not blame the batteries, look in the mirror.

[sailorboy1]

Just because a load stops “running” that doesn't mean it stopped drawing power.

Your batteries should be under warranty.

[freshalaska]

I’m just trying to get an idea as to what happened. If I do any blaming I’d like to have more information thus my original post.
Firefly says not a valid warranty claim.

[Valmika]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

I’m just trying to get an idea as to what happened. If I do any blaming I’d like to have more information thus my original post.
Firefly says not a valid warranty claim.

Good to know about Firefly. I was actually thinking of looking at them based on another post. I have never had a problem with my West Marine AGM where they didn't honor a warranty

[lvictorlucas]

0.1 Amps is just 1.2 Watts, be sure to check the parasitic draw after installing the new batteries. This might just be the battery monitor ir one of the cheap bilge pumps that cycle and monitor the current draw.

"This is not a battery problem, this is a battery management problem. Do not blame the batteries, look in the mirror."

Great answer, Just what I was about to write.

[zstine]

Did you say there was an analog volt meter connected to the batteries for 10 months? That alone could have easily discharged your batteries. Analog volt meters typically use an electromagnet coil to move the needle and will continuously draw current.

[lvictorlucas]

Originally Posted by zstine

Did you say there was an analog volt meter connected to the batteries for 10 months? That alone could have easily discharged your batteries. Analog volt meters typically use an electromagnet coil to move the needle and will continuously draw current.

Good point.

[oleman]

Battery powered system that sit for long durations should probably have a total battery disconnect switch which will eliminate parasitic loads that you could overlook. The battery monitors should be powered off for idle systems because it is a parasitic load. Analog volt meters OFF, cheap ones could be drawing a few MA just to indicate voltage. 50 micro amp meters are probably not an issue BUT I would still keep them on the off side of the disconnect switch.

Our old boat uses 24 VDC, 2 group 8D batteries for starting and 4 group 31 for house just too much effort to remove and bring home, so the battery disconnect is the solution for us. The genset is on own battery and currently has no disconnect but it should probably have a disconnect installed.

[noelex 77]

0v is unusual. Are you absolutely sure there is not a blown main use or loose connection?

Measure at the battery terminals to check, and cross your fingers .

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by freshalaska

I’m just trying to get an idea as to what happened. If I do any blaming I’d like to have more information thus my original post.
Firefly says not a valid warranty claim.

FYI:

The a limited warranty on the Firefly provides guarantees against defects in material and/or workmanship under normal use from date of purchase.

As others have stated this is not a battery product issue, rather it is a battery management and neglectful use issue.

No warranty claim is valid for this circumstance.

Purchase new batteries and then use them properly.

[Montanan]

Further FYI.

A continuous draw of .1 amperes is a very significant flow for a chemical energy system.

An ampere is a flow of 6,242,000,000,000,000 electrons per second.

0.1 ampere is a flow of 624,200,000,000,000 electrons per second.