Electrical connectors. Which ones ???????

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

...Why doesn't the marine industry make more use of cap splices?




It's just one crimp, it's easier to connect multiple wires of differing diameters; they are all in contact with each other if you twist the wires together before inserting and crimping. You can visually confirm that the wires are through the ferrule before crimping. Easy to seal up afterwards; just squirt sealant into the one open end.

They're already approved by many standards bodies including UL. You see them a lot inside appliances for AC connections.

Anyway, just wondering.

One reason is that they are very hard to seal to the wire.

[Dockhead]

I use Molex Permaseal connectors, with a Swedish Pressmaster self-adjusting crimping tool.



The connectors (and the tool) are painfully expensive, but the results are excellent.



I think sealing the connections is essential even if the wire and connector are tinned. Otherwise, salt air will get at the copper eventually.


For any connection which is at any risk of being splashed by sea water (nav lights e.g., or any connections inside the anchor locker), I add additional sealing in the form of heat shrink tubing and/or self-amalgamating tape.


I arrived at this practice after repeatedly redoing connections done to a lesser standard.


Doing electrics right isn't really rocket science, but requires a patient, methodical, systematic approach, and don't try to save money on the materials.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by CaptnBry

Proffesional electricians do not solder or recommend it. This must be because it takes so much time and expertise to do it correctly. The USAF has an excellent method, and that is what ive used on my boat for over two decades without corroded terminals on the ocean. Its slow, requires wicking control, thorough cleaning and sealing the results permanently. if you want the best, that's it.

I don't think it's because it is so hard to do a good solder joint. Rather, it's because of this:


"Additionally, PS testing has confirmed that soldering increases corrosion and decreases fatigue resistance by making the wire stiffer." https://www.practical-sailor.com/mar...ctricalSystems


I'm an Extra Class radio amateur and know my way around a soldering iron. But I would never use a soldered joint for any power or sensor cable connection inside a sailboat. I do use them on coax and very fine electronic connections.



The corrosion can be managed, probably, but soldered joints, and any wire solder wicks up during the process, becomes brittle and subject to failure from fatigue or flexing. This is OK in static applications but not OK on a moving boat.


As Popular Sailor says, properly crimped joints are "the gold standard".

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by mrh123

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is support. Wire terminations often fail due to cyclic movement from vibration or in the case of a vessel, wave motion. Support your terminated wires in a loom with cable ties or spiral guard or similar and fix back to a bulkhead where possibke. This will greatly increase the life of any crimped or soldered joint.

Yes, crucially important on a moving vessel is strain relief. This should be done with fanatic attention to detail.


Don't count on good strain relief saving soldered joints, however. Even a well strain-relieved joint will have SOME movement when the boat is moving in a seaway.

[wingless]

Originally Posted by wingless

The usage of solder is acceptable on a boat.

The ABYC standard states: "Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit".

This reply shows how I use staggered, soldered, Western Union splices w/ strain relief. This soldered splice complies w/ ABYC standards.

Originally Posted by mrh123

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is support. Wire terminations often fail due to cyclic movement from vibration or in the case of a vessel, wave motion. Support your terminated wires in a loom with cable ties or spiral guard or similar and fix back to a bulkhead where possibke. This will greatly increase the life of any crimped or soldered joint.

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Yes, crucially important on a moving vessel is strain relief. This should be done with fanatic attention to detail.

Don't count on good strain relief saving soldered joints, however. Even a well strain-relieved joint will have SOME movement when the boat is moving in a seaway.

My linked reply shows a staggered, soldered and strain relieved Western Union splice that is acceptable for marine application.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by wingless

My linked reply shows a staggered, soldered and strain relieved Western Union splice that is acceptable for marine application.

To each his own.

But to me, and I guess to most professional electricians, Western Union splices on a boat are an abomination. You've relieved strain somewhat, but that will not eliminate stress on the joint completely. A large clump of twisted wires completely saturated with solder will be almost as brittle as glass. If something falls against that in a seaway, it will simply break. Also highly vulnerable in such a splice are the single wires just beyond the twist, which are invariably saturated with solder. That is the natural flex point, and where the connection will naturally break.

Compare and contrast the strain relief of a proper heat shrink crimp connector. Nothing brittle is exposed to any strain. The wires where they emerge from the crimp tube are strain protected by the stiff heat shrink tube. This is far superior.



Man, no offense, but those are some ugly joints! I'm not sure that's even an actual Western Union splice -- looks more like wires just twisted together. A Western Union splice looks like this:





Those big globs of solder in your joints speak to the clumsiness of their making, and to deep wicking of the solder far into the wire.



Lastly, Western Union splices should NOT be used with multstrand wire -- they are designed for solid, single-stranded conductors.


This is a train wreck of a joint; sorry.

[wingless]

Thanks for the helpful feedback.

Yes, it is only possible to perform a Western Union splice on a solid conductor wire, like the telegraph wires used in the mid 1800s. The Western Union splice provided both the mechanical strength and electrical continuity, able to be performed w/o tools, to fix broken wires in the air in the middle of nowhere.

There are zero solid conductor wires used in a marine application.

Those particular solder joints needed to be performed in the orientation and the location shown, with gravity pulling solder downward, causing the small bead at the bottom. Even with upholstery protection directly below, I was unwilling to flick that bead and potentially damage unprotected upholstery.

Yes, it is possible to envision failure scenarios "something falls against that", but that is not the requirement. "Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit."

The splice shown satisfies the requirement and has normal flexibility outside the strain relieved section.

Peace to you.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by wingless

Thanks for the helpful feedback.

Yes, it is only possible to perform a Western Union splice on a solid conductor wire, like the telegraph wires used in the mid 1800s. The Western Union splice provided both the mechanical strength and electrical continuity, able to be performed w/o tools, to fix broken wires in the air in the middle of nowhere.

There are zero solid conductor wires used in a marine application.

Those particular solder joints needed to be performed in the orientation and the location shown, with gravity pulling solder downward, causing the small bead at the bottom. Even with upholstery protection directly below, I was unwilling to flick that bead and potentially damage unprotected upholstery.

Yes, it is possible to envision failure scenarios "something falls against that", but that is not the requirement. "Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit."

The splice shown satisfies the requirement and has normal flexibility outside the strain relieved section.

Peace to you.


. . .

As I said, to each his own


One thing I can complement in that joint is the staggering. This is a good idea with crimped butt connectors as well. The advantage is that you can tightly cable tie an unspliced section of wire to the spliced part of the other wire -- it greatly improves strain relief and makes the whole spliced section more compact.

[thinwater]

A Western Union splices is NOT for stranded wire. I did a series of tests (published) for both soldered and non-soldered joints, and the western union was one of the worst methods in both cases. Just NOT a stranded wire method, ever.

I've run into four common failures:
* Small wires fractured at end of solder or crimp due to lack of strain relief.
* Various quick connects that were not sealed and/or packed with grease (and no, it is does NOT need to be dielectric grease unless very high voltage--waterproof grease is generally better for corrosion. Same goes with conductive grease--only very specific conditions, not found on a boat).
* Non-tinned wire in chronically wet areas.
* Loose terminal screws. Tight is important, and they can loosen. One of the most common causes is a shoelace ferrule that came off or soldering the end to stiffen it (the solder cold flows and loosens--it is poor practice and forbidden in some codes if the wire will be under a screw rather than a spring-loaded terminal).

I've done thousands of crimps and hundreds of soldered joints over a 35 year career. Many were for salt spray chamber testing--none failed. Loads of wire nuts and chock blocks. I don't remember any failures. Failure is nearly always the result of a basic failure in technique. Even non-tinned wire will last a darn long time if in a dry area or if the ENDS are in a dry area. Wire nuts (not on boats ) are taped for vibration and strain relief. Chock blocks must have pressure plates.

I like ratchet crimpers, mostly because they keep me honest when my hands get tired. I solder when it is the best solution, mostly for tiny stuff.

Just basics.

[wingless]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

One thing I can complement in that joint is the staggering. This is a good idea with crimped butt connectors as well. The advantage is that you can tightly cable tie an unspliced section of wire to the spliced part of the other wire -- it greatly improves strain relief and makes the whole spliced section more compact.

My joints are always staggered.

My experience on multiple splices on a single cable has me placing joints at three locations. As an example, if there are nine conductors in a spliced joint, they are not at the same location, causing a "snake that ate a rat" lump. Instead they are staggered at three locations, I usually offset by an inch, putting the joints at different locations.

Yes, all of my joints are always properly crimped (except the example shown) using high quality tooling and connectors, as shown in this reply, but the staggered, soldered and strain relieved joint shows it is possible to safely satisfy the requirements while using solder.

That joint has wire leaving the strain relief several inches away from the joint, so zero issue of wicking under the insulation making the wire stiff / brittle.

[s/v Jedi]

It doesn’t matter what you say or point out how wrong something is: most will just not open their eyes and fix mistakes. Often it’s also about new materials or techniques not being understood... like soldering is great but crimping not... often not realizing that the crimp is a cold weld

[wingless]

These images show / document what happens w/ a proper crimp joint.

[dicorenz]

Originally Posted by Cheechako

Good connectors will be tinned. They have a flat silver look to them, not shiny bright.
Best connectors are the ones with the built in heat shrink cover. It's better than common shrink tubing, and oozes out goo when heated. But they are expensive.

Have a good ratcheting crimper.
It's hard to go wrong with Anchor brand terminals.

Hi I'm a supplier of heat shrink wire connector, for easy installation, I suggest you use solder splice sleeve, no need to be crimped and low temperature to shrink. But it is not as strong as crimped splice connector in abrasion resistance. It depends on your purpose.