Canadian COVID-19 News

[deblen]

I think it's just the "Upper Canadian" coming out.

[AKA-None]

Originally Posted by Scorpius

Would someone please explain the difference between efficacy and effectiveness. Why must such unusual words be used when speaking to lay people? It brings to mind medieval High Priests.

A one liter engine may be efficient with respect to fuel economy but not be effective to move a thousand foot ship

Does that help?

[GordMay]

What is the difference between efficacy and effectiveness?
Efficacy is the degree to which a vaccine prevents disease, and possibly also transmission, under ideal and controlled circumstances – comparing a vaccinated group with a placebo group.
Effectiveness refers to how well it performs in the real world.

Although a vaccine that has high efficacy – such as Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccine with 94.5% efficacy and Pfizer’s with 90% efficacy – would be expected to be highly effective in the real world, it is unlikely to translate into the same effectiveness in practice.
See ➥ https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/wh...-effectiveness

The difference allows one to write/speak with precision.

[Mike OReilly]

There's an interesting story in the Globe looking at the challenges of increasing vaccine rates. Based on surveys and other social data it's clear we have a small, but not insignificant, anti-vax group who are unreachable. But we have a larger group with complex and differing challenges that currently put them in the "hesitant" category.

Reaching this second group is likely going to be the key to whether we can achieve effective herd immunity.

Who in Canada hasn’t been vaccinated against COVID-19 yet, and what’s the plan going forward?

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

There's an interesting story in the Globe looking at the challenges of increasing vaccine rates. Based on surveys and other social data it's clear we have a small, but not insignificant, anti-vax group who are unreachable. But we have a larger group with complex and differing challenges that currently put them in the "hesitant" category.

Reaching this second group is likely going to be the key to whether we can achieve effective herd immunity.

Oh, we WILL reach "herd immunity". The only question is how much of that immunity will be achieved in a fast, lower-risk fashion through immunization, vs the slower, riskier process of getting infected.

[sv_pelagia]

Interesting Univ. Washington modelling showing possible "true" Covid-19 death rates (per 100,000).

http://www.healthdata.org/special-an...ovid-19-deaths

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Oh, we WILL reach "herd immunity". The only question is how much of that immunity will be achieved in a fast, lower-risk fashion through immunization, vs the slower, riskier process of getting infected.

Yes... true. Unless the virus kills us off, we will eventually develop reasonable herd immunity, or rather protection. But as you say (or imply), this could still leave a lot of bodies on the ground .

Evolution doesn't care about the individual. Its a mechanism that works at the species level. It's us pesky individuals who keep trying to survive and thrive .

[desodave]

Yes ... herd immunity will be for those in the future herd left standing, not all of us in today's herd

[danstanford]

Originally Posted by desodave

Yes ... herd immunity will be for those in the future herd left standing, not all of us in today's herd

I have been vaccinated and believe in all the good things it does for our society so I am not disagreeing with the concept of vaccination being the best way out of this.

Of all the people choosing not to get vaccinated, only one in 1500 of them will die of it and one in 40 will get it.

I don't want me or you or someone we know to die of Covid but the ones who choose not to protect themselves are statistically not in much danger compared to many other risks we take every day. Twice that many people will die who choose to smoke for example.

There is no reason for me to respond here and I debated with myself about doing so but frankly I am distressed at our inability to assess risk. So many seem to see this as binary where Covid infection equals death. If we treated all risks this way we certainly wouldn't be heading out on big water in a boat.

My apologies for the rant. Dan

[Mike OReilly]

If this is accurate Dan that places it below the risk of death from stuff like heart disease, cancer or skydiving, but higher than diabetes, influenza or even traffic accident death.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by danstanford

Of all the people choosing not to get vaccinated, only one in 1500 of them will die of it and one in 40 will get it.

I don't want me or you or someone we know to die of Covid but the ones who choose not to protect themselves are statistically not in much danger compared to many other risks we take every day. Twice that many people will die who choose to smoke for example.

All true... but vaccination isn't just to protect oneself.

I don't much care what death-defying habits someone picks up, if it's legal and doesn't hurt anyone else. I do care about whether we're working together as sensible adults to minimize the threat of COVID to everybody. The idea is to stop COVID circulating, period. If not enough people are immune (one way or another), then COVID will hang around longer, like the smoldering roots of an extinguished forest fire.

btw - the actual risk of infection of the unvaccinated is now considerably lower than what you've cited. Why? Because most of us bothered to get vaccinated.

[GordMay]

Canada to recommend mixing and matching AstraZeneca, Pfizer and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines
NACI guidance based on early research from U.K., Spain that shows mixing shots is safe and effective
➥ https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/canad...naci-1.6048152

Mixing COVID-19 vaccine doses leads to more reactions, study finds, which may be 'first sign of success'
➥ https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/vacci...oses-1.6023830

Spanish study finds AstraZeneca vaccine followed by Pfizer dose is safe and effective
➥ https://www.reuters.com/business/hea...fe-2021-05-18/

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Canada to recommend mixing and matching AstraZeneca, Pfizer and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines
NACI guidance based on early research from U.K., Spain that shows mixing shots is safe and effective
➥ https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/canad...naci-1.6048152

Mixing COVID-19 vaccine doses leads to more reactions, study finds, which may be 'first sign of success'
➥ https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/vacci...oses-1.6023830

Spanish study finds AstraZeneca vaccine followed by Pfizer dose is safe and effective
➥ https://www.reuters.com/business/hea...fe-2021-05-18/

WHAT??? They just finished telling us that AZ users will not be mixing and matching and that we WILL be getting a second dose of AZ!!!

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by pcmm

WHAT??? They just finished telling us that AZ users will not be mixing and matching and that we WILL be getting a second dose of AZ!!!

I believe that was a provincial decision. This "new" decision is at the federal level... what the provinces decided to do or not do is always up to them.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by NaClyDog

I believe that was a provincial decision. This "new" decision is at the federal level... what the provinces decided to do or not do is always up to them.

Just a little over a week ago NACI was recommending that vaccines continue to second does with like vaccines! (May 22nd )