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MartinR · 10-09-2019, 00:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by skipperpete

Probably TBT.... what's the US position on commercial ship anti fouling composition?

No, TBT is not used anymore. Self polishing copper based paints. As commercial vessels move at good speed and most of the time, these paints work very well. A good antifouling system lasts 5 years without significant growth.

The same actually for us, most of the fouling happens when we are in port or at anchor.

jmh2002 · 10-09-2019, 01:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I heard that it happened during ballasting; possibly there was a fault in the system (note the shocking condition of the ballast tank systems on the Hoegh Osaka -- did you read the accident report?).

Thanks for the heads up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_H%C3%B6egh_Osaka

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wikipedia

The investigation found that plans for the loading of the cargo had not been changed despite the change in itinerary. No calculation of the vessel's stability had been made, a practice found to be common across many operators' fleets. The weight of cargo on board had been underestimated, being 265 tonnes greater than estimated... The ship's ballast water system was not fully serviceable, all but one of the gauges for each ballast tank were unserviceable, a situation that had existed since at least July 2014.

Unbelievable, but the report states that it is common practice

So yes maybe a similar situation occurred on the MV Golden Ray.

clownfishsydney · 10-09-2019, 01:34

All crew now rescued. Looks like it may have hit bottom as not much seems to be in the water from photos.

MicHughV · 10-09-2019, 12:58

the fact that this ship appears to be lying in relatively shallow water, makes me wonder if one side of the ship was not sliding up and over a sandbar or shallow area alongside the main channel at the same time doing a turn......this would give the needed impetus for an unbalanced or top heavy ship to start rotating or they might have been filling the wrong ballast tanks....??

When the ship left the dock, it was likely plumb to the water, as an unbalanced ship would have surely attracted attention from someone. That the ship was likely balanced but top heavy comes into question, needing only a shove to send it over. The ship was supposedly already "top heavy" but "balanced" upon leaving the dock and had travelled some distance before this disaster, so " something" had to " induce" the rotation..it didn't just " happen"....

Many questions....though I have been in at the Brunswick ship channel, I can't recall if there are " range markers" there to enable a pilot to judge whether or not he is in the channel, but " something" must have "induced" the rotation otherwise it could have just as easily rotated while still at the dock.

**a64pilot** · 10-09-2019, 13:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by IslandHopper

I know that, but thats not what you meant....

Yes it is what I meant, they drilled a hole. Established communications, even passed them water and food.
Why not cut a hole large enough to extract them? It is what was eventually done wasn’t it?
I believe if I’m not mistaken it was at least 24 hours from the time the hole was drilled and food and water was passed until they were cut out, if so that seems like a long time.
My assumption is the ship is laying on the bottom and sinking is not a concern, but if there was a fire, then time is of the essence.

**a64pilot** · 10-09-2019, 13:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmh2002

Thanks for the heads up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_H%C3%B6egh_Osaka

Unbelievable, but the report states that it is common practice

So yes maybe a similar situation occurred on the MV Golden Ray.

I doubt they did any weight and ballast computations. I believe these ships exist solely to carry new Kia’s to market, so yes they only carry cars I believe, and I’d bet one load of 4200 Kia’s weight is very similar to the next load of 4200 Kia’s.
I believe Kia and Hyundai May actually be the same, like a GMC and Chevrolet truck for example, actually the same company.

I Believe those cars come from here and the production rate is as much as 300,000 per year? Or basically close to 1,000 cars a day, 365 days a year.
So that ship was carrying a weeks worth of production?
I really don’t know, but they flow out of that plant like popcorn.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyun...turing_Alabama

Ok, I’m wrong, apparently they produce a vehicle every 57 sec, 24 hours a day, 5 days a week.
https://www.georgiamanufacturingalli...--west-point--

MicHughV · 10-09-2019, 13:36

the USCG was concerned about fire....so cutting thru' the hull with an oxy-acetylene torch was ruled out. Instead they drilled a serious of " holes" in the shape of a square...2'x 3'....not very big at all.....not sure how thick the plating is but that must have taken considerable time. Once all the holes were drilled, they still had to saw cut from one hole to the next to enable them to lift the center piece out.....then I'm sure all the jagged edges must have been ground down, then they still had to arrange to lift the men out...and " find" the 4th man. All this on a sloping surface.
In the meantime, the 4 men inside were in total darkness and insufferable heat.
Altogether, a marvelous achievement by all involved !!!
I have added respect for the USCG !!!

MicHughV · 10-09-2019, 17:33

Just some random thoughts.
The route away from the dock implies this ship first had to make a sharp turn to the left....just before Jekyll Island.....and all was well there...then the ship had to make another sharp turn to the right to head out to sea .....which is where it flopped over....and it flopped to the port side......which makes sense...considering the turn to right.
There also seems to be a green marker with white bands on it on the port side....er....deck side...not sure what to make of it all as that marker is not familiar to me, but maybe I'm not seeing it right, as one would think the markers on that side of the ship should all be red. The ship had a pilot onboard, who one assumes knows these waters like the back of his hand.
The overturned ship does not seem to in deep water either, judging by the amount of superstructure exposed..
These ships leaving the Port of Brunswick are not typically at full speed while negotiating the channel, but maybe it was ?....a sharp to the right at speed could have set the wheels in motion...
The mind ponders... because if the ship was " top-heavy" it could just as easily have flopped over on that first bend to the left ??..or maybe it was still going slow at that point ?

"official" accounts that I'm hearing and seeing appears to indicate that the " authorities" are as mystified as I am about this occurrence.

I guess we will find out soon enuff.

I will be interested to see how they are going to right this ship and remove it.
Not a good time to be an insurance company.

**a64pilot** · 10-09-2019, 18:13

I’m going to go out on a limb and bet that ship was self insured, pretty sure it was owned by Hyundai, and that they can write it off with petty cash.
Lord knows how many billions of dollars that company does a year.

**a64pilot** · 10-09-2019, 18:14

Anybody have a mark on the chart on where this ship rests?
I’m trying to think of where it must be.

Jdege · 10-09-2019, 20:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by MicHughV

hard to believe that the tiny town of Brunswick is considered a " Port".....but it is....like Fernandina, J'ville, Savannah, etc.....these " ports" are located on a river...sometimes way up a river....
People think of a port as being right at the ocean's edge...a logical place for a " port".....ie, Cape Town....etc...but many ports are " inside" some or other water body...

In the case of Brunswick, there are also big tidal differences, tidal currents, several bends, etc...

Finally, every port usually has a local "pilot" on the ship, guiding ships leaving or entering and I am wondering if this came into play...

A very unusual occurrence, no doubt....the lawyers will have a fun time sorting this out..

I'm from Minnesota.
Duluth is a port - and so is St. Paul.

**Dockhead** · 11-09-2019, 03:05

I was puzzled by this comment as well. I guess half the world's great ports are way up rivers - Hamburg? Shanghai? London? Southampton? New Orleans? What is un-portlike about that?

Hamburg is what, 50 miles up the Elbe? How far up the Thames is London, the world's greatest port for centuries?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jdege

I'm from Minnesota.
Duluth is a port - and so is St. Paul.

Alan Mighty · 11-09-2019, 04:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I’m going to go out on a limb and bet that ship was self insured, pretty sure it was owned by Hyundai, and that they can write it off with petty cash.
Lord knows how many billions of dollars that company does a year.

Oddly enough that's not what the Korean press thinks or how the Korean stock market players see the incident. See: Cargo ship overturn to hurt Hyundai Glovis

Jdege · 11-09-2019, 07:12

Duluth is 2038 nautical miles from the ocean (2342 statue miles, 3700 kilometers).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I was puzzled by this comment as well. I guess half the world's great ports are way up rivers - Hamburg? Shanghai? London? Southampton? New Orleans? What is un-portlike about that?

Hamburg is what, 50 miles up the Elbe? How far up the Thames is London, the world's greatest port for centuries?