Covid vaccines: risk vs benefit alarming news

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Montanan

I agree that this coronavirus is likely to become endemic much like the other coronaviruses and will require boosters to keep at bay from the variants and / or decline in immunological protection over the course of time. With diligence and improvements in vaccine technology there is a reasonable chance to eradicate this disease, albeit its propensity to be commonly asymptomatic makes the task MUCH more difficult to isolate outbreaks and community spread. It is a tough nut for sure.

There now be two viruses that have been eradicated by vaccines. Small pox and Rinderpest.

Small pox was the first to be eradicated. The first smallpox immunization was created by Edward Jenner in 1796. But it took more than 200 years and a worldwide vaccination program to eradicate the disease. The last known naturally occurring case of smallpox was diagnosed on Oct. 26, 1977, in Merka, Somalia, according to the CDC. The World Health Organization (WHO) declared smallpox eradicated in 1980.
"It was eradicated solely through vaccination. We do not really have any treatments even today for smallpox that are proven, tried and tested,"
Though the U.S. discontinued smallpox immunization in 1972, immunization remains mandatory for U.S. military personnel deployed to smallpox-prone areas.

Researchers continue to study smallpox, but very few scientists have access to the deadly disease. "Only two WHO reference labs are authorized to maintain stocks of variola virus: one at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) in Atlanta and the other at a Russian state laboratory in Koltsovo,". "However, additional variola isolates, either long held unreported or acquired through security breaches, may also exist." All legal research is overseen by the Advisory Committee for Variola Virus Research, according to the WHO.

Prevention of smallpox is based on a worldwide vaccination strategy. Anyone who shows signs of the virus are vaccinated and kept in isolation to prevent any spread of infection by their country's medical authorities. In the United States, the CDC reserves the legal right to quarantine individuals. Anyone who may have come in contact with the potentially infected person is also given the vaccine. The vaccine can prevent or lessen the effects of the virus if it is administered within four days of exposure. Stockpiles of smallpox vaccines are stored around the world to respond to an epidemic, if that ever occurs. In the U.S., the Strategic National Stockpile is an organization run by the government that stores supplies and pharmaceuticals in case of a national health emergency. The Strategic National Stockpile includes millions of doses of smallpox vaccines for emergency use during a smallpox event. "Any confirmed case of smallpox represents an international public health emergency and must be reported to national authorities through local and state health departments."

The second virus to be eradicated by vaccines was Rinderpest, [the extremely contagious and deadly zoonotic virus from which measles in humans was derived and canine distemper in dogs] which vaccine was developed by the biotechnology company at which I was employed and during my time of employment in the late 1980's. The R&D for such vaccine was provided modest financial support by the World Health Organization, if I recall it cost perhaps up to $250,000 to derive. The last documented case of Rinderpest was in 2001, and it was declared eradicated in 2010.

Vaccines work remarkably well.

So.. One triumph for humanity and one for the animal kingdom..

While Rinderpest did not infect humans it severely affected their livelihoods. Rinderpest outbreaks caused famines responsible for millions of deaths. 3 The virus spread via droplets, so that animals got infected by inhaling sick animals’ breath, secretions or excretions.

[jtsailjt]

One thing those presenting conspiracy theories should consider is just how hard it is to keep a secret when there’s any more than 2 people involved. In order for some of these CV conspiracies to be true there would have to be dozens, hundreds, or even thousands in on the secret with nobody deciding to blow the whistle. Pretty unlikely.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

One thing those presenting conspiracy theories should consider is just how hard it is to keep a secret when there’s any more than 2 people involved. In order for some of these CV conspiracies to be true there would have to be dozens, hundreds, or even thousands in on the secret with nobody deciding to blow the whistle. Pretty unlikely.

Worked pretty well from 2002 to 2003..

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Haarpti

According to my research, Fauci has patents on both sides of HIV; huge international hoopla with it in biopharma world and SEC ...

How is this relevant?
Patents by Inventor Anthony S. Fauci
➥ https://patents.justia.com/inventor/anthony-s-fauci
Virtually all are assigned to The United States of America, as represented by the Department of Health and Human Services

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by boatman61

So.. One triumph for humanity and one for the animal kingdom..

While Rinderpest did not infect humans it severely affected their livelihoods. Rinderpest outbreaks caused famines responsible for millions of deaths. 3 The virus spread via droplets, so that animals got infected by inhaling sick animals’ breath, secretions or excretions.

Yes, Rinderpest, of the aptly named genus Morbillivirus, certainly wiped out a lot herds upon which people relied on, so the economic and food security attributes were of societal importance. But I recall the WHO epidemiologists were really concerned about the disease mutating into yet another new zoonotic disease from which similarly measles and distemper had been derived and which new zoonotic disease could likewise be exceptionally contagious and similarly harsh as consequences of illness and death. They wanted it to be dispatched as a possible source of zoonotic origin. Cut off the head of the snake, before it becomes Medusa like.

If I recall the expectations of mortality in a herd was 90+% within two weeks of first clinical observation. The few remainders of any herd, and all herds within a quarantined zone were quickly culled. Kind of like dealing with hoof and mouth disease [a.k.a. foot and mouth disease], or mad cow disease. Rapid and total lockdown of all two toed ungulates.

Our scientists were only able to gain access to the virus was to go to Plum Island Animal Disease Center, off of Long Island, New York.

A good riddance.

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by JamesPNW

It is 100% selfishness and ignorance, nothing else.

Game Theory & Vaccination
Game theory might suggest that the optimal vaccination strategy, is to let everyone else take the minuscule risk, and get vaccinated, generating herd immunity, so that I don't have to take any risk, to be protected.

Each of us has choices, but the payoff, for each individual’s choice, depends on choices made by others. This is called a “prisoner’s dilemma” game, wherein players weigh cooperation against betrayal, often producing a less than optimal outcome for the common good.
People who choose not to be vaccinated effectively get a free ride, reaping the benefits of reduced virus transmission, generated by the people who do opt for vaccination. But the free rides generate a collective threat, when vaccination decisions, based purely on self-interest, can lead to vaccination coverage that is lower than what is optimal, for society overall,

“Vaccination and the theory of games” ~ by Chris T. Bauch & David J. D. Earn
“Voluntary vaccination policies for childhood diseases present parents with a subtle challenge: if a sufficient proportion of the population is already immune, either naturally or by vaccination, then even the slightest risk associated with vaccination will outweigh the risk from infection. As a result, individual self-interest might preclude complete eradication of a vaccine-preventable disease ...”
More ➥ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC516577/

[Montanan]

Viruses crossing species is problematic and worrisome.

By way of example.

Curr Opin Virol
. 2012 Jun;2(3):330-4. doi: 10.1016/j.coviro.2012.02.010. Epub 2012 Mar 20.
Rinderpest eradication: lessons for measles eradication?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22709518/

Rik L de Swart 1, W Paul Duprex, Albert D M E Osterhaus
Affiliations expand
PMID: 22709518 DOI: 10.1016/j.coviro.2012.02.010
Abstract
In 2011 the Food and Agriculture Organization formally announced that rinderpest was eradicated from the globe. Rinderpest virus had long been associated with huge disease outbreaks among cattle. The disease not only had a devastating effect on cattle herds world-wide, but also on human populations that depended on them. Rinderpest virus - a member of the genus Morbillivirus of the family Paramyxoviridae - is a close relative of measles virus. Both viruses are highly infectious and share many other biological properties. Although no formal goal or timeframe has been set, plans are currently being developed to eradicate measles. Here, we discuss how lessons learned from the global eradication of rinderpest may help in the future eradication of measles.


Science
. 2020 Jun 19;368(6497):1367-1370. doi: 10.1126/science.aba9411.

Measles virus and rinderpest virus divergence dated to the sixth century BCE

Abstract
Many infectious diseases are thought to have emerged in humans after the Neolithic revolution. Although it is broadly accepted that this also applies to measles, the exact date of emergence for this disease is controversial. We sequenced the genome of a 1912 measles virus and used selection-aware molecular clock modeling to determine the divergence date of measles virus and rinderpest virus. This divergence date represents the earliest possible date for the establishment of measles in human populations. Our analyses show that the measles virus potentially arose as early as the sixth century BCE, possibly coinciding with the rise of large cities.


Int J Paleopathol
. 2019 Mar;24:266-278. doi: 10.1016/j.ijpp.2018.12.007. Epub 2019 Feb 8.
New world origin of canine distemper: Interdisciplinary insights


Abstract
Objective: Canine distemper virus (CDV), human measles virus (HMV), and rinderpest virus (RPV) of cattle are morbilliviruses that have caused devastating outbreaks for centuries. This paper seeks to reconstruct the evolutionary history of CDV.

Materials and methods: An interdisciplinary approach is adopted, synthesizing paleopathological analysis of 96 Pre-Columbian dogs (750-1470 CE) from the Weyanoke Old Town, Virginia site, with historical reports, molecular analysis and morbilliviral epidemiology.

Results: Both measles (c.900CE) and rinderpest (c. 376 BCE) were first reported in Eurasia, while canine distemper was initially described in South America much later (1735 CE); there are no paleopathological indications of CDV in Weyanoke Old Town dogs. Molecularly, CDV is closely related to HMV, while viral codon usage indicates CDV may have previously infected humans; South American measles epidemics occurred prior to the emergence of canine distemper and would have facilitated HMV transmission and adaptation to dogs.

Conclusions: The measles epidemics that decimated indigenous South American populations in the 1500-1700 s likely facilitated the establishment of CDV as a canine pathogen, which eventually spread to Europe and beyond.

Significance: Understanding the historical and environmental conditions that have driven morbilliviral evolution provides important insights into potential future threats of animal/human cross-species infections.

Limitations: Interpreting historical disease descriptions is difficult and the archaeological specimens are limited. Molecular sequence data and codon usage analyses rely on modern viruses.


Viruses
. 2019 Oct 14;11(10):944. doi: 10.3390/v11100944.
Canine and Phocine Distemper Viruses: Global Spread and Genetic Basis of Jumping Species Barriers

Abstract
Canine distemper virus (CDV) and phocine distemper (PDV) are closely-related members of the Paramyxoviridae family, genus morbillivirus, in the order Mononegavirales. CDV has a broad host range among carnivores. PDV is thought to be derived from CDV through contact between terrestrial carnivores and seals. PDV has caused extensive mortality in Atlantic seals and other marine mammals, and more recently has spread to the North Pacific Ocean. CDV also infects marine carnivores, and there is evidence of morbillivirus infection of seals and other species in Antarctica. Recently, CDV has spread to felines and other wildlife species in the Serengeti and South Africa. Some CDV vaccines may also have caused wildlife disease. Changes in the virus haemagglutinin (H) protein, particularly the signaling lymphocyte activation molecule (SLAM) receptor binding site, correlate with adaptation to non-canine hosts. Differences in the phosphoprotein (P) gene sequences between disease and non-disease causing CDV strains may relate to pathogenicity in domestic dogs and wildlife. Of most concern are reports of CDV infection and disease in non-human primates raising the possibility of zoonosis. In this article we review the global occurrence of CDV and PDV, and present both historical and genetic information relating to these viruses crossing species barriers.

[Montanan]

Lest we not forget about the exceptionally contagious and deadly measles virus and the need to vastly improve the vaccination against such worldwide. To achieve a level of vaccination much higher than has been targeted for COVID-19. Take the damned shot!

Troubling information from the WHO:

Worldwide measles deaths climb 50% from 2016 to 2019 claiming over 207,500 lives in 2019

Measles resurged worldwide in 2019 reaching highest number of reported cases in 23 years. Highlighted in a publication by WHO and the United States Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), measles cases worldwide increased to 869,770 in 2019, the highest number reported since 1996 with increases in all WHO regions. Global measles deaths climbed nearly 50 percent since 2016, claiming an estimated 207,500 lives in 2019 alone.

After steady global progress from 2010 to 2016, the number of reported measles cases climbed progressively to 2019. Comparing 2019 data with the historic low in reported measles cases in 2016, authors cite a failure to vaccinate children on time with two doses of measles-containing vaccines (MCV1 and MCV2) as the main driver of these increases in cases and deaths.

“We know how to prevent measles outbreaks and deaths,” said Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, WHO Director-General. “These data send a clear message that we are failing to protect children from measles in every region of the world. We must collectively work to support countries and engage communities to reach everyone, everywhere with measles vaccine and stop this deadly virus.”

Measles outbreaks occur when people who are not protected from the virus are infected and spread the disease to unvaccinated or under-vaccinated populations. To control measles and prevent outbreaks and deaths, vaccination coverage rates with the required MCV1 and MCV2 must reach 95 percent and be maintained at national and subnational levels. MCV1 coverage has been stagnant globally for more than a decade at between 84 and 85 percent. MCV2 coverage has been steadily increasing but is only now at 71 percent. Vaccination coverage against measles remains well below the 95 percent or higher needed with both doses to control measles and prevent outbreaks and deaths.

Global response to COVID-19 pandemic must not exacerbate the measles crisis
Although reported cases of measles are lower in 2020, necessary efforts to control COVID-19 have resulted in disruptions in vaccination and crippled efforts to prevent and minimize measles outbreaks. As of November, more than 94 million people were at risk of missing vaccines due to paused measles campaigns in 26 countries. Many of these countries are experiencing ongoing outbreaks. Of countries with postponed planned 2020 campaigns, only eight (Brazil, Central African Republic, Democratic Republic of Congo, Ethiopia, Nepal, Nigeria, Philippines and Somalia) resumed their campaigns after initial delays.

“Before there was a coronavirus crisis, the world was grappling with a measles crisis, and it has not gone away,” said Henrietta Fore, UNICEF Executive Director. “While health systems are strained by the COVID-19 pandemic, we must not allow our fight against one deadly disease to come at the expense of our fight against another. This means ensuring we have the resources to continue immunization campaigns for all vaccine-preventable diseases, even as we address the growing COVID-19 pandemic.”

[Montanan]

Friend sent me this meme:

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Thumbs Up

I narrowed the search for you. Here is 59 cases below age 60 that died the day of or the next day after the injection. Purely coincidence?
https://medalerts.org/vaersdb/findfi...ID19)&DIED=Yes

As sagablu has already pointed out, the majority of those 59 were some combination of institutionalized/obese/terminally or seriously ill/multiple preexisting conditions/already infected with COVID-19/drug and alcohol abusers/etc.

And there's always a tiny number of seemingly healthy people who suddenly get ill and die from causes that are not determined until an autopsy is performed. Note that several of that 59 have autopsy results pending, but those results were not added to the record.

So let's be generous and say that... 15 of those deaths were unforeseeable. That's not... terrible, compared to the deaths caused by COVID. Even 59 is not an outrageous number for spontaneous deaths in the general population.

Anyway, I'm prepared to accept that COVID-19 vaccinations may have caused or accelerated some deaths, but the number is VERY small. VERY, VERY small, compared to 550,000 COVID deaths. I'm ok with those odds.

[Montanan]

A wise man once said:

[akopac]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

So, after all of YOU have got your shots, that apparently you want, and can get sooner because of those of us that dont: How is it again that those who chose NOT to be vaccinated are somehow a threat to you who did get vaccinated ?

Either you believe that the vaccine protects you or you dont ? So which is it ?


Emily and Clark from Youtube spend a year in lockdown around the Bahamas, then the DR. Dont get covid. Then Emily has to get a surgical procedure, goes to hospital, gets covid from the staff, Clark gets it from her. If you want to get sick fast, go to hospital, it always works. Like the dialysis patients and cancer patients getting chemo on the same floor, 6 to a nurse. Want to see how fast you can kill those cancer patients with no immune system ? Or the bone marrow transfer scam that saves 2-4% of patients and kills 95%+. Just keep on buying the lie of modern medicine, Ill take my chances. India is doing better than about 60+ developed nations with no vaccine in sight for any but the elites.

60-70% of the worlds vaccines come from India. Know your facts.
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/15/covi...-vaccines.html

[Montanan]

A T.J.ism:

[akopac]

Originally Posted by Azul

GordMay, show me the evidence this covid "vaccine" (better called a medical device or gene therapy) prevents an individual from getting covid. Show me the evidence it prevents transmission of the virus. Show me the experts saying you can take the vaccine and travel or get your basic freedoms back without endless testing, being masked like a slave, or distanced from other people inhumanely especially our children. What the vaccines allegedly do 95% of the time is reduce clinical symptoms in an infected young, robust test subject, the vast majority of which have no or minimal symptoms in the first place.

Show me the evidence that C19 didn’t kill over 1/2 million US citizens. Reducing to minor symptoms is better than killing yourself if you get it bad.

[Montanan]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

So, after all of YOU have got your shots, that apparently you want, and can get sooner because of those of us that dont: How is it again that those who chose NOT to be vaccinated are somehow a threat to you who did get vaccinated ?

Either you believe that the vaccine protects you or you dont ? So which is it ?

. . .


Just keep on buying the lie of modern medicine, Ill take my chances. India is doing better than about 60+ developed nations with no vaccine in sight for any but the elites.

FYI: Gleaned bits from various news sources.

Yesterday, the Serum Institute of India (SII) told Brazil, Saudi Arabia and Morocco that further supplies of the AstraZeneca COVID-19 vaccine will be delayed due to surging demand at home and as it works through a capacity expansion. The world's biggest vaccine maker, is being criticized domestically for donating or selling more doses than inoculations conducted at home, despite reporting the most number of coronavirus infections after the United States and Brazil. India is currently seeing a second surge of cases, taking its total to about 11.6 million. This came to light days after Britain said it would have to slow its COVID-19 vaccine roll-out next month as SII was likely to deliver more doses later than expected. SII has supplied half of the 10 million doses recently ordered by Britain. Brazil has already received 4 million doses from SII, Saudi Arabia 3 million doses and Morocco 7 million. The three countries had ordered 20 million each. SII, is the single-biggest maker of vaccines. It has partnered with AstraZeneca, the Gates Foundation and the Gavi vaccine alliance to make up to a billion doses for poorer countries. SII is working on expanding its monthly production to 100 million doses by April/May, from 60 million to 70 million now. SII was originally supposed to sell vaccines only to middle- and low-income countries, mainly in Asia and Africa, but production issues at other AstraZeneca facilities forced it to ship to many other countries as well on the British company's behalf. India has so far donated 8 million doses and sold nearly 52 million doses to a total of 75 countries, mainly the AstraZeneca shot made by SII. India has administered more than 44 million doses since starting its immunization campaign in the middle of January.