New Release: TheBoatApp - Boat Maintenance & Management App

[CaptainRivet]

Contradictory to your research I and most full time lifeaboard bluewater cruisers I know do most planning and setting up of new lists offline at anker where I have time and mood to think and can quickly have a look at everything on my boat.
Online is only used on request (!) when at land in a restaurant or pub or dock using their good and fast WiFi to
1) backup everything if the iPad Pro breaks or gets donated to Neptun unwillingly
2) made available online to sync the app and all data on the other 4 iPads and 3 phones I have on board used for other purposes and as additional displays (because all NMEa data is locally online and can be displayed or processed) and backup.
3) updates of app and database by you
4) sharing lists with others

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

Do you have prefilled maintenance checklist template too?
Everyone has their own checklists for maintenance which are incomplete because they just set them up for the things they know that need maintenance. But all of us experienced stuff that breaks because you simply didn’t know that needs maintenance till it broke.
I can always disable or erase stuff from that template but an as much as complete template as possible eg. Compiled together from all maintenance lists of all users would be genius.

At least since the IPad Pro 12.9 in 2017 a mobile device doesn‘t have a small screen and a lot boater incl. me are using that iPad Pro 12.9 as main navigation gear often with their 7“ chart plotter at the helm mirrored to be remotely controlled with the 12.9“ screen and in parallel Navionics, time zero, ISailor and other navigational tools with the yacht devices NMea to wifi dongle to get all needed nmea data on the boats internal(!) WiFi

You are absolutely spot-on and the platform is configured exactly for everyone to be able to generate a Checklist, share it, then himself maintain it or other(s) copy it and improve it further!

For example you may find an existing checklist that matches your needs and just "Follow" it, hoping that the owner will also update/improve it in the future. Alternatively, if this checklist is quite good but not exactly what you need, you may "Copy" it. Then you become the owner and you may edited it to match your needs. In case you do so and make it a more "Generic Template", this can be really helpful for many other sailors out there that they may simply "Follow" your checklist, especially if you maintain it, based on your experience, research and even comments received by other sailors within the page of your Checklist!

If not already done so, please do some light reading on "Checklists Best Practices: How to Maintain your Public Checklists" and "Checklists Best Practices: Follow or Copy a Public Checklist?" These tutorials describe exactly how this work and how good checklists maybe followed or used as basis to create even better ones!

Thanking you, I wish you Happy Holidays!

George

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by CaptainRivet

Contradictory to your research I and most full time lifeaboard bluewater cruisers I know do most planning and setting up of new lists offline at anker where I have time and mood to think and can quickly have a look at everything on my boat.
Online is only used on request (!) when at land in a restaurant or pub or dock using their good and fast WiFi to
1) backup everything if the iPad Pro breaks or gets donated to Neptun unwillingly
2) made available online to sync the app and all data on the other 4 iPads and 3 phones I have on board used for other purposes and as additional displays (because all NMEa data is locally online and can be displayed or processed) and backup.
3) updates of app and database by you
4) sharing lists with others

Fully agree!
Sailing is for sailing and not getting stuck in front of a screen, even the chart-plotter! We also practice the same, meaning getting ready before casting the lines away, by doing the needed maintenance in-time, getting provisions, etc, based on our Checklists!
Then, when on-route, we do some - usually minor - Checklists maintenance to add/revise some tasks for when back on our base.

[Startracker]

Colour me intrigued. I was actually just downloading various different spreadsheet ideas then got fed up and was talking to a developer friend about building me something I could run on a Raspberry Pi to do this. Your solution looks much more enjoyable!
I like one part of the spreadsheet model the best, which is to say offline is the first stop, online the second. Is there any likelihood down the road you will include customer's choice of cloud hosting? 300MB definitely won't work for me, 3000 will probably be too small eventually as I like to include pictures in my logbook. Currently using an Evernote template but it's not great.
https://astrolabesailing.com/2017/11...g-spreadsheet/

This is what I was about to start setting up, it covers a few things I couldn't find in the app screenshots that I want, they might be a good contact for you or reference.

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by Startracker

Colour me intrigued. I was actually just downloading various different spreadsheet ideas then got fed up and was talking to a developer friend about building me something I could run on a Raspberry Pi to do this. Your solution looks much more enjoyable!
I like one part of the spreadsheet model the best, which is to say offline is the first stop, online the second. Is there any likelihood down the road you will include customer's choice of cloud hosting? 300MB definitely won't work for me, 3000 will probably be too small eventually as I like to include pictures in my logbook. Currently using an Evernote template but it's not great.
https://astrolabesailing.com/2017/11...g-spreadsheet/

This is what I was about to start setting up, it covers a few things I couldn't find in the app screenshots that I want, they might be a good contact for you or reference.

Hello dear Startracker,

To start with your cloud hosting enquiry, yes, we plan to introduce additional cloud-space for those data-hungry users! We haven’t received any such request until now, but it is in our roadmap.

About spreadsheets and Excel, we have all started with Excel (…actually, I did so with Lotus 1-2-3 back in the ’80s but let’s not go down the memory lane at this point!). Spreadsheets have the huge advantage of being easy to use! Of course it works like a charm in the beginning but as data-fields (call me “columns” in Excel) start getting more and more, having even dependencies from other database tables (call me “worksheets” in Excel), things are getting really complicated. To put also insult to the injury, try to get collaboration with others (sharing), including also reminders, and then you need a fully fledged database. MS Access and the like did the job, but this is heavy staff for the majority of us sailors out there. Who wants to learn programming when what he/she actually wants is enjoy sailing?

Apart of the sentimental value of our beautiful boats, they are still really complex pieces of engineering comprised of many systems and components that they need to be looked after. You know this well since otherwise you weren’t going to use this so elaborated Excel! Similarly, collaboration is also in your genes, exactly as Astrolabe Sailing has been generous to share her work with the community for everyone to be able to benefit from her Standardization & Systematization!

This is EXACTLY what is our goal! To give all sailors an easy way to Standardization & Systematization of their boating data, making tracking and follow-up easy-peasy! We believe that even the most “rudimentary” boat-data systematization, with timely reminders for maintenance tasks and knowing what is where and when/if expires, provides real-life benefits including:

1. Improved Safety aboard: when your boat-systems are properly maintained they have better chance of not failing during a passage!
2. Peace-of-mind: knowing that your boat-systems are in top-shape, having an Inventory manifest of where is what and reminders about when actions are needed, the brain relaxes and the journey becomes the focus!
3. Reselling value: last but not least, providing to a potential buyer all these data, definitely proves you being a very diligent boat owner and thus your asking price should be well deserved!

To come back to the spreadsheet concept, it is indeed the easy way to do things and for this very reason we have implemented this spreadsheet functionality on every module. Meaning, as you may have experienced, you may go within your Inventory module and make any changes directly in the table you see, with these changes being automatically saved. We shall soon provide the ability to add/remove columns so that you may customize this table-view to your needs.

More related to the Astrolabe Sailing Excel you are using, here are a few thoughts of how you may use some respective worksheets of yours with TheBoatApp:

1. Maintenance Log: you may migrate these tasks-lists as Checklists in TheBoatApp. You may either keep them Private for your-eyes-only or you may leave them as Public so that other sailors may “Follow” and use them too (please refer to “Checklists Best Practices: How to Maintain your Public Checklists”)
2. Boat Details: I think that within TheBoatDB (our main database, linked with TheBoatApp) we got most of these fields already within the “Boats” module. We also have in our roadmap to introduce “Custom user fields” so that each sailor may customize further based on his data needs
3. Spare Parts: I believe that the “Inventory” module covers this pretty well, providing also the ability to attached files in any items (e.g. a user or maintenance manual, a photo of a part, etc)
4. Personal Inventory: similar as the “Inventory” above
5. Passage Plan: covered by the “Inventory” and “Logbook” modules
6. Passage Log: covered by the “Logbook” module
7. Sight Log: covered I believe by the “Logbook” module (adding a log-record with the respective notes)
8. Deviation Table: that’s a bit “hard-core”! Maybe use the Logbook to record these if/as needed?
9. Personal Details (Crew): covered partially by the “Logbook” module. We have in our roadmap to include more detailed crew info and generate also the respective crew-manifest (Report), ready to be submitted to the Port Authorities upon departure/arrival
10. Annual Spend: A “Costs” module is in work-in-progress, for being able to record costs details in every DB-record (Inventory, Logbook, Tasks), including also cost-type (Administrative Fees & Taxes, Consumables, Docking, Fuel, Insurance, etc)
11. Yacht Income: we have in the roadmap B2B functionalities but for the time being we focus into more operational aspects for the “typical” sailor and less for the business owner
12. Budget: …in due time (part of B2B)
13. Power Budget: we have forecasted this and thus in the “Boats” module you may book the power generated (solar, wind, D/G), book your overall consumption and even inverter capacity. Also, in the Inventory module, there is a “Consumption” field to book electrical power consumption of each device. We plan later on (roadmap) to introduce a “Reports” module which will also produce a Power Budget report like the Excel you currently use
14. Contact Details: already part of the user-account (name, surname, e-mail, FB, etc), while some more boat-related fields (VHF callsign, MMSI, etc) are to be included in the boat-fields
15. Planning: …further down the roadmap! One of our users even hinted considering syndication functionality for users having a shared boat with others and wanting to sync on boat usage (trips) and even costs distribution vs. usage per user
16. Provisioning: …I guess the “Checklists” module should do the job, and with the “Costs” module introduced, you just make an entry there of your provisions expense and Cost-tracking done (including even a photo of the receipt as attachment)
17. Meal Plan: …well I have to admit that you caught us off-guard here! No such feature in the roadmap, yet!
18. First Aid List: the “Checklists” module should do the job. Can be also booked as Inventory item, including the respective cost
19. Standard Operating Procedures (SOP): these are definitely what our Checklists have been created for. These SOP may be entered as Checklists and should you do so, I bet they will soon become a hit within the community with many followers (we have also redesigned TheBoatDB web-page and we shall also promote there the most popular checklists)
20. Rescue Me: I believe these data are covered from the aforementioned modules plus the “Files” module, where documents such as passports, skipper’s license, insurance, etc, can be stored
21. Safety Plan & Diagram: this can be a very useful Report, with data partially retrieved from Inventory (safety equipment) and other fulfilled manually by the skipper/owner

Last but not least, we love user feedback! We have quite some experience but still there are sailors out there with many more miles under their keels so we are always listening to ideas and suggestions on how we can make TheBoatDB and TheBoatApp more efficient and effective for all us sailors! We have an online community and tutorials at Support.MarineDatacloud.com (currently working on the sign-on for the already registered users to access it directly when already logged in the platform). We are also reachable directly at Support@MarineDataCloud.com and we answer each and every single email we receive.

Apologies for a looong email but I think was needed to do justice to the so well structured and consolidated single Excel file you use.


George

[grantmc]

Originally Posted by MarineDataCloud

...

Try the Gold (full experience) membership now, FREE for 90 days

...

I can't find anywhere on the web site that shows the differences between the free and the gold versions. So it strikes me as a pointless trial. The Support FAQ states "The account creation needs simply your name, a password and a valid email address. No payment-card is required and your account is fully functional for as long as you wish to keep it. It is not a trial account with some short-term validity. It does not expire, even if you never subscribe to Gold. It is a fully functional account with no expiration date.
The service is free and only if the user wishes to support the platform and get also some extra functionality is welcome to subscribe."

So what are the differences?

Another facility I can't find is the ability to import/export data. How is this achieved?

The other little potential issue is whether Marine Data Cloud Ltd will still be around in 5, 10, 15 years time. Only a small number of users will sign up for the 50 euros pa. So I'm wondering what is intended to drive revenue?

But on the positive the look and feel of the site is great.

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by grantmc

I can't find anywhere on the web site that shows the differences between the free and the gold versions. So it strikes me as a pointless trial. The Support FAQ states "The account creation needs simply your name, a password and a valid email address. No payment-card is required and your account is fully functional for as long as you wish to keep it. It is not a trial account with some short-term validity. It does not expire, even if you never subscribe to Gold. It is a fully functional account with no expiration date.
The service is free and only if the user wishes to support the platform and get also some extra functionality is welcome to subscribe."

So what are the differences?

Another facility I can't find is the ability to import/export data. How is this achieved?

The other little potential issue is whether Marine Data Cloud Ltd will still be around in 5, 10, 15 years time. Only a small number of users will sign up for the 50 euros pa. So I'm wondering what is intended to drive revenue?

But on the positive the look and feel of the site is great.

Hello dear GrantMC,

On the very top of the web-page, you may click "Pricing" and you'll be able to see the Gold Subscription benefits, in a comparison table versus the Free accounts.

The import & export functionalities are in the roadmap, targeted for 2022Q2 for Export (easier and asked more from users!) and 2022Q4 for Import.

About Marine Data Cloud business viability, we are in business for 3-years already, since FEB 2019, and still making active investments. During 2021 we launched TheBoatApp web-2.0 on a brand new design and we expect to do so for TheBoatDB-2.0 during 2022Q1. Also, to follow on 2022Q2 with the Mobile Apps 2.0 (iOS and Android). We have a long roadmap spanning currently 3-years ahead and we actively monitor users' input on what we should improve or add further. For better or worse we are neither Google nor Microsoft to be able to afford virtually unlimited resources and do everything-now but we have good investors and already a capable team of over a dozen professionals (SW-developers, designers, etc).

About the pricing, there are already other professional software solutions on a steep pricing of hundreds of dollars/month or many thousands dollars/year. These are well designed SW-tools for multi-multi-millions dollars worth of vessels, of well over 100ft and even 100m, that neither all of us every-day sailors need nor can afford! Thus, we keep our pricing extremely low (...literally at a good cup of coffee/month range!) exactly for every single sailor out there to be able to afford it and support the platform. In other words, our business model is not to sell expensive to few selected ones but cheap to every sailor!

Thanking you for your message, I wish you good health and an always seaworthy boat! Feel free to reach us directly via email at Support@MarineDataCloud.com for anything needed.

[sailingharry]

Reading through the comments, it appears that this is a complete non-starter. If the data cannot be edited and updated offline, it's useless!


You do seem to have a disconnect. It seems you may not be native English, so that may be the difference. You keep mentioning "Mobile 2.0" as if it's an answer to offline. Isn't that backwards? Yes, I have very little desire to use a mobile phone to do vessel management (and would prefer to use a laptop), but most phones are designed, by there basic nature, to be connected! The best applications (OpenCPN, for instance) work just fine offline, but many mobile apps require a cell signal.


Until the program can be run on a laptop, without a data connection (and updated/synced when possible), it's just not something a boater can use.

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

Reading through the comments, it appears that this is a complete non-starter. If the data cannot be edited and updated offline, it's useless!


You do seem to have a disconnect. It seems you may not be native English, so that may be the difference. You keep mentioning "Mobile 2.0" as if it's an answer to offline. Isn't that backwards? Yes, I have very little desire to use a mobile phone to do vessel management (and would prefer to use a laptop), but most phones are designed, by there basic nature, to be connected! The best applications (OpenCPN, for instance) work just fine offline, but many mobile apps require a cell signal.


Until the program can be run on a laptop, without a data connection (and updated/synced when possible), it's just not something a boater can use.

Hello dear SailingHarry,

Well, you are right on the offline need and the gap is that we have upgraded the WEB platform (https://theboatapp.com) to version-2 while the iOS and Android mobile apps are still on version-1. We are working on this (fully rewriting the mobile apps since even us we didn’t like version-1!) and expect to release the mobile version-2, on both iOS and Android, in a couple of months on a brand-new design with offline support immediately afterwards. With the coming upgrades (some technology changes that we do), even the WEB version on your laptop’s browser will be able to operate offline within the year but no more spoilers for the time being!

About OpenCPN, I agree with you that is a great app, focusing on navigation. On our side, we don’t do navigation. We provide the platform for you and every sailor to manage YOUR marine data (Inventory, Tasks, etc). We are one of quite a few marine data platforms that provide WEB user-interface from any internet browser, and probably the only one to do so for FREE (…or a mere €49,90/annum for subscribers). Many sailors keep their marine data electronically and most of the work is done on a laptop/tablet thus WEB browsing works better to keep eye strain and fatigue to minimum.

So, the whole platform already runs on your laptop’s WEB browser, today, online, and coming soon offline and as stand-alone Windows/macOS/Linux app too, always on your laptop’s big and eye-friendly screen!

Thanking you, I wish you well and with an always seaworthy boat!

[davil]

MarineDataCloud

thank you for your postings and infinite patience dealing with one of the most prominent feature on this site, negative and chastise the unaware and unsuspecting souls posting from the most inoffensive line to the most complicated philosophical theory.

Have subscribed to the free version, and also agree the offline version will be appreciated, and you have provided info on this matter.

In the interim Copied/Pasted one of the routine lists provided by a contributor, as test, I suppose this list could be used as a template and updated every time an item is checked?

In any case, the copied list on my word processor will add the functionality and keeping records until your project adds the offline.?

Keep the faith

[sailingharry]

I have just started playing with the program. The first stumbling block -- neither of my sailboats are in your database.


My first boat was a Sabre 34. I'll wager 98% of the users on this forum have heard of and probably seen a Sabre sailboat. They aren't a big production like Hunter and Catalina (you have those two brands), but they were a significant player in years past and there are many out there.


My current boat is a Saga 43. This is a "production boat" but production tapped out at 54 hulls (probably closer to 150 if you count all the models they made). While it's a limited number of boats, probably a quarter of the users on this forum have heard of the brand.

I tested another brand, the Outbound. That's another brand that many lust after even if it's a fairly limited (and very expensive!) brand.


I'd suggest you up your database of production boats.

[grantmc]

Originally Posted by sailingharry

I have just started playing with the program. The first stumbling block -- neither of my sailboats are in your database.

My first boat was a Sabre 34. ...
My current boat is a Saga 43. ...

I'd suggest you up your database of production boats.

I think that is a bit harsh Harry. The system facilitates adding any boat with some basic specifications. It doesn't need to be in their database. Neither of my boats are listed either but it was very simple to add them in. I'm not really sure if such data is even needed.

Now I tried to get in to the Boat DB (rather than the Boat App), but nothing I did got me there. It always reverted to the Boat App. So I could never see what that did.

I should clarify after reading the earlier posts about version 1 vs 2 and how 1 is a phone app and 2 is a laptop app. I have not tried the phone app at all. I've done everything on my laptop, so presumably I'm always using version 2. The settings don't actually display the version of the code.

The app, the Boat App, seems to be about the user managing their
Mileage and log entries
maintenance work,
inventory,
and to do and checklists.

I think that the idea of this App is great, and it's a good start.
An obvious missing item are costs, well I see that the word is displayed with some outputs plus there are graphs and displays in the promo material too, but I was never able to figure out where any costs are actually entered (apart from original boat cost). So how you get graphs and the like I am mystified. Yes I am using a 90 day trial of the Gold version.

Fixed and running costs. I can't even see a way of entering fuel purchases, let alone all the never ending demands of my money for mooring fees, racing fees, subscriptions, toys, team clothing, boat gear, engine maintenance, sails, running rigging and associated stuff etc etc.

Another limitation is the choice of measurement units. It only offers imperial or metric. But we are more nuanced. So just take gallons, different countries have different quantities in their gallons. Here in NZ we are metric, but we sail nautical miles not kilometres and our speed is measured in knots not km p/h. But my boat was built when we were still largely imperial so measured in feet, but mooring fingers are in metres, oh the confusion and the contradictions!

Also, perhaps the target audience is too wide. It seems to me to be aimed at the Western European market, at least the British market. And Britain isn't even part of Europe now; it took several years, but finally 31 January 2020 they'd finally completed towing Britain way out in to the middle of the Atlantic But seriously the app needs a great deal more work to internatioalise the software. You probably don't have VAT Harry, and we certainly don't here. The NZ currency isn't even offered, let alone Fijian.

I wonder what information being captured will be made public? For example there is the possibility of providing running costs across, say, a range of Saga 43s once a few have signed up. This could be done (ie averages only) without divulging anything personal. Obviously that assumes running costs are entered (as I said above if they are, I couldn't find how).

One blaring omission, in my view, is a lack of the dreaded 'Mooring' and related costs. So assume a boat is kept in a marina, then there's at minimum a fixed periodic charge, plus potentially a power usage, and other costs, particularly if a live aboard. It would be very interesting to be able to compare marina costs within geographic areas, even if just for temporary visits whilst on a trip. And the promo material suggests that sort of meta data.

Something too I've not figured out is why I would want to have the 'Gold' version. I found a comparison of the features vanilla vs Gold, but the only difference were the alerts (10 vs 100 and why I'd want alerts I do not know), and data storage 300MB vs 3,000MB, oh plus adverts on the free vanilla. Something too that perhaps is available but I couldn't find it and that's the ability to extract the data that is loaded. Will Marine Data Cloud Ltd still be around in 10 years, who knows? Will I care about my log of 10 years before, well yes I will. And I have my logs back to 2003. OK I'm a hoarder but it's nice to read about things long past sometimes.

And a technical issue. The App is very slow to respond and act.

The reality is that this product is still very much a work in progress and until it offers more I wont be paying 49.9 euroes (NZ$80) per annum. And I have to say I really can't see any difference in using the software today than when I tried it nearly 3 months ago. What are the developers doing?

[Island Time O25]

The only way today a platform will become popular enough among the average Joe and Jane boaters if it integrates a bunch of now stand alone programs i.e. OPEN/CPN, Active Captain, Excel spreadsheets, anchor alarms, weather, tides, etc. How feasible such program may be without charging its users more than a few dollars, if at all, remains to be seen. But I am surprised that the boating (or IT) industry has not come up with such an app/platform.

A few years back, when I replaced my then 7 year old first gen smartphone with more up to date version in my excitement I installed a good bunch of boating apps. I ended up decluttering and uninstalling most of them except a few which I ended up using regularly. It would be nice to have everything in one app and hopefully ad based and thus free to use or very low cost. Not sure there are enough boat owners/users to justify mega investment needed to develop such a comprehensive app.

[MarineDataCloud]

Originally Posted by davil

MarineDataCloud

thank you for your postings and infinite patience dealing with one of the most prominent feature on this site, negative and chastise the unaware and unsuspecting souls posting from the most inoffensive line to the most complicated philosophical theory.

Have subscribed to the free version, and also agree the offline version will be appreciated, and you have provided info on this matter.

In the interim Copied/Pasted one of the routine lists provided by a contributor, as test, I suppose this list could be used as a template and updated every time an item is checked?

In any case, the copied list on my word processor will add the functionality and keeping records until your project adds the offline.?

Keep the faith

Hello dear Davil,

About the Checklists, when you find a useful one, you may FOLLOW it, in which case you can check/uncheck the Checklist's items as if the list was made by you but you may not add/remove items. The advantage of FOLLOW is that once the Checklist owner revises/updates the checklist with more points/steps/items, you get this latest version automatically. Alternatively, you may COPY a Checklist, in which case is as if you made it on your own and you can add/remove items BUT you'll not get any updates if the original Checklist gets updated.

You may read more on the Support Portal (see especially the last tutorial of Follow vs. Copy):

• Checklists
• Checklists Best Practices: How to Maintain your Public Checklists
• Checklists Best Practices: Follow or Copy a Public Checklist?

Offline proved tough and is coming up in a couple of more months. Until then, stick with the web please, even via a mobile browser!

Thanking you I wish you good health and an always seaworthy boat!

[davil]