Canadian COVID-19 News

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by AiniA

Taxes on gas and other stuff is cheaper in the US, we do have to pay for our 'free' healthcare. The amount of tax when you import a boat depends on whether it was made in the US, Canada, or Mexico for that matter.

Their boat is an old Chris Craft like ours. It was built in Michigan. And still has the original 12V71 Detroits in it!

Your healthcare is not any more "free" or costly than ours. At the end of the day it still depends on the country's economy, people working and paying taxes to pay for it. If that dries up, so does the healthcare. Unless the Canadians have managed to cultivate the legendary "money trees" somewhere.

[Montanan]

Status of testing. Today Dr. Robert Redfield, director of the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, said although the United States has made major gains when it comes to coronavirus testing, it’s not time yet to do a “happy dance.”

“I think is a critical area; we need to continue to improve it. I think we've made enormous progress from eight to 12 weeks ago, but that's not to say that we should do a happy dance to say that we've got this done,” Redfield said Tuesday during a webinar with the Buck Institute.
“The reality is that the need for testing is obviously still there," he added.

Redfield said having to wait a week to get results back won’t do any good, as “by the time you take the test results back they are no longer actionable."
The goal, he said, is to get results back in 48 to 72 hours.

“I can just tell you we're continuing to work to try to continue to expand that,” Redfield added.

He also said that between March and May that the actual number of Covid infections in the USA was probably around 20 million. Ten times what the positive test results. Redfield said the US could have been having 150,000 to 200,000 infections a day, “even though we were only diagnosing 20,000 a day.”

The current situation is a “very, very significant problem right now,” he added. “This is a serious issue, as you know. We're currently diagnosing, say, 60,000 cases a day. I don't know how many infections that really represents,”

[Capn Jimbo]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

How about a medical checkpoint at the border crossings? I think the viral tests are recognized as being pretty accurate, and this is what is used at the US ports of entry at the airports.
.....

The actual lab process does not take very long. The antigen test takes less than 30 minutes in the lab.

In the United States and due to the current exponential explosion, there is little if any TTQ tracing and barely enough to test people showing up at the hospitals. The two big labs are slow. The testing lag time is 4 to 7 days, and even longer! Only some big city large hospitals are faster, and even then 2 days is not atypical.

Thorough and accurate border testing is not practical or possible. BTW there is no real PCR testing at US airports, just rough question screening and temperature checks. Flying remains dangerous.

Regarding tests, what you are really thinking of are the PCR tests, which are quite accurate (95%) - but this is entirely dependent on the sampling, which can be variable. Some patients who are clearly infected require multiple samples to get a positive.

Over 100 antibody tests were rushed to market without extensive review, and are horribly inaccurate for determining who may have recovered from Covid. Last are the so-called rapid tests - these are still not in wide or practical use, with only a couple being approved for emergency or research use only. The antigen tests are not close to being used in the front lines today - so far they are unpredictable insofar as accuracy. Hopefully they will improve, but will probably serve for rough screening only in the future.


The slow PCR test remains the gold standard, and in short supply.

[NaClyDog]

Folks, please. If it's not ABOUT CANADA it does NOT belong here.


Thanks.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

Honestly, I think the results on herd immunity are still up for discussion.

Of course it is. All of it is. That's the point of real science. It takes time, and effort, and humility to accept that we don't have all the answers. I've been saying it's going to take at least two years -- probably longer -- to really get a handle on this new virus. We are awash in data, but have little understanding. It just takes time.

That said, initial research into exposure-induced immunity is not overly promising. I'm sure you can dig up the studies as well as me. The results are leaning to a response similar to influenza, or the cold virus (another corona virus) where immunity from exposure is partial and limited in duration. This makes the so-called "herd immunity" goal a far more elusive one.

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

If it didn't exist, the human race would be gone already long ago.

This is false logic. The dinosaurs didn't go extinct until they did. This could be our asteroid impact .

But of course it is not. Most people do not succumb to this disease. This means a healthy immune system can mount an effective response. If we couldn't, then we'd all be dead.

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

And flu shots are not effective for people with compromised immune system. Because they contain the virus protein that triggers the immune system to produce antibodies. If the immune system is not 100%, the flu shot won't work or is less effective.

The flu shot is particularly recommended for those with compromised immune systems. There are some very rare situations where the patient produces an extreme cytokine response, but this is extemely rare, and certainly not the case for everyone with compromised immune systems.

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-heal...u-shot.html#a1

Originally Posted by CruisingCouple

The results of the COVID virus already show that it primarily attacks people with compromised immune systems, and most people recover just fine. So there is little hope of any sort of a vaccine providing any protection for those people anyway, other than lessening their exposure to it because it is less prevalent in the general population. Which is the basic principle of so-called "herd immunity".

Again, this is incorrect. The virus doesn't "attack" people with compromised immune systems. It attacks, or infects, all of us. It more likely leads to worse outcomes for those with compromised immune systems, but we are all susceptible to infection. And again, if the influenza vacine is our model, then those with compromised immune systems are even more indicated for it.


ADD: I probably shouldn't say the obvious, but Canada's healthcare cost per-capita are about 1/2 of the USA's. American spends way more than every other developed nation, and produces only fair to middlin' outcomes.

[Westcliffe01]

https://youtu.be/UIDsKdeFOmQ


Based on the above, the reason for the high mortality rate is medical malpractice, incompetence, negligence and the use of politically driven treatment regimes. Its a very eye opening video, rather long at an hour and 10 minutes. Very sobering indeed.


The conclusion is that those of us that are afraid of going to a hospital have damn good reasons to be afraid.

Originally Posted by Montanan

Confirmed infections in the U.S. have now reached nearly 3.5 million, with 138,500 deaths, while Canada by contrast has close to 108,105 cases and under 8,790 deaths.

The population of the USA is nine times that of Canada.

So if one was to multiply Canada by nine one would have 973,000 cases and 79,100 deaths.

Cases per million Deaths per million Tests per million
Canada 2,865 233 86,287
USA 10,855 419 131,308

Canada's mortality rate to positive Covid cases ratio seems comparatively quite high at 8.1% versus 3.8%, and the USA has a considerably higher testing of its population, 13% versus 8.6%

Statistics,

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

https://youtu.be/UIDsKdeFOmQ

Based on the above, the reason for the high mortality rate is medical malpractice, incompetence, negligence and the use of politically driven treatment regimes. Its a very eye opening video, rather long at an hour and 10 minutes. Very sobering indeed.

The conclusion is that those of us that are afraid of going to a hospital have damn good reasons to be afraid.

Just skimming that video, I can tell you it bears absolutely no resemblance to the Canadian medical system. So off topic and proof of absolutely nothing relating to the state of covid in non-US jurisdictions.

And a reminder why I never ever, ever, want an American style healthcare system.

[Westcliffe01]

Um, the point is that this IS THE hyper expensive medical system we have to work with in the US and that possibly the high death toll may not be the fault of the stupid American public after all....

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

Um, the point is that this IS THE hyper expensive medical system we have to work with in the US and that possibly the high death toll may not be the fault of the stupid American public after all....

I truly am sorry (how Canadian eh?) if you feel like we are bashing the American people. We aren't really. Most of us Canadians are very aware of the issues in the US health care system that are currently being exacerbated by the confused political situation. On top of that you have the American "individualism" that is ingrained into the populace and thus there is not a whole lot of pulling in one direction going on.

We just don't want it bleeding into Canada.

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

The flu shot is particularly recommended for those with compromised immune systems.

Mike, there is two different type of flu shots or vaccines. I don't remember the technical name, have to ask my wife. But they are basically live and dead. People with known compromised immune systems can't be given the "live" shot. And the "dead" one is not nearly as effective as the "live" one.

If the people with the compromised immune system are given the "live" one it's the same as contracting the disease. It will wipe them right out.

[Westcliffe01]

I doubt very much that the death toll has anything all to do with the individualist streak at all. The individualists do their best to keep themselves out the reach of the people doing the killing. The death toll in the western states excluding California is much lower than other parts of the çountry. The hospitals, as described in the video, are in fact where nearly half the people get infected after their initial tests are negative.

[Westcliffe01]

The problem with US healthcare is that it is not a free market system. It's a collection of cronies, lobbiests, FDA, insurance companies politicians, and billions of federal $ up for grabs. It sounds like hospitals in NYC had a $26k treatment "bonus" if covid 19 was the cause of death.

[Macblaze]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

The problem with US healthcare is that it is not a free market system. It's a collection of cronies, lobbiests, FDA, insurance companies politicians, and billions of federal $ up for grabs. It sounds like hospitals in NYC had a $26k treatment "bonus" if covid 19 was the cause of death.

Soooooo off topic. The problem with the US health care system is that it's not ours so it is obviously inferior. The problem with the Canadian system is that it is ours, so it is obviously inferior. It 's all just opinions. And we still want the border to remain closed.

[Montanan]

8:05 a.m. Canadian trials have just begun for a prospective COVID-19 vaccine but its Quebec-based manufacturer is already downplaying its potential impact.
Dr. Bruce Clark, president and CEO of the biopharmaceutical company Medicago, cautions observers against holding unrealistic expectations that his product — or any of the numerous vaccines in development globally — will bring the pandemic to a screeching halt.
“Whatever vaccine we get in this first round — unless it’s a miracle — it’s not going to be perfect,” says Clark, whose company began trials for its proposed vaccine Monday in Quebec City.
“It’s going to have to undergo development, it’s going to take probably years to come up with an understanding of the right vaccine, the right approach. It’s not the panacea.
“To assume that we can have, in 18 months, the solution to a pandemic that comes around once in a generation, is naive.”
So much is still unknown about COVID-19, notes Clark, including how it may manifest during the flu season later this year.
He suspects a more likely scenario is that a vaccine will offer only part of the solution, along with new therapeutics and ongoing public health interventions.
Medicago’s first phase of clinical trials will test a plant-based product on 180 healthy men and women, aged 18 to 55.
The randomized, partially blinded study uses technology that does not involve animal products or live viruses like traditional methods. Clark notes that vaccine developers typically use chicken eggs to propagate a virus, but Medicago uses recombinant technology involving the genetic sequence of a virus, with living plants as the host.
The resulting virus-like particles mimic the shape and dimensions of a virus, which allows the body to recognize them and spark an immune response. Clark says the plant-based approach is significantly faster and offers more consistent results than egg-based or cell-based methods. While it takes five to six months to propagate a virus in eggs, the plant-based technique requires just five to six weeks, he says.

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...y-14-2020.html

[CruisingCouple]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

That said, initial research into exposure-induced immunity is not overly promising. I'm sure you can dig up the studies as well as me. The results are leaning to a response similar to influenza, or the cold virus (another corona virus) where immunity from exposure is partial and limited in duration. This makes the so-called "herd immunity" goal a far more elusive one.

I'm sure I can dig up the studies, but we're actually part of it? Just because we had that stupid antibody test done and we tested positive. Now, they ASSUME that we had corona, COVID, whatever you want to call it. If we did, we didn't know it. I believe it is now going on 20 years since either me or my wife has even had a common cold.

So they don't even know where those antibodies they tested us for came from. They only ASSUME where they came from. We're supposed to go in on Aug 5 and get another one so they can experiment some more.

I don't know how Canada is handling this, or if they're just doing viral testing there. But it is obvious here they are experimenting because they DO NOT KNOW.

If the patient had COVID, then recovers, they can be pretty sure about the serum tests. But if the subject never had corona, or never was sick, and has the antibodies, how did they get them? That's what they're trying to figure out. We are not unique - there's lots of us. But when they find one they're sure interested in experimenting on you. They want all your blood.

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Again, this is incorrect. The virus doesn't "attack" people with compromised immune systems. It attacks, or infects, all of us.

Sorry, you are correct. I should've said it is more likely to be serious, or more likely to affect those with compromised immune system.