not installing shore power connector?

[Dave22q]

Not having AC power may well impact the resale value of a cruising or live aboard sailboat. That is especially true in warm weather places like Florida. Also IMHO the space saving for pulling your shore power connector, 110 outlets and wiring is negligible.

[Brewgyver]

I would think that wouldn’t fly at a lot of marinas. You could get away with it for a few hours, but not left unattended.
In the first place, many power pedestals do not even have a standard NEMA 5-15 or 5-20 receptacle, only the L6-30 twist lock, so you’d at least have to get the adapter pigtail, but again only for temporary use.
Standard (non-locking) extension cords are never suitable for unattended connection, and I wouldn’t want a boat on my dock plugged in that way. If the marina wouldn’t do anything about it, the local Fire Department would.

[BlackHeron]

The 120v system in our boat gets almost all of its use when on the hard over the winter season. All of our power tools are AC, and since it is cold in the winter halogen work lights are not unwelcome with their side-effect of throwing off a lot of heat.

On the water we rarely plug in, with the solar panels and wind generators making the bulk of the power we store in our batteries with the occasional short motor throwing in a bit more charge. We have lived on a mooring ball in a Chicago Harbor and there is no place to plug in out there. Occasionally we will cross the lake and visit another harbor and stay in a marina overnight and plug in, which is nice to get the batteries topped-off since it is so hard to get batteries up to 100% as they live mostly between 50-80% charge.

We have a large inverter for AC loads such as the occasional use of the drill motor, heat gun, jigsaw, or the small wet-vac to clean the sole and the dry bilge of dust and crap dragged in from shore.

I can't imagine not having the AC shorepower plug or an AC panel. They take up very little room and the few AC receptacles around the boat (including the separate dedicated receptacle on its own circuit for the battery charger) really don't take up much boat room. That is all behind the wood panels anyhow. Our boat is most 12V DC and none of the permanently wired lights are AC at all. Still, having a place to plug in when on the hard and working heavily on projects is worth having them.

[Kerry1]

Originally Posted by captlloyd

Reminds me of a time when I was diving with friends on the island of Roatan. We had been doing a number of dives with tanks and I decided that I had enough of my stupid snorkel banging me on the head so I left it off one day. Well I ran low on air and swam to the surface and started swimming for our tender. About half way there I totally sucked the tank dry and guess what, it’s a bitch swimming with a dry scuba tank on your back. I found a large mushroom shaped coral head and perched myself on it. My buddies saw me and picked me up. Point is when you need it you need it, and it isn’t at that point always easy to get it. I would recommend that you at least have some sort of abbreviated set-up.

This is a good point. A snorkel is such a simple piece of equipment, but becomes a possible lifesaver if you are out of air, and have to surface swim a long distance to safety (and you don't want to ditch that tank on your back). We were always taught on our PADI course, not to omit a snorkel as basic equipment.

If you are planning on an inverter anyway, a basic setup such as shore power connector and maybe a couple of sockets shouldn't be overlooked. But each to their own.

[smac999]

the chances of you having a %100 stand alone system is very small. especially without a gen.

you'll likely want to get to shore on occasion to fully charge batteries and equalize. otherwise it's very hard on them to never get fully charged. unless you are running fireflys or lithium batteries.

at min you should have a good battery charger wired up in the boat, and could run an extension cord to it. but it's nicer to have a proper plug and AC panel. here we need shore power for heat too.

[hamburking]

Originally Posted by Terra Nova

OP--you haven't bothered to mention your location, but I would want ac power for convenience, especially for running power tools, vacuum, heater, etc.

Unless you are doing a big refit, power tools are over rated. I have a handsaw, eggbeater (manual) drill, and sandpaper....they replace several larger bulky power tools. Also, there are plenty of cordless tools that can can charge off the inverter when you have sunlight or wind power available. Your backup is a heavy duty extension cord with adapters for the dock end.

The only reason I can think of for AC power is to run AC...air conditioning. And IMHO thats a regional thing for places like Florida.

I like that my boat is different than a house on land.

[jamhass]

Notwithstanding everything that has already been said ...

It is really nice to occasionally really bring the batteries up to full charge. I've found it is easiest (and cheapest, considering diesel cost, engine/generator hours, etc) to do so on shore power.

Sure, you can do it with a cheap plug-in charger, but what batteries have you got, and is the cheap charger the correct profile for them?

Our boat has very few 110 loads, but we are still glad we can hook up to shore power when needed.

As everything on a boat ... it's a compromise.

[MLOI]

I met a couple of folks who have decided to make AC power simple.

So have a shore power connection which is connected to nothing except a smart charger. Then run all the onboard AC needs via an inverter.
It results in safe and simple wiring, with the advantage that all AC power sockets can be used either connected or disconnected. As long as your charger and inverter can deal with the current loads, it seems a decent idea to me

Mike

[smac999]

Originally Posted by MLOI

I met a couple of folks who have decided to make AC power simple.

So have a shore power connection which is connected to nothing except a smart charger. Then run all the onboard AC needs via an inverter.
It results in safe and simple wiring, with the advantage that all AC power sockets can be used either connected or disconnected. As long as your charger and inverter can deal with the current loads, it seems a decent idea to me

Mike

you still need a breaker, between the shore plug and charger. because you are taking a 30a plug into likly a 15a charger. one double pole 15a would likely work, as long as you ran 10awg to it. instead of using a double pole 30 and then a single pole 15.

[valhalla360]

Big question is: what will the AC side of the system look like?
- If the AC plugs and devices are going to stay and the inverter will be hard wired in to power them, I would say that yes, you should include it. The cost and expense when doing a total rewire to add the inlet and breaker is negligible in the big picture. It adds some functionality and helps with resale.
- If it's just a small inverter and you only plug directly into the inverter and the rest of the AC system is stripped out, the relative cost is higher and you might argue for leaving it out.

Second question is how do you expect to cruise?
- If you never stay in marinas and limit your haul out time, it's not as big an issue.
- If you stay in marinas, wind will either not work because there is none or make your neighbors hate you as they listen to it whirring all night long. Likewise, neighboring masts and trees can shade the solar panels significantly reducing output.

[MLOI]

Originally Posted by smac999

you still need a breaker, between the shore plug and charger. because you are taking a 30a plug into likly a 15a charger. one double pole 15a would likely work, as long as you ran 10awg to it. instead of using a double pole 30 and then a single pole 15.

Ah - not here in Aus where 240v 10a is the norm, 15a is a luxury.

edit: Oh I agree completely about the circuit breaker either way - It makes no sense and is not compliant to not have one.

Mike

[bobfnbw]

Originally Posted by Jack Ware

I'm refitting a 37' Cooper Seabird which includes rewiring everything. The goal is to have solar and wind, with a 2k watt inverter and large battery bank. So, it's occurred to me that the idea of shore power would, theoretically, be obsolete. What I mean is, if my systems are stand-alone and stable, would I ever really plug into shore power and pay for electricity? If not, then why install a shore power connector at all?

The only scenario I've come up with for that would be when I'm actually working on the system itself. And in that rare scenario I could just use a heavy duty extension cord from the outlets on the pier to run any power tools for that short time.

Am I overlooking something significant or is the idea of a shore power cable quickly becoming obsolete for those with solar/wind generation. The idea of not even installing a shore power cable connector "just feels wrong" but I can't figure out why. Has anyone opted to just not even install a shore power connector? Anyone can't remember the last time they used shore power? Anyone considering removing their shore power connector?

Thanks in advance.

Jack, I considered it on my last rewire (a Endeavour 40 CC) but discarded it since I really wanted Air Conditioning at times... But sure you could easily do it with a good battery bank and Solar. You could even go with all battery power tools like the new Bosch 18v stuff. Real nice tools. Charge them off a inverter. They even have a vacuum. And I can't see any reason why you couldn't run a extension cord off a shore power connector with the proper fittings for running a wet dry vac or something.
The only issue you might face, and has already been said, is resale. Most boats are Marina queens, and they need shore power. But if your not going to sell her soon, go for it. Let us know in a year how it worked out. You could always add it on later.

[u4ea32]

I strongly considered doing what the OP is contemplating: skipping the shore power because the intent is to cruise, and not sit in marinas.

However, I’m installing the shore power system this week.

Im installing a 30a port, with ELCI sensor and breaker, each in matching square plastic Hubble housings: HUB-HBL303NMELCI ($111.68 vs $148.90 retail). The sensor is North Shore Safety Ltd part number PGFM-111-B-A1-188, about $150, and the breaker is an AIRPAX IDLNK21-1REC5-38140-30-G1 and cost about $190 delivered.

A small panel with V and A guages and three switched breakers is wired after the ELCI breaker.

One switched breaker will power an adjacent ProNautic 12-30P battery charger that is “power factor corrected & global ac input” which supposedly accepts any ac power in and charges all sorts of 12v batteries, including equilization. An adjacent terminal block that will also be where I tie in solar charging power. Then fat 1/0 cables to the batteries.

Second switched breaker for the 110v water heater. Third switched breaker for one 110v dual outlet in the middle of the interior, for use only while on shore power. This one outlet will be enough for a dehumidifier, and power tools. Note this stuff might not work on 220v! If I decide I want 110 in Europe, maybe I address this in the distant future.

I caved n this when I realized that there will usually be extended pieriods of time when the boat is in a marina with nobody aboard. Also, the ability to do equalization after a crossing is good therapy for the batteries.

So its simple, much simpler than before the refit,but its there (by end of week).

[Dave22q]

No shore power? Figure a substantial discount on resale and then double it! Hard to overstate how dumb this decision would be. Save a hundred or so to risk thousands. Dumb!!!