Canadian COVID-19 News

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Maybe. And CBC is usually good at weeding out the complete nutters from their call-in shows, so it should be interesting. But I don't have the patience any more for listening to those shows. So I'll look for the executive summary tomorrow.

It may very well be that many vaccinated parents don't see the need to vaccinate kids for what is (hopefully) a temporary pandemic footing. It is what it is... if there's a big surge in children's hospitalizations, the uptake will increase.

I'm not so worried about some getting sick and requiring hospitalization (although some will) because, particularly with Omicron, children don't seem to be getting very sick with it at all - but I am concerned that they can become vectors of the disease and facilitate it's spread among the more vulnerable.

[Mike OReilly]

CBC: Quebec expanding COVID-19 vaccine passport to include big-box stores

Quebec is also set to expand its vaccination passport program starting Monday, making it mandatory to show proof of immunization in order to enter a number of retail settings. They include big-box stores with areas of 1,500 square metres or more.

I think this may cross my line. Not sure. Have to think about this one... It's clearly part of Quebec's ramped up approach to making life more and more difficult for the purposely unvaccinated. This is a good thing, as long as there is sufficient provision to accommodate those who cannot be vaccinated.

However, what about a situation where a big box store is your only accessible grocery outlet? Or even more likely, this forces the purposely unvaccinated to use smaller grocery stores. These tend to be more expensive, so this push will be more keenly felt by those in the lower income brackets.

I think this will have a hard time surviving a Charter challenge. But as has been pointed out, Quebec has plenty of experience using the Notwithstanding clause.

[Tetepare]

Hi I’m back after being gone for the past twelve pages. Did I miss anything? Is Canada open yet?

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

Hi I’m back after being gone for the past twelve pages. Did I miss anything? Is Canada open yet?

Yup, providing you can jump through all the hoops Canada Border Services puts in front of you:

https://travel.gc.ca/travel-covid/tr...s/wizard-start

and you name your first-born "Justin"

It's a heck of a lot easier to get in if you are fully vaccinated - but you may still be required to quarantine.

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

CBC: Quebec expanding COVID-19 vaccine passport to include big-box stores



I think this may cross my line. Not sure. Have to think about this one... It's clearly part of Quebec's ramped up approach to making life more and more difficult for the purposely unvaccinated. This is a good thing, as long as there is sufficient provision to accommodate those who cannot be vaccinated.

However, what about a situation where a big box store is your only accessible grocery outlet? Or even more likely, this forces the purposely unvaccinated to use smaller grocery stores. These tend to be more expensive, so this push will be more keenly felt by those in the lower income brackets.

I think this will have a hard time surviving a Charter challenge. But as has been pointed out, Quebec has plenty of experience using the Notwithstanding clause.

I don't know if I support it or not. If grocery stores and pharmacies are exempt, I probably would. If not, no. And how do you define a "big box" store? Just how big does it have to be? And what about small, non-grocery, non-pharmacy stores like boutiques, small clothing stores, shoe stores, etc. I'm sort of visualizing "Main Street" in a small town or strip malls where each store has outside access (don't they already ban the un-vaccinated from indoor malls?).

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

Hi I’m back after being gone for the past twelve pages. Did I miss anything? Is Canada open yet?

L Ontario will be open for cross-border cruising by June (my prediction). See you then.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Scorpius

... And how do you define a "big box" store? Just how big does it have to be? ...

As Mike advised [#4052] "They include big-box stores with areas of 1,500 square metres or more."

[Scorpius]

Originally Posted by GordMay

As Mike advised [#4052] "They include big-box stores with areas of 1,500 square metres or more."

Oops. I missed that. Sorry.

[GordMay]

COVID-19: Children’s vaccinations and hospitalization
Dr. Earl Rubin, Dr. Katrina Hurley and Dr. Natalie Bridge answer questions about children’s COVID-19 vaccination rates across the country, hospitalizations and Omicron symptoms in kids.
Video [8:11] ➥ https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1995587651770

[GordMay]

Change to shorter isolation period part of managing COVID 19 in B.C.: Dr. Bonnie Henry
On Friday, B.C. announced that it was effectively going to start treating COVID-19 like the flu . The province is going to stop contact tracing, and is now asking healthy people to simply stay home for a few days, if they get sick.

“We cannot eliminate all risk, and I think that’s something we need to understand and accept,” said Provincial Health Officer Bonnie Henry.

She added that B.C. would henceforth be treating COVID-19 “much more like how we manage influenza.”

Henry says COVID-19 is far from being an endemic illness, so the current restrictions in place are needed, to prevent more hospitalizations, though those numbers have been declining.

More ➥ https://vancouversun.com/news/local-...n-says-b-c-cdc

Video [3:31] ➥ https://youtu.be/IyZb11mxRWc

[letsgetsailing3]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

First, I see you cherry-picked the one you liked. Why didn't you quote the other one here. Oh, I know... The other study cited DOES address the question, and does not find a correlation. The one you picked says it cannot find a correlation due to lack of data. I even bolded that part for folks like you. I guess I need to explain what access to limited data also means.

And once again, you failed to understand what I clearly wrote. I said "Current research is NOT finding a correlation between severe Covid-19 outcomes and obesity." I DID NOT say there isn't one. I said, as a counter to the common claim some keep making, that in these most recent studies, researchers are not finding one.

Agreed. I said so as well (in case that's something else you missed). I also stated:
While asymptomatic individuals can spread it through normal exhalation, the principle mechanism is through forceful exhalation; i.e coughing and sneezing and the like. So, it is symptomatic virus carriers who are the primary sources of spread.

It's widely believed that comorbidities are contributing factors to covid hospitalizations. I'd be surprised if there aren't studies that show that. Eventually, we'll cut through the ******** and believe the science, even if it’s not as politically correct as people would like. Yes, I believe that obesity contributes to hospitalization.

I don't believe there's a study showing that the unvaccinated are the primary source of spread, or that the spread is primarily through coughing or sneezing. There really would be no way to validate that kind of study. Again, produce your study, or stop making the false claim. One of the reasons omicron is so contagious is that it's spread by aerosol. You can get it just by breathing near someone. This is also why surgical masks are pretty ineffective indoors, and you should wear an N95 mask if you're concerned.

Everybody can get covid. Vaccination doesn't prevent you from getting covid. It also doesn't stop you from spreading it. The quicker people understand these things, the quicker we get past some of the finger-pointing nonsense.

Maybe instead of trying to demonize other citizens, we should get back to positive things we can do to limit the dangers of covid, and limit the effects of it on Canadians and the cruising lifestyle.

[danstanford]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Change to shorter isolation period part of managing COVID 19 in B.C.: Dr. Bonnie Henry
On Friday, B.C. announced that it was effectively going to start treating COVID-19 like the flu . The province is going to stop contact tracing, and is now asking healthy people to simply stay home for a few days, if they get sick.

“We cannot eliminate all risk, and I think that’s something we need to understand and accept,” said Provincial Health Officer Bonnie Henry.

She added that B.C. would henceforth be treating COVID-19 “much more like how we manage influenza.”

Henry says COVID-19 is far from being an endemic illness, so the current restrictions in place are needed, to prevent more hospitalizations, though those numbers have been declining.

More ➥ https://vancouversun.com/news/local-...n-says-b-c-cdc

Video [3:31] ➥ https://youtu.be/IyZb11mxRWc

This is the place we will be in most jurisdictions soon I believe and for the most part I think it is a sensible path. We have been entirely focused on the medical implications of our lockdowns but as we arise from this state of mind we will come to understand the other effects they have wrought.

I believe the biggest thing we will have to overcome now is the belief that if you get Covid you will end up in hospital or die. This belief will be supplanted only by experience of getting it or seeing enough people around us getting it and suffering for a few days. Personally, getting Covid has never been a scary prospect but having said that I didn't want to get it as there is some risk.

[Mike OReilly]

Access to Quebec's "big box stores", i.e. stores larger than 1,500 m2, now requires a vaccine passport. They've built in some provisions for the issues around limited access, but practically, it essentially means "essential services" aren't accessible via these stores to the unvaccinated.

(CBC) For pharmacies located in big-box stores, such as Walmart or Costco, an unvaccinated person must be "accompanied at all times during his or her travels by an employee of the business, the pharmacy or any other person mandated by them for this purpose," the decree reads. This person may not purchase products other than those related to the pharmaceutical service they are receiving.

If stores actually do this, then I guess I'm fine with it. But I bet the actual result will be private enterprises choosing to turn the unvaccinated away.

The good thing (and the intent) is it will likely encourage a few more of the unvaccinated to get the jab. But I bet it will further entrench the true anti-vaxxers in their views.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by danstanford

This is the place we will be in most jurisdictions soon I believe and for the most part I think it is a sensible path. We have been entirely focused on the medical implications of our lockdowns but as we arise from this state of mind we will come to understand the other effects they have wrought.

I believe the biggest thing we will have to overcome now is the belief that if you get Covid you will end up in hospital or die. This belief will be supplanted only by experience of getting it or seeing enough people around us getting it and suffering for a few days. Personally, getting Covid has never been a scary prospect but having said that I didn't want to get it as there is some risk.

I think you're probably correct in the sense that we have to shift to learning how to live with this virus. And you're certainly correct the full cost of this pandemic is not only measured in Covid-19 morbidity and mortality.

But we do have to understand that there will be future variants, and there's no necessity for these variants to be less virulent or contagious. Statistically, it is more likely to have genetic mutations which make a pathogen less dangerous, but there's no biological necessity for this. It could go the other way.

As long as there is a lot of virus circulating (and evolving) in the world, we will continue to see these variants emerge. We spend a lot of time gnashing our teeth over the purposely unvaccinated here in this country, but the bigger risk, by far, is the masses of people who haven't even seen a first dose of vaccine outside the rich developed world.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by letsgetsailing3

I don't believe there's a study showing that the unvaccinated are the primary source of spread, or that the spread is primarily through coughing or sneezing. ...

Strawmen. And neither are there studies backing your implicit assertions that a vaccinated person is just as much of a potential spreader as an unvaccinated one, or that just the breathing of an asymptomatic case is as infectious as the cough/sneeze of a symptomatic case.

Everybody can get covid. Vaccination doesn't prevent you from getting covid. It also doesn't stop you from spreading it. The quicker people understand these things, the quicker we get past some of the finger-pointing nonsense.

Everyone can get COVID. Everyone unvaccinated will probably get COVID eventually.

Vaccination:

1. reduces the chance of catching it
2. greatly reduces the severity and duration of illness if caught
3. from 2, greatly reduces the probability of immediate or future serious health effects ("long COVID")
4. from 1&2, makes the vaccinated person a lower risk for spreading it further

We still have a pandemic on our hands, and active measures are still advisable.

I agree that finger-pointing and shaming aren't productive. But neither is pretending that choosing to not get vaccinated has no impact on our fight against the pandemic.

(Y'know, if all the unvaccinated accepted that their choice means that they have to work harder at isolating, including work-from-home, or being laid-off... there wouldn't be the same backlash)

btw - the risk of a new diagnosis of diabetes in the under-18s goes up substantially after a COVID infection.