Canadian COVID-19 News

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Yep. Ryden's Border Store. There's normally a LOT of traffic going back and forth there across the border every day. The thing is, there is no problem with Corona on either the US or Canadian side of there in the immediate area. There is a problem with Cook County on the US side because of the Grand Portage Indian Reservation. They are sovereign territory and they closed their border and have no intention of opening it no matter what. But there is no problems with it from southern Lake Superior shoreline, all the way up the North Shore to Thunder Bay. There is no deaths on this side since it started, there has been basically no "lockdown" because nobody obeyed it anyway. And on the Canada side I think it's like Superior - maybe a few cases, and I think the reported one death up there. But according our friends it was a guy in his 50's that already had some sort of health problems.

So the problem with Corona is mainly in the large population centers. It has not affected these rural areas.

We have the crane scheduled for a week from today to splash our boat so we can get generator and AC going on her. Our friends had hoped to be here for that. But I guess we'll have to send them a video instead.

That's the problem with two big honking countries like the US and Canada. Borders are controlled by the Feds, so whats happening in Windsor and Detroit controls whats going on in Coutts & Sweet Grass. I don't know about you Yanks, but it causes all sorts of bellyaching and whining here in the Great White North about regional disparities and favouritism.

But underneath it all...I think the majority of us are good with it right now. It just takes one infectious idiot to head from nowhereville Manitoba to Toronto and voila! And we have already had a few of the idiots come up here and it has served to get people riled up about it. Personally I would be ok if they could open the Washington / BC border to just visiting boaters who promise to stay out of populated areas, but it ain't gonna happen. In fact I doubt the situation will change until a majority of Canadians perceive that the US — all of the US — has COVID in a manageable state.

[Montanan]

Are any of you utilizing a Covid tracking / tracing app?

I have read that Alberta is a bit annoyed with the Canadian Federal Government as to the Fed's apparently are interfering with Alberta ability to resolve some security issues with Apple as to the app needing to always be on and runs in front of Apples log in thus makes a security issue if the phone owner losses their phone or it is stolen because its operating system remains open. The Fed's want a nationwide tracking app and do not want the Provinces to be deploying each their own so the Fed's apparently have requested that Apple not aid Alberta with resolving the technical issues.


https://www.alberta.ca/ab-trace-together.aspx

https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus-c...190048955.html

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Are any of you utilizing a Covid tracking / tracing app?

I have read that Alberta is a bit annoyed with the Canadian Federal Government as to the Fed's apparently are interfering with Alberta ability to resolve some security issues with Apple as to the app needing to always be on and runs in front of Apples log in thus makes a security issue if the phone owner losses their phone or it is stolen because its operating system remains open. The Fed's want a nationwide tracking app and do not want the Provinces to be deploying each their own so the Fed's apparently have requested that Apple not aid Alberta with resolving the technical issues.


https://www.alberta.ca/ab-trace-together.aspx

https://news.yahoo.com/coronavirus-c...190048955.html

Ya that's our version "fake news." The Provincial UCP gov't is trying to blame the Federal Liberals for whatever "nefarious" purpose... Apple has publicly stated that they allow only 1 api per country. It's got nothing to do with the feds trying to block Alberta. Such a lovely "information" age we live in...

Apple and Google today independently released guidelines public health authorities must follow to distribute contact tracing apps on Google Play or App Store for Android and iOS respectively. Guidelines for automated decentralized contact tracing apps to fight COVID-19 include a prohibition on location data collection, a limit of API use to one app per country, and no use in targeted advertising. The Exposure Notification API relies on Bluetooth Low Energy only, but contact tracing apps in some parts of the world collect GPS data.

https://venturebeat.com/2020/05/04/a...ng-guidelines/

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Alberta is a bitvery annoyed with the Canadian Federal Government.

There, fixed that for you mate.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by NaClyDog

There, fixed that for you mate.

Ah yes, from an American perspective, Canadian protesters be like:

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by Macblaze

In fact I doubt the situation will change until a majority of Canadians perceive that the US — all of the US — has COVID in a manageable state.

Why can't they implement some sort of medical pass? It's not like testing is non-existent anymore. In the big population centers they got long lines to get tested and it takes 5 days to get the results. Around here you can walk into Public Health and they'll test you out in 15 minutes, you got the results either same day or next day.

That would be science. But I don't think that's what's actually being used in making these decisions.

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Why can't they implement some sort of medical pass? It's not like testing is non-existent anymore. In the big population centers they got long lines to get tested and it takes 5 days to get the results. Around here you can walk into Public Health and they'll test you out in 15 minutes, you got the results either same day or next day.

That would be science. But I don't think that's what's actually being used in making these decisions.

I know this is kind of hard to grasp when you believe you are right (and I appreciate we all think we are "right") but there are two main reasons:

1. We Don't Want To.
2. Science isn't being used to make these decisions.

I mentioned before the gov't isn't in the business of doing what's logical and scientific for the benefit of the individual citizen. They are concerned with the overall welfare of the total population. It isn't in Canada's best interest to go around making a lot of specific exceptions and complicated rules to solve what is basically a simple problem: keeping the virus from spreading.

Ironically its simply a confluence of socialism and small government

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Why can't they implement some sort of medical pass? It's not like testing is non-existent anymore. In the big population centers they got long lines to get tested and it takes 5 days to get the results. Around here you can walk into Public Health and they'll test you out in 15 minutes, you got the results either same day or next day.

That would be science. But I don't think that's what's actually being used in making these decisions.

To add to what Macblaze said (which I 100% agree with), some people have ruined any chance of what you suggest working by saying they are "driving to Alaska" only to be caught doing other things.


If those were the people caught, how many people did the same and didn't get caught?


Until Canadians firmly believe they can trust visitors from south of the border, your suggestion will be a non-starter.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...aska-1.5621452
https://www.cochranetoday.ca/beyond-...l-park-2454809
https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/b-c-campg...tine-1.4982173

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by NaClyDog

Until Canadians firmly believe they can trust visitors from south of the border, your suggestion will be a non-starter.

It's actually a two-way street. The border closing to non-essential travel was agreed upon mutually by both countries. It is not just a Canadian decision.

So it is the same here. If you want to come to the US, you can. But you have to quarantine for 14 days and go thru one of 13 ports of entry. And vice versa, although I don't know if Canada has bio-medical ports of entry like the US has at the present time.

Just because you are Canadian, you ain't got no "free pass" in the US.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Why can't they implement some sort of medical pass? It's not like testing is non-existent anymore. In the big population centers they got long lines to get tested and it takes 5 days to get the results. Around here you can walk into Public Health and they'll test you out in 15 minutes, you got the results either same day or next day.

That would be science. But I don't think that's what's actually being used in making these decisions.

Presently there is a renewed shortage of required reagents in the USA and a backlog of laboratory analysis, so the swabs don't get resolved in a timely fashion.

By way of example, at the main county drive in testing facility in the major metropolitan area of northwest Montana, yesterday they discontinued testing asymptomatic persons and now are only test symptomatic persons and those tests take between 5 and 10 days to get results, which of course, doesn't mean you haven't been infected during the waiting period, your test result is "yesterday's news". Of keen issue is that the CDC presently estimates that 40% of Covid Positive persons are asymptomatic and those feel fine persons are responsible for 70% of community spread because they don't isolate themselves and inadvertently pass it along to others, thus one case, soon can become many. Not being able to test, trace and isolate means that there isn't a way to assertively intervene in removing those with the virus and isolate those that have been in contact. A delay in getting results means that exposures occur that might have been inhibited from happening if the infected person knew they were a carrier.

Montana has the second lowest number of Covid positive per capita in the USA, just behind Hawaii. But the positive case count has increased considerably in the last few weeks [still in the double digits] and only 32 deaths to date and but a handful of active hospitalizations,. The increase in likely do to importing the virus as the two week quarantine for all persons entering the state was lifted at the beginning of June and summer tourists are coming here because we have such a low case load in comparison, plus it is a pleasant time of year to be here, so we see a lot of southerners coming north to get away from their awful summer heat, humidity and bugs [the opposite of Snowbirders]. And the state had tried to greatly increase its daily testing rate, to 6,000 per day [with a total population of just over 1 million] but the requisite supply and analytical capacity has faltered under the extra load.

Hawaii today extended their two week quarantine yet again; this time until September 1st, so basically no tourist in that state and tourism accounts for about 30% of their economy, so a rough time for many out of work persons. But they have very little community spread by isolating themselves from the contagious haoles. Spending two weeks locked in your hotel room is not a great way to vacation.

Thanks for explaining the 1 api per country scheme, makes technical sense.

We do not have tracing apps deployed in the USA, yet.
I could just imagine all the outcries and conspiracies that would arise, if such was to be imposed, or even voluntarily recommended. Heck I know some people that get upset when they receive an automated Amber Alert [a child abduction / missing notice, a simple to be on the look-out for message]. I tell them to just imagine if it was their kid that was missing and you wanted everyone to look around to help in locating, but even then some still get all in a tizzy.

I will admit to being one of those smart phone / dumb user persons. Still trying to figure out how to connect a curly cord to my new Samsung phone and where one inserts a dime to be able to talk for three minutes. Ah, but I did get the hang of the Party line service, what with everyone on the shared line having a different ring tone and all.

[NaClyDog]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Just because you are Canadian, you ain't got no "free pass" in the US.

Nor do we want or expect one. For the most part, we are quite happy in our little igloos currently. Even though we are permitted to travel to Europe as of July 1st, we have delayed our trip for that very reason.

[Montanan]

Well with all the cases of Covid in the USA, there be enough to be able to discern the symptoms.

Today's update:

Congestion, runny nose, nausea and diarrhea are the four most recent COVID-19 symptoms that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention added to its growing list of potential signs of the novel coronavirus.

The CDC previously said symptoms include chills, fever, muscle pain, headache, sore throat and a new loss of taste or smell. The agency now lists 11 symptoms on its website.


People with COVID-19 have had a wide range of symptoms reported – ranging from mild symptoms to severe illness. Symptoms may appear 2-14 days after exposure to the virus, most commonly around 4-5 days. People with these symptoms may have COVID-19:

Fever or chills
Cough
Shortness of breath or difficulty breathing
Fatigue
Muscle or body aches
Headache
New loss of taste or smell
Sore throat
Congestion or runny nose
Nausea or vomiting
Diarrhea

This list does not include all possible symptoms. The CDC will continue to update this list as they learn more about COVID-19.

Doctors have also identified a symptom informally dubbed "COVID toes" – the presence of purple or blue lesions on a patient’s feet and toes.

For some patients, symptoms last months.

Individuals with COVID-19 may be most contagious one or two days before symptoms appear, one study found.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

...So the problem with Corona is mainly in the large population centers. It has not affected these rural areas.

In large federal states like Canada and the USA there is dramatic differences in infection rates across our vast lands. Here in Canada almost all our numbers come from Ontario and Quebec, and within that it's really just a few populated areas that account for the vast majority of cases.

You're correct, up here in NW Ont there have been very few cases, and I think only one (understandable) death. If we could create a Lake Superior bubble, encompassing just our cross-border region, that would be ideal, but international borders operate at nation-to-nation levels, and there's no way either side could guarantee that internal movement wouldn't bring in infectious people from elsewhere in our countries.

So unfortunately this leaves us with only one bad option: keep the border closed.

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Of keen issue is that the CDC presently estimates that 40% of Covid Positive persons are asymptomatic and those feel fine persons are responsible for 70% of community spread because they don't isolate themselves and inadvertently pass it along to others, thus one case, soon can become many.

That's what they suspected with us because of our positive anti-body tests when we went in. We're supposed to go back on Aug 5 and get another serum test. But my wife is not convinced they are even testing for the right thing with those serum tests. She thinks they are basically experimenting and making stabs in the dark. There are other coronaviruses, including the common cold and seasonal flu, that might stimulate production of those same proteins because they have similar genome.

So CDC can estimate all they want. But they really have no clue.

The one test that is pretty definitive is the viral test. And IMO that could be used for a medical pass to cross country borders. They would have to set up a system to do it on both sides to get the results back right away. But for cripes sakes, if they can send spaceships into orbit you'd think they'd be able to figure out something simple like that. Right?

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

That's what they suspected with us because of our positive anti-body tests when we went in. We're supposed to go back on Aug 5 and get another serum test. But my wife is not convinced they are even testing for the right thing with those serum tests. She thinks they are basically experimenting and making stabs in the dark. There are other coronaviruses, including the common cold and seasonal flu, that might stimulate production of those same proteins because they have similar genome.

So CDC can estimate all they want. But they really have no clue.

The one test that is pretty definitive is the viral test. And IMO that could be used for a medical pass to cross country borders. They would have to set up a system to do it on both sides to get the results back right away. But for cripes sakes, if they can send spaceships into orbit you'd think they'd be able to figure out something simple like that. Right?

You really are missing the point. While it is abundantly evident that you think we should move forward to open the border, using whatever science and testing that is at our disposal, you just don't seem to understand that the Canadian will to do so is missing. As you rightly point out, the science is more "stabbing in the dark" than 100% guaranteed. So why take the chance?