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tradrockrat · 18-02-2021, 11:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by skipgundlach

The KISS Extractor tweaked performance, and allowed electronic over-charge protection (vs previous shunts to either water heater or resistance strips) at a user-selectable 3 different points. Automatic shutdown, in advance of overheating, was accomplished via electronically sensing of incoming amp flow, and shutting down before overheat conditions arose.

I've been looking at that as I scored a completely rebuilt KISS with balanced blades and the standard on/off switch - essentially a brand new one.

Does that Extractor literally replace everything between the generator itself and the batteries? No controller or shunt needed? Thanks.

skipgundlach · 18-02-2021, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by tradrockrat

I've been looking at that as I scored a completely rebuilt KISS with balanced blades and the standard on/off switch - essentially a brand new one.

Does that Extractor literally replace everything between the generator itself and the batteries? No controller or shunt needed? Thanks.

Yes, it does. But it's designed for the original 30A unit; the new ones would overpower it...

Mark Johnson · 18-02-2021, 11:52

I have used AE on my self built multihulls since the 70s. By far, solar is the way to go, especially if your boat lends itself to them.
Even equipped with all the comforts, while at anchor... I had my batteries back to 100% before noon, so on VERY cloudy days, I still got there by sundown.

I had wind as well, but got tired of the noise. Even the quiet brand I chose, with a strut to the cabin top, was like living in a guitar.

Being in an anchorage with other boats, and making ANY continuous noise, is anti social and rude... the very things we go cruising to avoid.
The products by Southwest Wind Power were the worst. The first, could be annoying for 1/4 of a mile.

Some brands, like AmpAir, are whisper quiet, but limited in production.

Go with solar, and have friends!

skipgundlach · 19-02-2021, 04:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by tradrockrat

I've been looking at that as I scored a completely rebuilt KISS with balanced blades and the standard on/off switch - essentially a brand new one.

Does that Extractor literally replace everything between the generator itself and the batteries? No controller or shunt needed? Thanks.

MY apologies for brevity on the previous; I was in the car and on my phone.

Some expansion:

It takes the place of the on-off control/rectifier box which is original to the KISS.

It electronically senses how much amperage is flowing in a time period; if it's enough that it likely would cause an eventual (not then but otherwise soon) overheat (the two N/C thermostats in the housing open), it pre-emptively shuts it down. In a strong breeze, your fan will rotate slowly, and after the appropriate time, resume generation. In a very continuous breeze, you'll see it start and stop very frequently, and the charging interval will frequently be very small.

But it's a set-and-forget system otherwise. Choose your cutoff point - I forget the bottom, but 13.5 and 14.2 are the upper voltages - at which it will stop charging. Simple as that. No diversion, and it's a gasketed sealed lid and proper sealed wire holes; it should last forever.

If you manage to screw it up, as I have on a couple of occasions, replacement of a cheap diode or blade fuse is simple, if a nuisance due to the 6 screws needed to free the sealed top. The mistake i made was to not shut it off (the bat switch, which takes it offline, vs the rocker switch, which restores it to straight function, like the original would be) before opening the fused positive cable (my system is old enough that it's a large glass fuse; I unscrew one end to interrupt the positive cable).

We no longer have the open-circuit roars in heavy winds, and if it's fluky weather (we have an analog meter, which does require a shunt, but otherwise has no effect on the KISS), we can see it peg our 30A meter, and then wander around in the lower ranges.

A continuous 15-20 will have it cycling frequently. It drives the admiral nuts as she can't trust electronics sufficiently to realize that it's protecting the KISS (and you from noise) by shutting down.

It's a set-and-forget addition, and unless you had a similarly priced (about $300 if my memory's right) diversion controller and a dual-voltage water heater element, much better than some diversion methods. (I know a guy, really, whose KISS boiled the water in his water heater, as there's no thermostatic interrupt as in the AC line feed, so his KISS kept feeding the full-battery diversion connection...)

The owner of KISS, before selling to another SSCA member (Technautics, Cool Blue owner Rich Boren), and the owner of the Accumulator, did lots of testing with the KISSmobile (a camper van converted to rolling electronics lab). Both are personally accessible (John Gambill still does repairs and offers repair parts as well as new blades, the construction of them changing as were the housings and interior stuff) so if you had a question you could get a direct answer. One of the things John makes is the sound isolation mount. It's an industry standard (D400, e.g., specifies it despite it not being their product).

Unfortunately for we who might want to upgrade, or get a fully-self-serviceable unit (you should see some of the stuff mine's been through!), however, they're no longer made. The new owner determined that a new mold would set him back (per quotes from various makers) 60-100 big boat bux; it's not financially feasible to recover that without the KISS being much more expensive. And John was taking 40 hours to fabricate the new housings (the ones with the bolts ending with a nut outside the housing rather than being captured inside), which, even at minimum wage standards, isn't sustainable for production values (think of building one a week, e.g.).

So, congratulations on your score. Get in touch with svhotwire.com for any advice as well as repair parts, including, if it weren't in it, the proper balancing axle (the shaft is tapered), and check the balance. My metric is that if I have a heavy blade, it has to take a full minute to go from top to bottom before I consider it adequately balanced. That kind of attention to detail will be the way to keep it whisper quiet. Most won't go to that length (and the 'balanced sets' which are merely gram-equal, are nowhere near actually balanced; I got a new set of blades, and have two of them extensively lead-taped in order to offset the other which is notably heavier on the tip...), declaring them balanced long before they actually are, and then wonder why they get vibration noises (see the above reference to a guitar).

Well done. If it's not uncomfortable to discuss, how much was it?