Lifeline 8D AGM Age

[mojosailing]

I am close to purchasing a new (to me) sailboat that comes with 4 Lifeline 8D AGM batteries. They were installed in 2012. How long before they will need to be replaced? Boat has been used mostly in New England where she is now, on the hard for the winter. I plan on moving onto the boat this coming June-ish and moving to the Caribbean later in the year.
When should I expect to have to replace them? Or are they on borrowed time now?

[smac999]

Likly very soon. Depends how they were treated.

[a64pilot]

You should get 5 yrs out of Lifelines if you live aboard, On Solar, and get to 100% full charge at least weekly and equalize monthly.

Any less rigid a use than that should extend life, the key however is how often have they been honestly fully charged?
Have they ever been equalized? What means do you use now to determine their state of charge?

If you expect full time live aboard not in a Marina, then most likely a Lifeline isn’t the best choice, and then certainly not an 8D.

[john61ct]

Borrowed time for sure, likely only suitable for short hops between shore power sessions.

Lifeline is excellent, but 8D in general a poor format for value per Ah/year in true deep cycling use.

Quality FLA like Rolls Surrette, or maybe a half-dozen less pricey vendors, is better if you can keep the water up.

Depending on your Ah size needed, going to 6V or lower units is better than 12V ones. Not so heavy too.

In the end how well you care for the bank as per mfg specs, determines longevity just as much as size & model cells.

Abuse can kill a $3000 400Ah bank in a year or two, while a coddled $500 version can last a decade.

[mojosailing]

Thank you. If not 8D then what?
We don't have solar, we do have a genset.

[a64pilot]

Depends on how you want to go, the best bang for the buck is 6v golf cart batteries, they are true deep cycle and priced well.
If you really want to stay with Lifeline, I’d go with one of their 6V batteries.
These are the ones I use
https://lifelinebatteries.com/produc...eries/gpl-4ct/

But Lifeline batteries are very susceptible to partial charge cycling, they need to be fully recharged and while this is possible it’s tough on Solar alone, if you look at the full year. If not fully recharged at least once a week, they can be equalized and that will reduce sulphation, but it still cuts into their lifespan.
I strive and usually accomplish a full charge every day, but that takes at least 30 min generator run first thing in the morning during winter months.

Golf cart batteries are actually pretty resilient, and are priced at a fraction of Lifeline, so if you screw them up, it’s not nearly as expensive.

If you decide to stay with Lifeline, download and read their manual, it’s a very good manual, go through it a few times, really.

[sowwaninii]

I’ve had 3 210 ah Lifeline batteries as my house bank since 2011. I’ve rarely let them discharge below 50% and consistently charged them back to 100% with either genset or shore power. We live aboard 6-8 months a year and only now are they beginning to show their age. If you truly want to know their status, I would suggest running a load test per Lifeline’s manual. As others have said, really depends on how the batteries were treated.

[MJH]

Originally Posted by mojosailing

I am close to purchasing a new (to me) sailboat that comes with 4 Lifeline 8D AGM batteries. They were installed in 2012. How long before they will need to be replaced? Boat has been used mostly in New England where she is now, on the hard for the winter. I plan on moving onto the boat this coming June-ish and moving to the Caribbean later in the year.
When should I expect to have to replace them? Or are they on borrowed time now?

There is more to the expected life of batteries than their chemistry, i.e. AGM, GEL, FLA, etc. What are the rest of the electrical charging system components and were they installed when the batteries were new? Does the boat have a large charging requirement, i.e. refrigeration, etc.? Think of your electrical supply as a complete system and not just the battery chemistry; they each have pluses/minuses and the proper procedures to care for them. I replaced my two 8D GEL batteries this year and they were 15 years old.

Good Luck.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[sainted]

Lifeline makes the only decent AGM batteries on the market, especially in the 8D format. However, as others have said, it’s all about how they’ve been treated.

One good thing about the 8D format is that you can put three GC2 batteries in the same space. If you replaced all four 8Ds with 12 GC2s, you’ll have 50% more capacity in the same space. It can be a tight fit if the battery boxes just barely big enough for the 8Ds (I’ve had to trim some plastic off T105s to make it work), but generally I’ve had no problem with this conversion.

[Eder]

I currently have Lifeline GPL 31XT on my boat. My old lifelines lasted 8 years and were still going strong but sold them in Mexico to a guy that needed storage for his solar home.


I like the idea of sticking them down in the battery box and never looking at them again for the next 8 years.

[john61ct]

Originally Posted by sainted

Lifeline makes the only decent AGM batteries on the market

What a crock. Yes they're great, but so are Odyssey and Northstar. Also Firefly for chronic PSOC, and maybe Full River, in a pinch.

A short list to be sure, but longer than 1.


> One good thing about the 8D format is that you can put three GC2 batteries in the same space.

Excellent data point that, and a good idea.

The best battery value by far on the planet is Duracell (actually Deka/East Penn) FLA deep cycle golf cart batteries from BatteriesPlus or Sam's Club. Deka labeled same batts also sold at Lowes.

At around $1/Ah, 6 pair would cost only $1200 for 1200+AH @12V

But OP actually measure first, actual model sizes vary a bit from BCI specs

But that's 30% more Ah capacity, so if all that's not needed, you could save money, space and weight going to 4-5 pair instead.

[Exile]

Lifeline's are the only AGM's on the market I'm aware of that allow for conditioning/equalizing, a pretty critical feature if, as has been explained, you don't spend a lot of time at the dock on shore power and can't therefore routinely top off. If this is an important feature for your usage, then claiming Lifeline's are the only decent AGM's on the market is hardly a "crock."

[john61ct]

I wouldn't argue with someone saying "I think they're the best AGM", and Equalizing is indeed a great capability.

But not a universal, nor hardly the only, criterion for "decent".

What percentage of owners do you think actually do equalize, as per mfg instructions, on any regular basis?

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by john61ct

What percentage of owners do you think actually do equalize, as per mfg instructions, on any regular basis?

Doesn’t matter, I don’t care what others do. I know to, and for me that’s all that matters.

[Exile]

Originally Posted by john61ct

I wouldn't argue with someone saying "I think they're the best AGM", and Equalizing is indeed a great capability.

But not a universal, nor hardly the only, criterion for "decent".

What percentage of owners do you think actually do equalize, as per mfg instructions, on any regular basis?

For those who's boat usage is mostly at anchor or underway, and depending on their solar capacity, etc., conditioning is more than just a desirable feature but the difference between AGM's dying in as little as a year or lasting the more expected 5+ years. Otherwise, and as is very well known, AGM's have significant drawbacks for this particular type of usage. Accordingly, for someone away from shore power a lot I wouldn't necessarily characterize Lifeline's as the "best" of the AGM's, but would go further and say they are probably the only AGM's worth buying for the intended application. The one exception, of course, are Firefly's -- also AGM's but much more expensive and with limited options size-wise.

If you have shore power available a lot and desire AGM's, then there are numerous options as you point out. But just because Duracell or other brands may generally be cheaper to buy up front doesn't necessarily mean they're a better value than Lifeline's. Even when plugged in most of the time, the ability to periodically do a conditioning cycle can significantly extend their life. For me anyway, I've reached the conclusion that, regardless of usage, Lifeline's are still the best value, with the possible exception of Firefly which I haven't crunched the numbers on. But "value" for me also includes the significant time & hassle of physically removing & replacing batteries on & off my boat.

There's a lot more to this decisionmaking process when you're a boat owner and have lived with different systems first-hand. I'm now on my 4th set of batteries since I've owned my boat: Rolls-Surrette FLA, Full River AGM, and 2 sets of Lifeline AGMs. All 8D's btw, with the exception of a small G24 genset start battery. 8D's have their pros & cons, but I'm also not sure where you're getting your idea that they are less efficient, a poor value, or otherwise inferior to smaller sized batteries. Again, it often depends on variables unique to individual boats and applications. Just because you've read it somewhere doesn't mean it applies universally.