Fischer Panda 4200 Won’t Start

[jkishel]

The solenoid should not actuate on start. It should actuate only when the stop engine button is pressed. Disconnect the power to the stop solenoid and see if the engine starts. If it does, fix the solenoid circuit. The solenoid should move freely with no power applied to the circuit, is it stuck closed? If so, correct.

[skipperpete]

You probably already know this but its worth mentioning again , avoid overcranking with the raw water intake open, its possible to damage the engine.

[flightlead404]

Originally Posted by jkishel

The solenoid should not actuate on start. It should actuate only when the stop engine button is pressed. Disconnect the power to the stop solenoid and see if the engine starts. If it does, fix the solenoid circuit. The solenoid should move freely with no power applied to the circuit, is it stuck closed? If so, correct.

I believe this is incorrect. The solenoid opens when START is pressed and remains open until Off is pressed or the generator is shut down automatically. It is NC. Clearly stated in manual.

[flightlead404]

Finally back to this after having to make a quick trip away from the boat

Installed a NIB solenoid and bled the lines. Still no start. No sure where to go from here.

The primary use of the generator is to run it for a few hours every other day as my solar doesn’t keep up with my electric power consumption during the winter, even in the Keys.

I think my options are either a portable generator or using the engine. Im leaning towards a portable generator but don’t know much about them. How do I connect it? Via the shore power? Do I need special cables or adapters?

Any other thoughts appreciated

[team karst]

We did a honda2200 before the genset install. I ran a 1’ shore power cord to the existing 30A inlet. Amazon off the shelf cord. Gen sat on the sugar scoop well downwind. Try to avoid middle of nite refuels. They work in rainstorms too. Speaking of water, the carbs are a easy rebuild without parts if u catch the bowl corrosion soon enuf.

[flightlead404]

I’m going to keep adding to this thread as long as I’m working on it in case it helps someone else in the future

So in annoyance and desperation I started over verifying everything like fuel flow, air flow, etc. Pulled the valve cover to check valve clearance again and was surprised to find none on the intake side. Exhaust was dead nuts on, zero clearance on the intake side. That is, the adjuster was tight enough to hold the valve slightly open. That means insufficient compression. I readjusted it and guess what, it started right up. I ran it only a couple seconds shut down and did another restart. I did not run it longer because one of the copper sealing washers is not sealing and it is spraying a fine mist of diesel everywhere. New sealing washers here on weds

So how did this happen? I surmise that somehow some debris, carbon, something got onto the seat of the intake valve holding it open preventing compression and hence starting. Even though I “staked” the valves a couple of times it did not dislodge. The. I adjusted the valves, and since that valve was being held open by the debris I adjusted the valve too tight. The debris subsequently dislodged resulting in no clearance and a held open valve, which my final readjustment correctly allowing the generator to start.

I’ll have more confidence once I e run it a while, but I’m hopeful I have a temporary fix. May need to lap the valves when I’m home in the spring and have better tools. I’ll borescope it at least and take some pics.

[skipperpete]

Well, Kudos to “ Dirtpete” in post #6, he nailed in one short sentence.

[Pete7]

Good result, that saved a few dollars

[DirtPete]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

I’m going to keep adding to this thread as long as I’m working on it in case it helps someone else in the future

So in annoyance and desperation I started over verifying everything like fuel flow, air flow, etc. Pulled the valve cover to check valve clearance again and was surprised to find none on the intake side. Exhaust was dead nuts on, zero clearance on the intake side. That is, the adjuster was tight enough to hold the valve slightly open. That means insufficient compression. I readjusted it and guess what, it started right up. I ran it only a couple seconds shut down and did another restart. I did not run it longer because one of the copper sealing washers is not sealing and it is spraying a fine mist of diesel everywhere. New sealing washers here on weds

So how did this happen? I surmise that somehow some debris, carbon, something got onto the seat of the intake valve holding it open preventing compression and hence starting. Even though I “staked” the valves a couple of times it did not dislodge. The. I adjusted the valves, and since that valve was being held open by the debris I adjusted the valve too tight. The debris subsequently dislodged resulting in no clearance and a held open valve, which my final readjustment correctly allowing the generator to start.

I’ll have more confidence once I e run it a while, but I’m hopeful I have a temporary fix. May need to lap the valves when I’m home in the spring and have better tools. I’ll borescope it at least and take some pics.

Really glad this worked, usually does. Have fought the starting battle too many times with these units to not immediately check valves.

[flightlead404]

I got maybe 5-6 starts and maybe 5-6 hours run time before the generator would not start again. I will check the valves again and see if the same issue has reoccurred. I did read elsewhere (another thread here or another forum) about valves that “wouldn’t hold their adjustment). That seems odd to me, the nuts and threads on the adjuster on my unit were in excellent shape. But a valve seat rapidly disintegrating might have the same effect.

In the meantime I am scrambling to replace my house batteries because I believe I have trashed them by deeply discharging too many times based on this and a couple other events. Starting another thread on that.

[team karst]

Shoot. Disappointing news. Carbon to blame? I have no idea.

[flightlead404]

Disappointing yes. This cruise has been a nightmare. Instead of being relaxing I’ve suffered wrong water pump induced trashed cam gears and excessive overheat on my engine, generator failure, my mother died right after new year , my batteries died, and the genny dies again

Sometimes there isn’t enough beer….

On the other hand my wife keeps using phrases like “next year” and “next boat” so it’s not all bad I guess.

I’ll open it back up again again in the next few days and explore.

I did have a lovely sail downwind today in 10kts and my spinnaker deployed, gybed, and furled perfectly for the first time ever with zero cursing. Yay

[Scubaseas]

Originally Posted by flightlead404

I got maybe 5-6 starts and maybe 5-6 hours run time before the generator would not start again. I will check the valves again and see if the same issue has reoccurred. I did read elsewhere (another thread here or another forum) about valves that “wouldn’t hold their adjustment). That seems odd to me, the nuts and threads on the adjuster on my unit were in excellent shape. But a valve seat rapidly disintegrating might have the same effect.

In the meantime I am scrambling to replace my house batteries because I believe I have trashed them by deeply discharging too many times based on this and a couple other events. Starting another thread on that.

Or the valve seat sinking into the head... If they are indeed tight again I would be inclined to pull off the cylinder head.

Remember "Boats Suck" and B.O.A.T break out another thousand.
At least you solved the does it have fuel issue.
PM me for my phone number if you want to chat about your options. Been there done that. Just went through almost exactly the same thing recently on my boat and happy to share what little I know. Retired mechanic with some engineering knowledge.

At AGM to LFP versus deep cycle life and price per WH LFP wins BUT you need to change how your alternator charges your house bank.

Cheapy LFP works but to meet ABYC standard you need to be able to communicate with the cells on the LFP batteries. Bluetooth and a smart phone meets the requirement.

[flightlead404]

Well it was the exact same problem, but on the exhaust valve instead of the intake valve this time. Yes, I properly adjusted both valves last time. So, idk.

The ultimate answer is to pull the head and examine it, but I’d rather not on the hook with limited tools

[Scubaseas]

Boating is fun!!