Victron Multi setup/config questions

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

I find Victron manuals and technical info to be easily the best in the marine marketplace.

The problem is finding the information!

For example, regarding AES, this is what the Multiplus product manual says “AES (Automatic Economy Switch) If this setting is turned ‘on’, the power consumption in no-load operation and with low loads is decreased by approx. 20%, by slightly ‘narrowing’ the sinusoidal voltage. Applicable in stand-alone configuration only.”

This basically explains what the switch does, but not the consequences of doing it and no description of the circumstances when turning this setting on is recommended. Having to Google for associated white papers and technical information, then to decide which of the 300+ results are relevant, is not user friendly. That’s what I mean that the documentation is poor.

[smac999]

I would recommend buying the mk3 usb adapter and doing it with a computer. the dip switches are terrible.

the newer victron screens can not adjust the chargers which is crazy. on the older model screens you could. IE the blue power control screen could. even the new cerbo can not adjust it.

was the xantranx a link 2000 screen? if so it was also a battery monitor with a shunt. which is why it wants AH data. for the victron you need to buy a battery monitor separate. then connect it to the screen with a ve direct cable. of leave the old link 2000 screen as a battery monitor only

but the inverter charger does not care how big the bank is. or know.

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by jordanbigel

Thanks Charlie.

I am using VE Connect on my Mac, in Demo mode so far. I spent some time playing around with it (in my post above I said it was VE.Configure - sigh). I also mistakenly concluded earlier that VE.Connect was a mobile app and VE.Configure is the desktop app. Completely on me. Sorry for the confusion. I see now VE Connect is available on a variety of devices and platforms.

I am still not clear on how the mobile version of VE Connect can run my phone (or tablet) without some way for the data from the Victron to get to the network without any connection directly from the Victron to my WiFi network (which my mobile devices are connected to).

But, for now, not really important - I am content to use the VE Connect Mac version for now.

"self proclaimed fellow that wants to be self-sufficient it did not appear to me that you had exercised much self-sufficiency"


I suppose the long list of questions may have given you that impression. I also don't believe that asking knowledgable people specific, detailed questions demonstrates a lack of self-sufficiency. We There are many ways to learn.

/edit: Oops, my bad, the MultiPlus does work with the MK3-USB cable that you’re getting.

Note that MultiPlus inverters are not compatible with VictronConnect - you will need to use VEConfigure.

[CharlieJ]

Note that MultiPlus inverters are not compatible with VictronConnect - you will need to use VEConfigure.

This is not correct. See the YouTube video posted up thread.

[jordanbigel]

Originally Posted by smac999

I would recommend buying the mk3 usb adapter and doing it with a computer. the dip switches are terrible.

the newer victron screens can not adjust the chargers which is crazy. on the older model screens you could. IE the blue power control screen could. even the new cerbo can not adjust it.

was the xantranx a link 2000 screen? if so it was also a battery monitor with a shunt. which is why it wants AH data. for the victron you need to buy a battery monitor separate. then connect it to the screen with a ve direct cable. of leave the old link 2000 screen as a battery monitor only

but the inverter charger does not care how big the bank is. or know.

Thanks Smac,

I did get the MK3 USB adapter, it's coming today. You may have seen Charlie's comment below yours that the MK3 does work with the new Multis, from what I have read and based on the inclusion of the Multis in the packaged Demo Data which comes with VE Connect software.

My Xantrex was the Freedom SW-2012 and the remote control panel was fully functional in that it could be used to adjust all of the devices settings/options. This unit does require you to configure the total amp hours of the batteries, I suppose it is because the Xantrex control panel also includes some (minimal) battery monitoring capabilities. I also have an old Link20 (Circa 2000) which I plan to replace with the Victron GX50 (I think that is the right model) this summer when I also do the lithium battery upgrade.

It has also surprised me that the Victron control panel(s) do not offer this capability. It seems to me a big weakness in the system, for use on a voyaging sailboat (which is what I am) - I prefer that systems be independent so that the failure of one does not impact the functioning of others. But here, it seems that a failure of my computer will render me unable to adjust settings/options on the Victron. Most likely, this will never happen, and if it does, most likely, I will never have to make an adjustment to the options on the multi. But it is disturbing a little to know that if it did happen, I could not. Maybe I will learn in the coming days and weeks that there is some other way to program all the options without a working computer and a working USB dongle (ie. the MK3-USB).

J.

[jordanbigel]

Originally Posted by fxykty

The problem is finding the information!

For example, regarding AES, this is what the Multiplus product manual says “AES (Automatic Economy Switch) If this setting is turned ‘on’, the power consumption in no-load operation and with low loads is decreased by approx. 20%, by slightly ‘narrowing’ the sinusoidal voltage. Applicable in stand-alone configuration only.”

This basically explains what the switch does, but not the consequences of doing it and no description of the circumstances when turning this setting on is recommended. Having to Google for associated white papers and technical information, then to decide which of the 300+ results are relevant, is not user friendly. That’s what I mean that the documentation is poor.

This is my interpretation as well. The information does seem to be out there (for example, I DID find a more complete and deeper explanation of AES, but now I can't find it again!) - what's lacking is simply better organization and a complete index. I should add, a proper index is not a list of document links on a web page - an index would let you look up words/phrases and match them to document/page #s.

Ultimately, the quality of the product is more important than how hard you have to work to figure it out. I have high hopes for the Multi - if it lives up to expectations, hard to find documentation will fade into distant memory with the humm of the multi being the only reminder of its existence...

[CharlieJ]

@jordanbiegel

But here, it seems that a failure of my computer will render me unable to adjust settings/options on the Victron.

What control panel are you going to get?

All of the Victron control panels have the ability to turn the Multi on, off and charger only as well as the ability to limit the amount of shorepower/genset to be utilized by the unit. Unless you change your batteries, you should never have to use your computer to change settings in the Multi.

[jordanbigel]

Originally Posted by CharlieJ

@jordanbiegel

What control panel are you going to get?

All of the Victron control panels have the ability to turn the Multi on, off and charger only as well as the ability to limit the amount of shorepower/genset to be utilized by the unit. Unless you change your batteries, you should never have to use your computer to change settings in the Multi.

I bought the Digital Multi Control for now.

But, my plan is to get a CerboGX/GX50 Touch this summer when I do the lithium battery upgrade (and probably a SmartShunt also will be needed also from what I understand so far - lots more to learn before I start that project).

Agree, chances of needing or wanting to change settings via the computer is almost zero... And of course I have a backup laptop, so, not an important issue.

[CharlieJ]

The Cerbo GX/Touch 50 is a great bit of kit! You can port out of the Cerbo to a MFD if you want to and the Cerbo has a built in WiFi.

I recommend a BMV712 Smart in lieu of the SmartShunt. I have found that the range of BT from the SmartShunt is not as robust as we need in all applications, especially when the shunt is behind a battery bank!

The BMV712 Smart is a full function battery monitor and it has BT built in so you can program and monitor using VE.Connect.

[smac999]

Originally Posted by CharlieJ

The Cerbo GX/Touch 50 is a great bit of kit! You can port out of the Cerbo to a MFD if you want to and the Cerbo has a built in WiFi.

I recommend a BMV712 Smart in lieu of the SmartShunt. I have found that the range of BT from the SmartShunt is not as robust as we need in all applications, especially when the shunt is behind a battery bank!

The BMV712 Smart is a full function battery monitor and it has BT built in so you can program and monitor using VE.Connect.

either would plug into the cerbo so really no need for bluetooth. you see data on the touch screen. the deciding factor is the VE direct cable is max 10 meters. so if the shunt is more then 10m from the cerbo you have to get the BVM and then run the BVM cable to the cerbo area, then use a short VE direct cable BVM to cerbo. because the cerbo then connects to the BVM screen instead of the shunt itself on the smart shunt.

you just need bluetooth range for a few mins to set it up.

[smac999]

Originally Posted by jordanbigel

I prefer that systems be independent so that the failure of one does not impact the functioning of others. But here, it seems that a failure of my computer will render me unable to adjust settings/options on the Victron. .

once set there is nothing to change. shore power amps can be changed on the screen. and the inverter turned on and off.

the usb changes the battery voltages, max charge rate (the deafault is reduced so you probably want to increase) . mostly things you setup once and leave.

they likly took this away from the screen because too many owners screwed it up. so basicly only techs can set it up / change it now. or owners willing to buy extra peices and learn how.

the xantrax can change settings but requires a password for the custom settings. which would be a better way.

if you add the bvm or smartshunt (which you need to do if replacing the link 2000) then that can be programed itself seperatly either from it's own screen or bluetooth. but it will get pluged int othe cerbo to see the battery info.

[CharlieJ]

smac999:

the deciding factor is the VE direct cable is max 10 meters. so if the shunt is more then 10m from the cerbo you have to get the BVM and then run the BVM cable to the cerbo area,

Not correct. VE.Direct cable connects the BMV712 to the Cerbo. RJ12 cable connects the shunt to the BMV712 and is available up to 30m in length.

I was pointing out the benefits of having BT capability produced by the BMV712Smart vice the SmartShunt.

[goboatingnow]

In practice ve.direct will run over longer then 10m

[smac999]

Originally Posted by CharlieJ

smac999:


Not correct. VE.Direct cable connects the BMV712 to the Cerbo. RJ12 cable connects the shunt to the BMV712 and is available up to 30m in length.

I was pointing out the benefits of having BT capability produced by the BMV712Smart vice the SmartShunt.

for the smart shunt the VE direct cable has to run to the shunt. I was pointing out the wiring difference between the smart shunt and BVM.

[jordanbigel]

To followup, I completed the install of the Victron multi today. Everything went smoothly. I had a lot of trouble screwing in the 2 screws at the bottom of the unit, but, it's mounted in a space between the hull and the aft head, so there is not a lot of space to work with.

It was critical to attach all cables before hanging the unit on the wall. I used pigtail leads for DC (I used 2 x 1/0 cables for each pos and neg a suggested in the manual) and the v-sense and t-sense connections. The AC in and out were long enough to reach the sink where I had it perched while connecting the wiring. Once I had the wires connected I hung it on the wall behind the vanity and then connected the pigtails to the leads/posts I had prepared from the battery.

I powered up the DC cables and ran through the settings in VE Connect on my Mac. The only hitch was I did not have the password to access the settings via VE Connect, but luckily I found it fairly quickly. Then I turned on the AC input to the unit and it went into charging mode as expected.

Everything looks great. The unit is practically silent - compared to the Xantrex it's like a whisper.

So far I have only 1 question: Is there a way for force the charging state from absorption (or bulk) to Float? Sometimes a shore power breaker get tripped by mistake (ie. human flicks it off by mistake or someone on the dock turns it off, or the marina has a planned outage for maintenance. In each case, the batteries are at Float and the power gets turned off and on, now we're back to Bulk->Absorption, resulting in over-charging the batteries. On the rare occasion this happens, I would like to be able to manually flip the charger into Float mode.

I cannot find a way to do this via VE Connect. Perhaps it is possible using the CerboGX/GX50 (which I don't have yet but am planning to get in the future)?

Thanks to everyone who helped me get up to speed on the Multi.