Wow - Induction Cooktop

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by wingssail

All of those are good points, and at risk of seeming argumentative, here is what goes into my decision:

• I don't want to spend a significant amount on the batteries, inverter, increased solar panels, and other equipment to make this change. I don't need to fix something that isn't broke.
• I don't want to put a helicopter landing pad on my stern for the added solar cells.
• Most of the time there are convenient ways to get the gas bottle filled, and for us, it's been cheap.
• When we are worried about the heat inside the boat from cooking, that's because it damn hot outside, and no time to go out of the air conditioning (if we're docked) to cook. Well cooking inside is hot! I'll grant you that, but galleys always have been. Call me traditionalist. Besides, I still like grilling, etc.
• I am not convinced that there is not some greater breakdown risk with the complex electrical/electronic systems. Yes Alt/etc is unreliable, tell me about it, but I know how to diagnose and repair that system in my sleep, cheaply and quickly.

I think that induction cooking is coming, as is electric drive, but right now, I don't want to modify my boat in an unattractive, slower, way and spend a heap of money to do so to get rid of propane. Propane has been my friend for a long time.

Maybe others do. OK

Originally Posted by wingssail

Mostly I'm just defensive, I guess.

No need to be defensive!


Your reasons for sticking with gas are perfectly reasonable, as I'm sure everyone will agree.


In this as in other things, one size does not fit all. Some people already have the electrical storage and generating capacity needed for electric cooking -- for many of these people induction is very attractive.



I have both induction and gas on my boat, and just finished a one-month cruise with up to 6 people on board. And used the gas all of two or three times in the course of the whole month.


But others, like WingSail, would need to upgrade their electrical systems, and don't find that to be worthwhile. And that's fine -- I wouldn't either

[OldMan]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

I think people that get upset with the talk about induction cooking somehow feel that by not having it and seeing the negatives around propane cooking that they experience daily listed in these posts, as well as the costs involved with upgrading their boat to solar power, better batteries, induction cooktops etc., that they are living with obsolete technology and stuck with it because of budget constraints. Like the neighbor with the Tesla. Instead of not giving a f. they feel the need to defend the old ways.

About the oven: replace the propane oven with a Breville electric convection oven. There are also combi convection-microwaves from Sharp and Toshiba.

Now my opinion and what I’ll build to replace our gimbal Force10 range: A frame that takes a single portable induction cooktop on top with fiddles to keep pots in place and a small microwave underneath. The idea is that while on passage, we’ll eat pre-made dinners from the freezer that heat up in the microwave and the single burner is enough to cook rice, boil water etc. during passage. When at anchor we can get a second cooktop out when needed as well as use the oven or cockpit grill etc.
I will make the gimballed part sit lower so that the cooktop sits below countertop so that a cover can be put on for extra space.

For now we have the induction cooktop on top of the Force10 like so many do

No budget constraint! Just common sense. I'm an engineer with a business degree, I don't jump at shiny objects!

I still use FLA batteries, have 825W of solar, use ~250-275Ah of battery a day. Upgrading Ah and going to LFP batteries then doubling solar yields an ROI that simply doesn't make sense to me. $5k - $8k upgrade just to have induction?

I know induction cooking, I have it in my house. Food tastes the same cooked on induction, resistive, or gas. I don't value the positives of induction higher than the negatives nor cost. YMMV

If you find induction to be of value, enjoy!

[nwdiver]

Originally Posted by mlydon

I find the topic particularly interesting, in that I happen to have a VERY old stove that's not working very well, a VERY old inverter (mod-sine wave), and VERY crappy batteries that I intend to replace next year with Fireflys.

It seems to me that if I was going to buy a victron multi anyway, NOT buying a new force 10 stove at $1500 could basically pay for the inverter upgrade.

The thread seems to keep diverting into underlying power systems - understandable, to be sure, but very thin on actual stove replacements. I see a few nicely done home-made projects with tops on microwaves, but no detail.....can you folks expand on your projects? anyone making a drop-in replacement with gimbals, etc?

TIA,

Matt

I use a single portable on top of my gimbled propane stove, I like it and it works well, I'm with you.....I'll switch when a drop in I like comes along.......diy systems not so much for me for cooking on a 38 foot boat.....I don't think the manufactures see the tiny new market big enaugh to support a product R&D and buying components they don't build, maybe a new player without a gas stove program to protect will step in.....

[s/v Jedi]

You sound like you’re not the one doing the cooking inside the hot and humid galley

Originally Posted by OldMan

No budget constraint! Just common sense. I'm an engineer with a business degree, I don't jump at shiny objects!

I still use FLA batteries, have 825W of solar, use ~250-275Ah of battery a day. Upgrading Ah and going to LFP batteries then doubling solar yields an ROI that simply doesn't make sense to me. $5k - $8k upgrade just to have induction?

I know induction cooking, I have it in my house. Food tastes the same cooked on induction, resistive, or gas. I don't value the positives of induction higher than the negatives nor cost. YMMV

If you find induction to be of value, enjoy!

[mlydon]

I just spotted this unit at Home Depot - looks PERFECT size-wise for a marine stove replacement, at 20.5 inches across.....
only 1800 watts total, though, between the burners (or whatever you call them.....inducers?). Some sort of power sharing, so that you can do one on high, both on half, 60/40, etc.

Matt

https://www.homedepot.com/p/True-Ind...-306172864-_-N

[Pelagic]

When redoing our galley we decided to get rid of the microwave as the food never tasted good coming out of it and warming up left-overs on the stove top with our new non stick induction pots was tastier.

For that reason, I question :

"Why only one heating hob for stove top?"

I've noticed in the last year of using it as liveaboards, that my partner usually has 2 sometimes 3 at a time when making a fancy meal

If I do Sunday bacon/eggs and pancakes, I use at least 2 + the kettle

Also

Perhaps a telling point about those of us who have switched to using induction on board over propane (especially in the tropics)..... I don't know anyone who has regretted that change.

[sienasun]

When you replace the stove top with electrical do you remove the gas oven as well?

[cj88]

Originally Posted by OldMan

No budget constraint! Just common sense. I'm an engineer with a business degree, I don't jump at shiny objects!

I have a background in engineering and business too. I find many engineers inherently conservative but then again some are at the bleeding edge creating the things others will eventually adopt once they've seen enough of their peers have done so too. I do agree with the recognition that not all shiny new objects justify adoption but I think both induction and lithium-based battery technologies have proven their worth in a number of markets and are acceptable technologies to adopt if they match the user's needs but everyone has their own needs and comfort zone. Not everyone likes or needs to change. If viewed in isolation the only real downside is the upfront battery cost to build a robust system but if the benefits of the batteries are also considered as a part of the total boat electrical system and also considering the whole of life cost then it looks good. Doesn't mean I'd suggest anyone rushes to rip out a good functioning safe propane system just to swap over though but induction is my preferred option for a cooktop.

[s/v Jedi]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

When redoing our galley we decided to get rid of the microwave as the food never tasted good coming out of it and warming up left-overs on the stove top with our new non stick induction pots was tastier.

For that reason, I question :

"Why only one heating hob for stove top?"

I've noticed in the last year of using it as liveaboards, that my partner usually has 2 sometimes 3 at a time when making a fancy meal

If I do Sunday bacon/eggs and pancakes, I use at least 2 + the kettle

Also

Perhaps a telling point about those of us who have switched to using induction on board over propane (especially in the tropics)..... I don't know anyone who has regretted that change.

We do have multiple single-hob units but only one on the gimbal platform because when underway we only use one and when cooking fancy we don’t need the gimbal but do need more room for bigger pots & pans.

On microwave: in some things it excels like steaming vegetables, defrosting and heating meals during passage that were cooked before departure and frozen, heating up dishes like the baked beans for breakfast etc. Most important function and reason to have it gimbaled is the heating of stews, soups etc. during passage

[kryg]

I'm impressed with this combo single cooktop and oven. The question, is this a single induction cooktop and oven combo custom build? Or can one buy one as per photo off the shelf? If so, where can I purchase one? If it is a custom build oven and cooktop, what type and brand and model is the oven? Many Thanks, Kryg

Originally Posted by jmh2002

@Jedi

I'm not sure if you saw the photos posted earlier in this thread. I've included my favourite above, but there were more in @cj88's post too.

In this variant, with a single burner, the remaining hob space has been used as a gimbaled platform, to rest a hot pot or pan, or for food prep.

In some sea states I have found it useful to have a gimbaled preparation space. In the past I have just used put a chopping board on the unused two (of the normal four) gas hobs but I like that it's included here as part of the design.

[cj88]

Originally Posted by kryg

I'm impressed with this combo single cooktop and oven. The question, is this a single induction cooktop and oven combo custom build? Or can one buy one as per photo off the shelf? If so, where can I purchase one? If it is a custom build oven and cooktop, what type and brand and model is the oven? Many Thanks, Kryg

It was from http://www.tomlogisch.com/ in Germany and I believe that the cordless kettle base is fixed to the top.

Technical data:
Inverter: 12 or 24 V to 230 V, sine AC voltage, 3.0 kW continuous power, 5.0 kW peak power
Convection oven: 1.3 kW
Grill: 1.2 kW
Microwave: 0.8 kW Microwave power at max. 1.2 kW power consumption
Hob: 2.0 kW
Kettle: 1.6 kW, stainless steel jug

Here's the old webpage for it.
https://web.archive.org/web/20151014...com/e-cooking/

[OldMan]

Originally Posted by s/v Jedi

You sound like you’re not the one doing the cooking inside the hot and humid galley

No hot and humid galley, we know how to adjust the flame on a gas cooktop! Plus our galley is not in a dungeon, it's on a well ventilated bridgedeck of a catamaran!!

[s/v Jedi]

About the electric kettle: you don’t need it when you have a good induction cooktop Just buy an induction compatible kettle. I have a 3kW cooktop in my motorhome and it boils same quantity water twice as fast as the electric kettle. This saves countertop space again

[Kenomac]

For all the doubters who think we need a massive lithium battery bank to cook with electric, I now have a power consumption number.

19.5Ah is all our all-electric dinner meal cooking consumed from our 450Ah Trojan 24v house bank, which included:

1. Two large baked potatoes done in the microwave oven for 8.5 minutes.

2. Two portions of carrots done in the microwave oven for 6 minutes.

3. Two delicious pan fried steaks done medium on the NuWave induction cooktop 10 minutes.

4. One large cappuccino via the nespresso machine. 2 minutes.

Total power consumed: 19.5Ah

Diesel consumed: none

Sunlight consumed by 450w solar: 1 hour

Total time wasted chasing gas bottle refill stations, lugging gas bottles or having them refilled:Zero minutes... none

[fxykty]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

For all the doubters who think we need a massive lithium battery bank to cook with electric, I now have a power consumption number.

19.5Ah is all our all-electric dinner meal cooking consumed from our 450Ah Trojan 24v house bank, which included:

1. Two large baked potatoes done in the microwave oven for 8.5 minutes.

2. Two portions of carrots done in the microwave oven for 6 minutes.

3. Two delicious pan fried steaks done medium on the NuWave induction cooktop 10 minutes.

4. One large cappuccino via the nespresso machine. 2 minutes.

Total power consumed: 19.5Ah

Diesel consumed: none

Sunlight consumed by 450w solar: 1 hour

Total time wasted chasing gas bottle refill stations, lugging gas bottles or having them refilled:Zero minutes... none

What was the current draw? That’s where smaller inverters and/or battery banks may have trouble; not the 19.5Ah consumed.