Running windlass with LFP

[Baronkrak]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

Obviously if, for example, at a 1000kg (2200. Lbs) load the windlass is capable of retrieving chain at 10m/min its maximum retrieval capacity is not 533 kg (1175 Lbs) as you stated in post #22.

Your windlass can only retrieve 533 kg, Maxwell specification:
Pull Capacity 533 kg
cont. run (1) 1175 lb

Originally Posted by noelex 77

Absolutely. The maximum pull capacity of the windlass is 1818 kg (4000 lb). Below this limit the windlass will retrieve chain, above this number the windlass can no longer turn.

Absolutely. The maximum pull capacity of the windlass is 1818 kg (4000 lb), (Maxwell). Below this limit the windlass can hold chain, above this number the windlass can be damaged.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Baronkrak

Your windlass can only retrieve 533 kg, Maxwell specification:
Pull Capacity 533 kg
cont. run (1) 1175 lb


Absolutely. The maximum pull capacity of the windlass is 1818 kg (4000 lb), (Maxwell). Below this limit the windlass can hold chain, above this number the windlass can be damaged.

You're not understanding the specs at all. 1175 lbs is the maximum continuous pulling capacity. Up to that, you can run the windlass continuously without hurting it. Above that (up to 4000 lbs) it'll still pull, but you'll eventually overheat the motor. By the time you get to the 4000 lb limit and the motor stalls, you'd only be able to run it for a few seconds at a time most likely.

Because there's no listed static hold for the Maxwell 4000, we don't know how far above 4000 lbs mechanical damage will occur or how much tension it'll take for the windlass to slip backward without the motor running.

The 4000 lbs isn't published as a mechanical limit, it's an electrical one. So the breaking load where you'd actually damage that windlass is unknown. All we know is that it's more than 4000 lbs. But we don't know how much more, as the information just isn't available.

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Baronkrak

Absolutely. The maximum pull capacity of the windlass is 1818 kg (4000 lb), (Maxwell). Below this limit the windlass can hold chain

If you refer to the graph it clearly shows that below 1818 kg (4000 lb) there is a positive retrieval speed. Thus below 1818 kg (4000 lb) the windlass is capable of retrieving and not just holding chain.

[Baronkrak]

Originally Posted by noelex 77

If you refer to the graph it clearly shows that below 1818 kg (4000 lb) there is a positive retrieval speed. Thus below 1818 kg (4000 lb) the windlass is capable of retrieving and not just holding chain.

From the graph locate point 1 on the current curve; draw a vertical line to the load axis. What do you read?

[Baronkrak]

Originally Posted by rslifkin

but you'll eventually overheat the motor.

What’s good about that?

[noelex 77]

Originally Posted by Baronkrak

From the graph locate point 1 on the current curve; draw a vertical line to the load axis. What do you read?

The graph also shows retrieval speed versus load (this is outlined in red in post #30).

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by Baronkrak

What’s good about that?

Nothing. But that just means you need to be aware that if you're retrieving beyond the continuous rating (such as if you've got a big, heavy cable fouled on your anchor), you can't just blindly hold the button down. Instead, you'll have to retrieve a bit, pause for motor cooling, then retrieve a bit more. And of course, it retrieves slower at heavier loads. Depending on how the breaker is sized, you'll likely trip the breaker before you overheat the motor if you work the windlass too hard for too long.

So the windlass should be sized such that normal lifting of the ground tackle is within the continuous rating, but it has short-term ability to handle pulling heavier loads to account for abnormal situations.

[SOLAR SUPPORT]

I used 2x200Ah parallel connected 12V Drop-in Lifepo4 service batteries in my sail boat during the last summer season.

I can run a 1000Watt windlass, 1000Watt E-winch, 2000Watt inverter without any problems. Two 150A capacity Bms allow 300A continuous discharge and 600A instant discharge in total. I use 50% of these capacities without any problems.

Finally, I added a connection switch to manually parallel connect the 90A capacity LA motor battery with Lifepo4 service batteries only in case of emergency.

During the cold start of my VP D130 engine, you can watch the total current drawn by the starter motor and the measurement of the boost current used from the service batteries in the attached video.

https://youtu.be/XXUlP5-hBB0

[mikereed100]

Originally Posted by lateral

If you are retrieving from cockpit, would an ammeter there be a useful addition?
Also, what back emf protection on shut off would be prudent to install?
I guess you can manually isolate sensitive electronics, or as previously suggested, bypass
the bms('s) as a cheap solution. A "T" class plus suitable ANL inline of course. Not ABYC compliant though.

I'm not an electrical engineer, but I suspect that an ammeter may not catch the inrush amps. I have watched my Victron battery monitor while using the windlass with the engines off and never saw more than an 80 amp draw, although it is likely it spiked much higher than that.

[mikereed100]

Back to the original question (remember the original question?), I contacted Kilovault and they said that a couple of their 200a batteries in parallel should have no problem with the inrush loads of a 1000w windlass.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by mikereed100

Back to the original question (remember the original question?), I contacted Kilovault and they said that a couple of their 200a batteries in parallel should have no problem with the inrush loads of a 1000w windlass.

Thanks for getting back on topic!!! I think I will ask my manufacturer and see what they say.

[nfbr]

Victron batts dont have FET BMS, so you can load them much higher.
Or DIY CALB/EVE, and use a solenoid, draw 3C no worries.

[lifeofreilly57]

I have 600 amps of KiloVolt lithium, on a 47 foot 40,000 lb boat with a 60 kg anchor and Maxwell windlass, it's never been a problem. Of course I don't use the windlass to do all the work, I usually idle the motr forward while the windlass winds in, which is really how you should. If the anchor is really stuck we let the wave action pull it out, or run slightly over the anchor to get it out. we've never had an issue with the batteries, we've tripped the breaker once or twice, but it's rated pretty close to the windlass load.
The built in BMS is not possible to bypass and shouldn't ever be attempted.
Our windlass is wired directly to the battery distribution block and ground block with it's own proprietary breaker.
Since your looking to replace your batteries and upgrade to lithium it's a good time to wire your battery compartment to ABYC standards, which is what I did, it simplified the the wiring in the compartment and allowed me to put wire labels on everything, which has made trouble shooting much easier. Having multiple connections to a battery post is bad ju ju, it's a problem waiting to happen, with the discharge rate of lithium it's also quite dangerous.
Don't forget that if your charging system is older you'll most likely have to change controllers to lithium programmable ones, in my case the solar controller was relatively new, but the alternator controller was not, I used a Balmar controller and reduced the output rate to avoid smoking the 200 amp alternator. I also had to re-program my inverter/charger for the batteries.
Waht type of charging systems do you aboard currently?
3 years in I've had no issues with the setup, but did do my due diligence when installing and setting it up. It was a game changer compared to the lead acid batteries I had before.

[mikereed100]

Good to hear your Kilovault drop ins are working out for you. All of my charging sources are programmable for LFP and I will be upgrading my stock 100a altermators and old Xantrax regulators to more robust Balmer 100a alternators with Balmer regulators. One challenge I face with my cat is that my starboard alternator is about 30' from my house bank so programming the regulator will take a bit of care. Even with 4/0 cabling I can expect a 2.5% voltage drop between the alternator and batteries. This means that if I program my regulator to deliver 14.4 volts I will end up with only about 14.0 volts at the battery. My plan is to measure the voltage at the battery with the engine running and adjust the regulator accordingly. Also planning to set the belt load manager to limit the output to 50 amps initially, then move up to 70 amps incrementally over time, checking temps as I go.

[rslifkin]

Originally Posted by mikereed100

Even with 4/0 cabling I can expect a 2.5% voltage drop between the alternator and batteries. This means that if I program my regulator to deliver 14.4 volts I will end up with only about 14.0 volts at the battery.

That will only be the case at full output. As the batteries get near full and the amps being carried decrease, the voltage drop will also decrease. It would be better to provide the voltage sense to the alternator regulator from the far end of the cable and allow the regulator to automatically compensate for voltage drop.