LOA Vs actual chargeable length

[condo]

Does anyone have a monohull around 13.7 published LOA e.g. Dufour 455 or Sun Odyssey 45.2 that can tell me the actual length. I will be buying a boat shortly and my only experience of this issue has been a Bavaria 42 LOA 12.9 but actual 13.06 and Sun Odyssey 45.2 LOA 13.74 actual length 14.15. I received a quote from a marina quoting the LOA and was told that the boat will be physically measured on arrival.I would like to keep the boat under 14 m .Are all the manufacturers LOAs measured to the GRP? Do I need a boat to be well under 14 (around 13.4) to have any hope of keeping it under 14.I'm very interested in the actual length of a Dufour 455 but any comparison would be useful?

[boatman61]

A lot of marinas are getting very picky on LOA lately as boats are becoming ever more encumbered with 'add ons'.
A marina will charge an LOA rate based on the length from your bowsprit/anchor all the way back to your dinghy slung on the davits or solar arch, whatever..
Its all about the money and no more 'getting away with it'.

[denverd0n]

The advertised LOA for a lot of boats is actually the LOD (length on deck). It very often excludes the bowsprit (if there is one) and/or the swim platform (if it is not molded in, but rather added on). And, like boatman said, a lot of marinas will measure, to get the full length from the very most forward point, to the very most aft point. But then, there are also some marinas that will accept whatever the manufacturer says; if they call it a 13-meter boat, then they'll charge you for 13 meters. So it really depends on the particular marina, and what you may have hanging off the ends of your particular boat.

Good luck.

[rslifkin]

It definitely varies by marina. If there's no obvious add ons like davits hanging off, many are happy to accept the manufacturer's length number. Others will measure (more common on an end dock where your length affects how much usable space they have for other boats). And some also have a minimum length for a given slip, so you pay for the minimum length or the length of your boat, whichever is longer.

[Joh.Ghurt]

You need to read the fine-print of the vendors:

Here's the specification for the Bavaria c42:
Length overall: 12.38m
Length overall including bowsprit: 12.90m
Hull lenght: 11.99m
Waterline: 11.27m

Most likely you're going to pay for 12.90m. If you install a wind-vane or davits, add those too.

In my experience, they take the highest number in the registration papers or they come an measure themselves generously in their favour. This makes retractable bowsprits and trimarans able to pull in their amas attractive.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Joh.Ghurt

You need to read the fine-print of the vendors:

Here's the specification for the Bavaria c42:
Length overall: 12.38m
Length overall including bowsprit: 12.90m
Hull lenght: 11.99m
Waterline: 11.27m

Most likely you're going to pay for 12.90m. If you install a wind-vane or davits, add those too.

In my experience, they take the highest number in the registration papers or they come an measure themselves generously in their favour. This makes retractable bowsprits and trimarans able to pull in their amas attractive.

Most likely he'll pay for a berth that's allocated for boats from 12 to 14 metres if he's in Europe as most marinas have a set price per berth capability, so if your boat is 12.5m you pay the same as a boat that's 13.95m because that's your bracket.
6 to 8, 8 to 10, 10 to 12, 12 to 14 metres and so on..

[CarinaPDX]

There doesn't seem to be a lot of consistency to it all. When I documented Carina the local USCG Documentation Officer had me use LOD, but these days all documentation is done in one central location and I think that they include the bowsprit in the calculation (or at least other districts included it). When entering a marina while cruising I presented my document when checking in and that length was almost always accepted. I did have an awkward experience once where the marina owner later saw the bowsprit and thought I had cheated him. When actually asked the length of the boat I always provided both LOD and LOA, pointing out the bowsprit, but usually marinas wanted to see the document rather than take my word for it. An increasing number of marinas do want to include dinghy davits, swim platforms, and wind vanes in the length, and even have a scale on the side of the check-in dock. It doesn't help that a few cruisers do lie about their overall length. BTW the marina at Elsinore, Denmark, charges by the beam (not the length) as the limiting factor for tying up is squeezing between the two pilings.

Greg

[Belezar]

It varies lease to lease. The marina my boat is in now measures, so I said fine and took the dink off the davits. It would not have been in the way, but whatever. It’s marketing and legal working together. You can advertise a lower price per foot and then ding someone for a sprit or davits or rounding. I think it’s pissy nickel and dime bs but it is the policy at places. The lessor sets the rules.

[chrisr]

on the rare occasion we visit a marina, they've include the davits and dink in the overall length

don't forget to include this if you have such

cheers,

[Joh.Ghurt]

Originally Posted by CarinaPDX

BTW the marina at Elsinore, Denmark, charges by the beam (not the length) as the limiting factor for tying up is squeezing between the two pilings.

In the last years I came across a few marinas that charged by the bounding box area.

LOA including bow sprits * beam * base price

Depending on the type of space you fill, the base price changes too. If you're over 12m, you need pay the 12m-15m base price, which naturally was more than the 9-11 base price.

[billgewater]

Yes, it varies. Our marina has "categories". 12 m, 15 m, 18 m and 22 m. It makes management simple. You may own an 11 m boat but if there are not enough 12 m pens available, you may be put into a 15 m pen and you will be charged the same as any other 15 m pen user. An 18 m pen is not 18 m long, but rather can accommodate a boat with overall length of 18 m or less. Usually bows or stern well overhang the pen length.
Multihulls are usually charged 1.3 times the normal monohull fee as their pens are actually much wider.
If you were tied alongside a long jetty then being charged for the actual length you require to accommodate your boat makes sense.

But hey! Marina's are there to make money. They are not benevolent societies. (Unless it is a club marina or provided by a government body or local council.)

Some marinas also offer discounts during times when the marina business is quiet and jack up the fees when demand is higher. Some add on for power/water useage as well.
Some also insist on period slots. e.g. you pay for a minimum of a month even if you stay for only two weeks etc.

So it really pays to check out exactly how they charge.

[Seymore]

When the narina guy asks "How long is your boat?" I answer:

"I say it the right way. The LOA, length overall, from stem to stern, is 32 feet. My boat has a bowsprit and a boomkin, so the _sparred length is 39 feet. The waterline length is 27.5 feet."

"Why do I need to know the waterline length?" he says.

"Because when you haul the boat and paint the bottom, I'll try to talk you into basing the charges on the waterline length!" I say.

"Fat chance" he says....

[Seymore]

Seriously, Wikipedia has a real good technical explanation of these terms, but I can't find it real fast now.

LOA, length overall, is length from stem to stern, measured in a theoretical straight line on deck.

Tonnage is a VOLUME MEASUREMENT! A tonne was a standard cask of wine in medieval times, about equivalent to 100 cubic feet(?), so the tonnage of a ship is the volume of the cargo hold, in units of casks of wine, that is, how many casks of wine it can carry. From LOA and tonnage of a ship, a medieval merchant could know how much of his goods the ship could carry.

Displacement is the weight of a ship.

That's why, on the documentation for my Westsail 32, the tonnage is 4.3 tons, when the displacement is 10 tons. The living space is 4.3 casks of wine.

Sparred length is my term for how much dock my boat will need.

[WPregler]

Keep in mind liabilities as well.
With so many add ons marina space can get dicy. I've been in marinas where they don't want your bow spirit anywhere near (over) the walkable dock ... Nor your dingy extending out so far as to obstruct passag for other boats. It's the marinas call.
Gravy Boat

[mariner-dovb]

I had a discussion with the harbourmaster of a society-owned marina. The harbourmaster wanted to charge me for the laying mast (about 16m). In the regulations of that society was defined "Länge über Alles" (LÜA) (=LOA). I found out, that in Germany LÜA is an officially defined length, which included the hull only and excluded all detachable parts as load (in my case the laying mast), rudder, anchor, and even bowsprit.

So the discussion was settled with the bare measurement of the hull. (in my case 13m for a 43' boat)