corona virus alerts - Latest cruising Information for vessels/locations/rules

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by rbk

Yes this is all correct and we have yet to enact a national emergency as provinces and territories are dealing with the situation(s) adequately. The idiotic comment was not aimed at you but rather the idea that because one area is experiencing one set of circumstances that sweeping rules be applied equally to all including the federally supplied numbers. Shouldn’t we be trying to reduce restrictions in recovering areas and get portions of the economy going again?

RBK, I understood your remarks to not be directed at me, rather an expression of frustration as to how the Canadian government has been responding. All is good. Loads of room for opinion and discussion on that topic. We have our POTUS which makes for rich content, but not for CF topical remarkings. [Right Ann? Our wonderful Moderator!]

Be assured the virus knows no boundaries and sets its own timeline. Local government have been the most responsive in the USA, followed by individual States implementing their orders and lockdowns and then there is our Federal government [end of discussion at that point].

Given the massive number of now out of work Canadians perhaps a public works project stimulus is in order, like say, a big, beautiful, border wall running along the 49th parallel; since it is warming y'all need to give consideration towards keep all those crazy Spring Breakers out that will desire to flock north from Florida. We Montanans will just rustle them up and drive them north in a large herd given this remains a free range state.

As to BC where the provincial orders are comparatively almost a non-event:
An article of interest:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...alth-1.5524013

How does enforcement of COVID-19 orders work in B.C.?

"In the weeks since COVID-19 was declared a provincial health emergency in B.C., provincial health officer Dr. Bonnie Henry has taken pains to explain to British Columbians that her orders now have the weight of the law behind them.

Gatherings of 50 or more people are banned.

Restaurants can only serve takeout.

And "personal service establishments" like nail salons, tattoo parlours and barbershops have to close.

Whoa, such radical infringement on personal liberties and freedoms!!!! What's next, they going to close gun dealerships, brothels and liquor establishments.

For the most part, Henry has said she believes people are complying. But you don't have to look too far to see someone ignoring her directives — either on purpose, or unwittingly.

So what are the consequences? And how do penalties in a state of emergency work?

Who is responsible for enforcing Henry's orders?
Medical health officers are responsible for enforcing provincial health orders, and quarantine officers enforce the application of the federal Quarantine Act.

Police officers and compliance and enforcement officers — like bylaw officers, gambling enforcement officers and liquor and licensing inspectors — do not have the power to ticket and detain people in relation to public health orders. But they can assist medical health officers in enforcing orders.

An exception is in the City of Vancouver, which declared its own state of emergency and where city council has given bylaw officers the power to issue $1,000 tickets for individual offences and fines of up to $50,000 for businesses.

So can you be ticketed for not maintaining physical distance?
This is a muddy one. There are no actual orders in B.C. requiring people to maintain two metres of physical distance outside of their own homes, except inside food premises.

But the public has been given strong guidance and recommendations.

According to provincial guidance, compliance and bylaw officers are not expected to monitor the behaviour of individuals in public, but they can take complaints.

The guidelines suggest that some complaints may be the result of a lack of the complainant's understanding of who needs to self-isolate. Officers are given a script thanking the complainant for sharing their concerns and advising them of a number of resources they can contact for more information.

But don't people have to self-quarantine when they come back from abroad?
There are two orders in relation to travellers. Henry ordered all travellers returning to Canada into self-isolation. But the federal government has also issued an order for 14-days quarantine under the federal Quarantine Act.

Under the terms of that act, a quarantine officer can order someone's arrest and have them detained.

Contravening an order under the act and placing the lives of other at risk can result in fines of hundreds of thousands of dollars and jail time.

So which orders are bylaw officers helping enforce?
The prohibition of mass gatherings of more than 50 people. Orders to travellers to self-isolate. Orders to restaurants to restrict service to take-out. Orders to bars to close. Orders to personal service establishments like beauty salons to close. And orders that only food vendors can remain open at farmers markets.

And if they aren't arresting people, how are they doing it?

A big part of this comes down to the ethical framework that underpins the province's approach to the pandemic.

A document released by the provincial COVID-19 task force says the government will consider the infringement of personal freedoms during a crisis and commit to the least restrictive and coercive measures possible. That means being transparent about the motivations for any restrictions on liberty and trying to get the public to buy in.

With that in mind, compliance and enforcement officers are supposed to assist in the provision of public education in order to gain compliance without the need for law enforcement intervention.

In the case of restaurants that don't comply, that involves first identifying a "responsible person" for an explanation of the rules. Then to explain that the enforcement "could be escalated" if an order is ignored and to lay out a timeline for actions that will be taken in the case of non-compliance.

Finally, if none of that works, the compliance and enforcement officer contacts the medical health officer, who then has the power to act.

But what about jail or a fine?
These are the ultimate weapons in the enforcement arsenal.

The Public Health Act lays out penalties including $25,000 and six months in jail for people who don't comply with health orders.

Judges also have an array of alternative penalties to choose from, including community service and monitoring.

They can also order the publication of the facts of a case, which in effect will serve to shame an offender into compliance.
Whereas here in the USA, the cops would be inclined to just rough them up, shoot the non-compliant idiot, or at least tase them. Eh? In Montana, a 3-7-77 warning mark could be made which quickly could thence elevate towards vigilante actions. Google 3-7-77 for a bit of the origination of Montana justice and law history. Back when Montana was a new territory, Montanan vigilantes hung the Sheriff because it turned out the Sheriff was the leader of a gang of highway men, known as "the innocents", which 20 plus highway men were also hanged. 3-7-77 is the Vigilante Code and remains proudly displayed on the badges of the State Troopers and the State Highway Patrol and the emblems of their vehicles.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Singularity

It was casually noted that in countries where prior TB immunization (formal name BCG) was normally given that said countries had lower fatality rates. This could suggest that previous history of receiving BCG/TB vaccination might be a somewhat protective.

New trials underway testing this; one has healthcare workers receiving BCG now to see if over the next couple months the BCG vaccination lends any benefit...if so, offering it to the broader population might improve things a bit. Not sure how this applies to giving boosters, etc, if people have already had the BCG vaccination.

Very few Americans have ever received this vaccination; it's normal to receive as a child in the developing world, not sure about Europe/Oz/NZ.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....24.20042937v1
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ate-tb-vaccine

INDEED!

Recently, researchers from the Murdoch Children’s Research Institute in Australia (MCRI), began organizing a trial, to investigate whether the tuberculosis (TB) vaccine known, as the bacille Calmette-Guerin (BCG), might offer some protection against COVID-19. Researchers are keen to investigate the BCG, vaccine against COVID-19, because earlier work[*1] has shown that it might reduce the risk of some respiratory infections, that are entirely unrelated to TB. Countries without BCG policies, such as Italy, the Netherlands and the USA, seem[*2] to be more impacted by Covid-19, than those with universal and long-standing BCG policies.
1 ➥ https://www.sciencedirect.com/scienc...64410X04006747
1 ➥ https://academic.oup.com/cid/article/60/11/1611/356084
1 ➥ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1342506
2 ➥ https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....24.20042937v1


The BCG World Atlas: A Database of Global BCG Vaccination Policies and Practices
Some countries, such as the United Kingdom, have, or have had, universal BCG vaccination programs, while others (including Canada and the United States) either only recommended BCG for high-risk groups, or did not advocate BCG countrywide. The Canadian situation was further complicated by differing policies across provinces, where some provinces underwent mass vaccination programs and others did not.
➥ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3062527/
➥ www.bcgatlas.org

[Montanan]

Kind of sums up self isolation / social distancing.

[Montanan]

Today, April 10th

http://https://www.yahoo.com/news/co...101922308.html

Dr. Anthony Fauci and Surgeon General Jerome Adams said the country won't be reopening soon.

Fauci, the director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, told CNN he would "want to see a clear indication" that the U.S. is "strongly going in the right direction" before reopening the country.

"The virus kind of decides whether or not it's going to be appropriate to open," he said. He warned the country could "prematurely" end social distancing measures and then "you're right back in the same situation."

Meanwhile, Surgeon General Jerome Adams reinforced this Friday on Fox News, saying "most of the country" will not be able to open by May 1.

[Montanan]

Meanwhile in New Jersey the State has issued this Covid-19 guidance.

[smbdyiam2]

Originally Posted by Montanan

Kind of sums up self isolation / social distancing.

Does moving to a MORE SPARSELY POPULATED AREA qualify ?

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by smbdyiam2

Does moving to a MORE SPARSELY POPULATED AREA qualify ?

If by your moving there the population of said area goes from 0 to 1... then yes.

In general, the advice is to not head from cities to your cottage or recreational property because you might be a carrier, and because an influx of people could stress their supply chain and overwhelm local health facilities if there's a breakout.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by smbdyiam2

Does moving to a MORE SPARSELY POPULATED AREA qualify ?

Not if the one that is moving is stupid.

Dense:
adjective
1.
closely compacted in substance.
2.
(of a person) stupid

As the saying goes: You can't fix stupid.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

If by your moving there the population of said area goes from 0 to 1... then yes.

In general, the advice is to not head from cities to your cottage or recreational property because you might be a carrier, and because an influx of people could stress their supply chain and overwhelm local health facilities if there's a breakout.

Here in Montana, the official state tourism promotion logo is Get Lost in Montana.

Now that the Governor having issued a Stay At Home order and has officially stated that visitors are not welcome. The COVID-19 logo has become:

Get Lost! Don't come to Montana.

Montana ordinarily get two times the amount of visitors in the summer than we have native population; that is 2 million visitors in just the June to September time period.

And now all persons that enter the State, be they residents or non-residents are ordered to go into 14 days self-isolation and not travel about or go to stores, or visit their families, basically told to go to and stay in a hotel / motel, or crawl under a rock.

[Montanan]

The US government just banned Carnival, Norwegian, and Royal Caribbean from sailing again for up to 3 months as the coronavirus throws the cruise lines into peril

Cruise ships may be banned from sailing in US waters until July, according to an order issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) on Thursday. Just in time for hurricane season.

That ban could be lifted earlier if the CDC or the Department of Health and Human Services determine cruises or COVID-19 are no longer a major health risk.

The order also requires cruise lines to create plans to address and prevent the spread of COVID-19 on their ships.

COVID-19 has spread to hundreds of cruise-ship passengers and crew members while threatening the cruise industry's financial health.

Cruise ships may not be able to sail in US-controlled waters until July, according to an order issued by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) on Thursday. Cruises, the agency said, accelerate the spread of COVID-19 and increase the burden placed on the US medical system.

The order bans new cruises until the Department of Health and Human Services no longer considers COVID-19 to be a public health crisis, the CDC rescinds or changes the order, or 100 days pass after the order is published in the Federal Register. The document was not yet available in the Federal Register, as of Friday morning.

The order also prevents cruise lines from letting passengers or crew members exit their ships at US ports without permission from the Coast Guard. There are 114 ships carrying over 93,000 crew members in or close to US ports, according to the CDC, and as of March 30, Carnival Corp. said 6,000 passengers were still on its ships.

Cruise lines must create and implement plans to address and prevent the spread of COVID-19 on their ships by April 16, the order says, adding that cruise lines must also find ways to reduce their reliance on US governments and hospitals.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-govern...155714607.html

[Singularity]

Hyperbaric / dive-chamber treatment trials for Covid:

The first application of hyperbaric medicine to a Spanish Flu victim was likely also the first application to a human being in the United States. In 1918 Dr. Orval Cunningham of Kansas City was brought a dying friend of a fellow physician. The patient was moribund and blue. Before Cunningham could perform his planned animal experiments he was asked to treat this dying patient. With just a one-hour treatment with compressed air at 1.68 atmospheres absolute the patient experienced improvement. Combined with additional hyperbaric treatments over the next 3 days this patient’s life was saved. Others followed...

Today, the publication of a retrospective analysis of lung CT scans on 121 patients infected with coronavirus in four Chinese provinces was announced. The CT scans showed progressive air space disease that radiologically depicted the diffusion barrier to oxygen that Dr. Harch suggested was similar to the lung pathology in Spanish Flu victims of 1918. Simultaneously, Dr. Harch’s research assistant found evidence of successful treatment of a severe case of coronavirus infection in Wuhan, China. The patient was treated through the critical period with a similar number of daily hyperbaric treatments that Dr. Orval Cunningham used on his Spanish Flu cases in 1918. This Chinese patient managed to successfully traverse the critically ill period and was no longer in jeopardy.

https://hbot.com/hyperbaric-applicat...ary-infection/
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04332081

Other studies/trials undoubtedly underway.[/COLOR]

[Sand crab]

486,994 cases in the US with 18,022 deaths. There are more cases in New York State than any other country (except the US of course). NYC ranks 5th among deaths among countries.
Over 100,000 deaths worldwide now.
https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashb...23467b48e9ecf6

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Sand crab

486,994 cases in the US with 18,022 deaths. There are more cases in New York State than any other country (except the US of course). NYC ranks 5th among deaths among countries.
Over 100,000 deaths worldwide now.
https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashb...23467b48e9ecf6

We're Number One! We're Number One! We're Number One!

. . .

Oh, what a minute that might not be such a good thing.

[Montanan]

Michigan Gov. Gretchen Whitmer, who is leading one of the states hit hardest by the coronavirus pandemic, has extended the state's stay-at-home order until May 1.

The order also included some measures not seen in other states, like how big-box stores can't sell "nonessential" items such as gardening supplies or paint. But the chunk of the stay-at-home order that really isn't sitting well with some Michiganders is that travel "between residences" will also be banned as of April 11.

As summertime nears in the typically freezing state in the Upper Midwest, residents who own cottages in Northern Michigan — called "Up North" by locals — typically take a weekend in spring to reopen their cottage. (Save for skiing enthusiasts, most cottage owners steer clear of Northern Michigan during the winter because it's exceptionally cold.)

Others might have been planning to head to their second homes as the coronavirus slams much of Lower Michigan, particularly the Metro Detroit area.

http://https://www.yahoo.com/news/am...194301681.html

[Montanan]

China unveils new list of animals that can be farmed for meat

The Chinese government released a new list of animals that can be farmed for meat as the country begins to reopen to a new normal following the novel coronavirus outbreak that is thought to have originated in a wet market in Wuhan.

The draft list was released Thursday by the country's Ministry of Agriculture and Rural Affairs and is available online for a public comment period.

The list of acceptable livestock and poultry includes 18 species of traditional staples such as pig, cow, chicken, sheep, goat and more.

The Chinese government has issued a new draft list of livestock that can be farmed for meat in the wake of the coronavirus epidemic.


The list of animals that can be farmed for meat includes dietary staples like pigs, cows, chickens and sheep.

The list includes dietary staples like pigs, cows, chickens and sheep. There are also “special livestock,” such as alpaca, ostriches and certain species of deer.

Raccoons, minks and two types of fox can be kept as livestock, but fur not for their meat.

There’s no mention of the animals that scientists suspect spread the virus to humans. Pangolins, bats and civet cats are believed to be the source of the virus that causes COVID-19.

The list also reclassifies dogs as pets.

“As far as dogs are concerned, along with the progress of human civilization and the public concern and love for animal protection, dogs have been ‘specialized’ to become companion animals, and internationally are not considered to be livestock, and they will not be regulated as livestock in China,” according to a statement from the Chinese Ministry of Agriculture.

Beijing also temporarily banned all trade in wild animals for food following the outbreak,
https://www.wifr.com/content/news/Ch...569547421.html