Covid vaccines: risk vs benefit alarming news

[Westcliffe01]

Or I will seek effective treatment using safer older drugs, like India, who have a much lower death rate than most western countries.


I think you are angry primarily over my non compliance. This country was founded on the basis of individual rights. You take your vaccine. You have no real idea if it is going to work against all the new variants. You behave as if in the rest of the world the same thing is going to happen as here, but it will not because those other people cant afford this treatment and do not have governments that can print money the way the western nations are doing now more than ever.


So if you plan to leave the US territorial waters or get on a plane, just remember the rest of the world is going to be full of virus incubators all hell bent on your death.....


If I get extremely ill Im not going to a hospital to drown in my bodily fluid. No thanks. I spent my late teens walking over 2000 miles lifting land mines, I probably know more about death than you could ever imagine.

Originally Posted by Shanachie

You certainly have the right to be stupid and not get a vaccine. You want to risk death, getting your legs amputated, whatever, that's perfectly within your rights.


Just make sure you have health insurance so my tax dollars don't subsidize your stupidity.



But the fact of the matter is that many people do not have access to vaccines yet. So people such as you who disobey the rules pose a threat to smart people who deserve a longer stay in this world.


You don't want a vaccine? Lock yourself inside for a couple of months. When we reach herd immunity, you can be free to do whatever you want.



I won't feel bad when you are in a hospital bed and say, oh crap, maybe that thing I read on the Internet wasn't true ...

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Sigh... the same old ##### discussion once again .

Vaccination programs work in TWO ways. Yes, they provide direct protection to those who are vaccinated. The level of protection ranges depending on the vaccine. In this case we have some highly effective vaccines, but none provide 100% protection. So even those who are vaccinated still face risk of the disease.

But the second, more important aspect of mass vaccination programs is that they create a barrier to further spread and hosting of the virus. Just like a fire-breaks stop the further spread of a forest fire, a vaccine-breaks halt the spread and help put out the conflagration faster. And just like with fire-breaks, every chink in the wall gives the fire, or in this case the virus, a way to carry on spreading.

So no... it's not just about you. It's about all of us. This is what some of you can't seem to grasp.

But it's probably going to be OK. There is such a high level of uptake that we can accommodate the free riders in the group. So carry on. The rest of us will pick up your slack.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?v...SQ9H2YcuBpbyPA

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by boatman61

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?v...SQ9H2YcuBpbyPA

No worries brother. For you, anything .

[MikeHoncho]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Wrong.. I have faith in my immune system dealing with the virus.. if as is now being stated is true that the vaccine prevents serious illness and death and, as recently stated reduces transmission why the panic..

Polo - “here hold my beer, I’ll be right back”

[MikeHoncho]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

So, after all of YOU have got your shots, that apparently you want, and can get sooner because of those of us that dont: How is it again that those who chose NOT to be vaccinated are somehow a threat to you who did get vaccinated ?

Either you believe that the vaccine protects you or you dont ? So which is it ?


Emily and Clark from Youtube spend a year in lockdown around the Bahamas, then the DR. Dont get covid. Then Emily has to get a surgical procedure, goes to hospital, gets covid from the staff, Clark gets it from her. If you want to get sick fast, go to hospital, it always works. Like the dialysis patients and cancer patients getting chemo on the same floor, 6 to a nurse. Want to see how fast you can kill those cancer patients with no immune system ? Or the bone marrow transfer scam that saves 2-4% of patients and kills 95%+. Just keep on buying the lie of modern medicine, Ill take my chances. India is doing better than about 60+ developed nations with no vaccine in sight for any but the elites.

Wow, do you know how many cancer patients there are out there with extended quality of life from modern medicine? How about cardiac patients? How about dialysis patients so depend on modern medicine 2 to 3 times a week at 4 hours a day? Hospitals have always been known and always will be know as a place for higher ability to contract disease because the diseased tend to go there. Your logic is flawed and contradicttive. Any idea how many people walk out of hospitals on a daily basis due to the ability of modern medicine?

[thinwater]

My other theory as to why the US has had one of the worst outcomes in the world, and arguably the worst, given the warning and medical care system we have, is that...


... Americans are stubborn and they don't listen.


See the above thread for proof.

[longjonsilver]

Whenever i started a thread on this forum about the virus it got deleted. Now they are all over. What gives?

jon

[lyl]

Originally Posted by sailingabe41ds

...Also, 85% of the people who died of Covid wore a mask...

Dear Abe,

People HAVE TO wear masks to protect OTHERS from getting Covid19!!! With all due respect, it has been more than a year since the pandemic started; you should have already learned this.

When you wear a mask, you DON'T protect yourself from catching Covid19. The people who wore masks ALSO died of Covid19, because the OTHER people around them DID NOT wear masks!!!

Respecfully,
Full.

https://youtu.be/KpXZkChOXwI

[double u]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

"being masked like a slave" - LOL

The distinguishing feature of being a slave is not having the right to act as you choose, in any way, in ways much more significant than the wearing of a slightly uncomfortable device when shopping.

I choose to wear a mask for the good of others (and myself).

the "anti-maskers" are a continous source of entertainment to me: people leading a "perfect mainstream" life, buying products being promoted in the media, "totally run-of-the-mill 9-to-fivers", living in their houses that all look the same behind their thuja hedges & following the prescribed way (career,kids, mortgage, holidays, "shopping", chasing their little comforts,...) being part of "the great machine"- & suddenly they discover the little revolutionary in themselves, they won't be commanded to "wear masks like slaves" - quite hilarious!

[double u]

"...buying the lie of modern medicine..."
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/...fig1_275959241

[Boatyarddog]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

Or I will seek effective treatment using safer older drugs, like India, who have a much lower death rate than most western countries.


I think you are angry primarily over my non compliance. This country was founded on the basis of individual rights. You take your vaccine. You have no real idea if it is going to work against all the new variants. You behave as if in the rest of the world the same thing is going to happen as here, but it will not because those other people cant afford this treatment and do not have governments that can print money the way the western nations are doing now more than ever.


So if you plan to leave the US territorial waters or get on a plane, just remember the rest of the world is going to be full of virus incubators all hell bent on your death.....


If I get extremely ill Im not going to a hospital to drown in my bodily fluid. No thanks. I spent my late teens walking over 2000 miles lifting land mines, I probably know more about death than you could ever imagine.

So, who speaks for the Hundreds of thousands of Native American Men Women And Children's Individual Rights White European Anglos so mercilessly pillaged and Plundered.
And still do!
Anti maskers Do Only One Thing...
They make Returning to a Normal Economy much further away.
If your sick you can't work!
I lived in Mi for 20 yrs.
Most are still living in the 60s
Get over it Michiganders, conspiracys are for anti socials.
Stop slowing down Democracy and Others Freedoms to be Free of ignorant disrespectful People, crying about helping out others by masking, during a Pandemic.

[double u]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Wrong.. I have faith in my immune system dealing with the virus..

much as I always value your knowledge, insights & opinions boatman61, I am now sorry that I have to say neither you nor I nor anybody else knows anything AT ALL about their immune system (not even the very few real experts are all that well informed about their own i.s.)! These are endlessly complicated biological mechanisms working at multiple levels that, I am told, go far beyond "I work out regularly & shower cold". Convictions, feelings & sentments don't count for anything, if it comes to our immune system.
& while it is perfectly alright to choose a riskier path for oneself, infecting others ...

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by double u

much as I always value your knowledge, insights & opinions boatman61, I am now sorry that I have to say neither you nor I nor anybody else knows anything AT ALL about their immune system (not even the very few real experts are all that well informed about their own i.s.)! These are endlessly complicated biological mechanisms working at multiple levels that, I am told, go far beyond "I work out regularly & shower cold". Convictions, feelings & sentments don't count for anything, if it comes to our immune system.
& while it is perfectly alright to choose a riskier path for oneself, infecting others ...

No claim to being an expert here, just working on my own bodies response to things many other's seem less resistant to.. I recover from injuries quicker than most, bone and flesh wounds, I take no anti malaria drugs when in places like India, Caribe, Panama etc.. often people go down with Dehli Belly who have eaten the same food as me..
I don't work out and showers are nothing to do with the immune system, it's all about one's resistance to invasive bacteria and viruses.. for which ones body relies on regular exposure to maintain a strong defence.. could be one of the reasons why on average Jains live longer than all other groups in India..
There is much to be said for Physician heal thyself..
I find this Western obsession with 'Kill 99% of all known germs' hilarious..

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by MarkSF

Israel is seeing transmission rates drop, as well as illness from the virus plummet. When they are back to normal life, will you admit you're wrong?

As is the UK. 66m people, 25m vaccinated resulting in Covid stats dropping faster than my Rocna on freefall.

A recent survey also stated that 91% of the population believe in the vaccination which is encouraging.

Pete

[Tupaia]

Originally Posted by Westcliffe01

Or I will seek effective treatment using safer older drugs, like India, who have a much lower death rate than most western countries.

Average age in US 38.5 years average weight 20 year old + 197lbs


Average age in India 29 years average weight of males 143 lbs


Average ages in Western countries with very high rates

UK 40.5, Spain 44, Italy 45.7


Covid is known to be more deadly if you are old or obese.



It's your call make your own judgement as to survivability depending on your age and weight.