New study of jabbed in the journal "Circulation"

[Greg K]

Originally Posted by Joefiss

I'll just throw this out there. Who says the CDC isn't posting data for breakthrough infections? https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tra...vaccine-status
Vaccine efficacy. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ugh-cases.html

As I noted in my post, Fauci himself admitted that the CDC had not been tracking breakthrough infections in an interview with Sara Eisen on CNBC.
Here's the relevant excerpt from that interview:

EISEN: 100%. But it says on the CDC website, Dr. Fauci, that infections happen in only a small proportion of people who are fully vaccinated and when these infections occur among the vaccinated, they tend to be mild, but the CDC doesn’t even track the breakthrough infections. So how do we know that they’re happening to a small proportion and how do we know that they are tending to be mild? It’s not a question of whether hospitalizations and death, we know that benefit, it’s just public messaging and being transparent about the risk for vaccinated people.
FAUCI: Well, in the past, the CDC has not, you’re quite correct, tracked all real and potential asymptomatic infections. They are modifying that right now in the studies that are being done that would give the kind of information that you’re talking about….



Of course, the real question that wasn't asked is " why not?" Why hadn't the CDC been tracking breakthrough infections. You'd figure that from a research perspective this sort of data would be crucial to understanding the efficacy of the vaccines.

Full interview:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/01/cnbc...ell-today.html

[GordMay]

According to the CDC’s website, “Possibility of COVID-19 Illness after Vaccination” [Updated Nov. 9, 2021]

“CDC is collecting data on vaccine breakthrough infections and is closely monitoring the safety and effectiveness of all Food and Drug Administration (FDA) approved and authorized COVID-19 vaccines.
The latest data on rates of COVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths by vaccination status are available from the CDC COVID Data Tracker.
CDC has multiple surveillance systems and ongoing research studies to monitor the performance of vaccines in preventing infection, disease, hospitalization, and death."
CDC also collects data on vaccine breakthrough infections through outbreak investigations.”

Here ➥ https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ugh-cases.html

Emphasis mine.

[sailorboy1]

What is missing from this "debate" is the God factor, or alien conspiracy if you prefer.

I don't really understand why people feel it is so important to "win" this vaccinate argument online. What does each side feel they are accomplishing other that to tell each how stupid they are?

Face it, covid-19 is here to stay just like the flu. Each year some get the flu shot and some don't. I never used to get it, till one year I caught the flu and know feel my risk from the shot is preferred over getting it again. Just like I had covid before the shot and don't want to go through that again so got that vaccine plus the booster.

Since in the end no one if going to force EVERYONE to get the shot, some are going to get the shot and some aren't. It will continue to breed into new strains and we will learn to live with it just like the flu.

[Sand crab]

My newly divorced sis is a travel agent and gets these free or greatly discounted cruise ship deals all the time. She got a freebie deal on Branson's brand new Scarlet Lady ship sailing out of Miami. Normally her ex would accompany her but he's out so she asked me. Let me see, free vacay, no kids allowed, hmmmm. HELL YEAH. I just have to pay air fare. We sail Dec. 10.

The cruise ship requires proof of vacc. You can whine about that but the countries we will be visiting require it too. So I had my main shot and then a booster 2 weeks ago. But even if it wasn't required would you really want to be in a tin can with a bunch of wheezing old geezers (like me) for a week without it? At least Biil Gates can track me to help me find my way back to the ship if I (probably) (make that definitely) have to much do drink on shore leave.
The moral of this story is that you gotta get the shot if you want to cruise your own boat to distant lands and that shot is probably safer than most things we ingest.
Sis has another freebie in a few months!!!! HELL YEAH

[danstanford]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

I don't really understand why people feel it is so important to "win" this vaccinate argument online. What does each side feel they are accomplishing other that to tell each how stupid they are?


Since in the end no one if going to force EVERYONE to get the shot, some are going to get the shot and some aren't. It will continue to breed into new strains and we will learn to live with it just like the flu.

I completely agree with your question. If you are a curious person and make any effort to read both sides you will be left with many questions and unknowns. I got vaccinated knowing there might be downstream risks from the vaccine but felt the higher risk lay in not getting the vaccine.

It is my belief that we have breached most of the herd immunity vaccination levels to put a stop to this thing without successfully stopping it. It will become a risk in life like a host of others. If there is a low single digit percentage risk of death from getting the virus we will continue to develop strategies for mitigating this risk and will have to carry on. In my city there are far more suicides currently than Covid deaths.

[Joefiss]

Originally Posted by Greg K

As I noted in my post, Fauci himself admitted that the CDC had not been tracking breakthrough infections in an interview with Sara Eisen on CNBC.
Here's the relevant excerpt from that interview:

EISEN: 100%. But it says on the CDC website, Dr. Fauci, that infections happen in only a small proportion of people who are fully vaccinated and when these infections occur among the vaccinated, they tend to be mild, but the CDC doesn’t even track the breakthrough infections. So how do we know that they’re happening to a small proportion and how do we know that they are tending to be mild? It’s not a question of whether hospitalizations and death, we know that benefit, it’s just public messaging and being transparent about the risk for vaccinated people.
FAUCI: Well, in the past, the CDC has not, you’re quite correct, tracked all real and potential asymptomatic infections. They are modifying that right now in the studies that are being done that would give the kind of information that you’re talking about….



Of course, the real question that wasn't asked is " why not?" Why hadn't the CDC been tracking breakthrough infections. You'd figure that from a research perspective this sort of data would be crucial to understanding the efficacy of the vaccines.

Full interview:
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/01/cnbc...ell-today.html

This may help clear up the confusion. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ctiveness.html

[Greg K]

Originally Posted by Joefiss

This may help clear up the confusion. https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...ctiveness.html

Confusion about what? You asked: " Who says the CDC isn't posting data for breakthrough infections? " I answered and provided a link. That CNBC interview with Fauci was in October, I believe. Is there some confusion about what he said?

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by Greg K

Confusion about what? You asked: " Who says the CDC isn't posting data for breakthrough infections? " I answered and provided a link. That CNBC interview with Fauci was in October, I believe. Is there some confusion about what he said?

Only for the True Believers..

[Greg K]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

Well, at least I'm the better-informed idiot.

Idiots who think they are better informed are common and mostly harmless.

It's the idiots with power who think they are better informed and get to decide for the rest of us that keep me up at night.

Thankfully, you seem to be in the former group.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Greg K

Idiots who think they are better informed are common and mostly harmless.

It's the idiots with power who think they are better informed and get to decide for the rest of us that keep me up at night.

Thankfully, you seem to be in the former group.

Thankfully, the idiots who think they are better informed than the actual experts, aren't in power. And doubly-thankfully, most people are smart enough to know who the idiots are, and aren't listening to them.

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Once again, the Internet experts are arrogantly arguing they know better than actual experts. And in the standard methodology of the disinformation pandemic, are cherry-picking individual studies and data to push their misinformed opinion.

I'll continue to listen to actual experts.

Howard Zucker was a SME as director of health for New York State. That is, till he was found to have colluded to hide COVID deaths. Not an expert anymore.

Someone said pages back FOLLOW THE MONEY. Anytime there’s money to be made the politicians get in on it, that’s what they do. From there on, pretty much everything is suspect. That’s the point some are trying to make. The higher the expert, the more likely they are corrupted.

[Mike OReilly]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

Howard Zucker was a SME as director of health for New York State. That is, till he was found to have colluded to hide COVID deaths. Not an expert anymore.

Someone said pages back FOLLOW THE MONEY. Anytime there’s money to be made the politicians get in on it, that’s what they do. From there on, pretty much everything is suspect. That’s the point some are trying to make. The higher the expert, the more likely they are corrupted.

This is a perfect example of the paranoid disinformation that is spreading worse than the virus. Cherry-pick a few bad apples, and then leap to the conclusion that everyone is corrupt.

As I keep saying, get out of your info silo and look at the real world. It's not nearly as scary as you believe.

[boatman61]

[sy_gilana]

Children playing with grenades.
Illiterate playing with words.
I come here to learn about boat stuff.

Please take this thread to another place.

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

Once again, the Internet experts are arrogantly arguing they know better than actual experts. And in the standard methodology of the disinformation pandemic, are cherry-picking individual studies and data to push their misinformed opinion.

I'll continue to listen to actual experts.

Originally Posted by Mike OReilly

This is a perfect example of the paranoid disinformation that is spreading worse than the virus. Cherry-pick a few bad apples, and then leap to the conclusion that everyone is corrupt.

As I keep saying, get out of your info silo and look at the real world. It's not nearly as scary as you believe.

Mike, I’m a researcher. And a lot of my research debunks the purported experts. In fact, sometimes even real experts! Some are man enough to admit they erred, and some dig in their heels.

Come on, what am I to do? Sure Zucker is anecdotal but the situation is indicative of the systemic misinformation campaign by an entire state government. From the THIRD governor in a row to resign!

I’m no COVID expert. What I am pretty good at is researching the corruption behind conventionally accepted and repeated stories. From the Bonus Army massacre through the fact than most Nazi ball bearings came from USA not Schweinfurt. From the truth about why the Senecas at Ganondagan got their butts kicked to the interior penetration of the Vikings (now that I say that I had to correct an esteemed Canadian researcher on relics…HE was appreciative. A SME who could admit fault.). And I’m constantly correcting a particular Canadian SME on iNaturalist (really, the two cited examples being Canadian is a coincidence.). Then we have NYS government that has a long history of disinformation due to the influence of corruption. Frankly, if comes from NYS I automatically consider it deceptive and false.

It’s inappropriate and incorrect to accuse me of being in some sort of information silo. I’m well studied on varried topics, have published multiple reference books on differing topics. I’ve observed and experienced “events” and corruption worldwide, at times being involved at revealing the corruption. That doesn’t always make me popular. The ministers in Marshall Islands don’t much care for me, since I lost them each a million dollar payoff. Oops. There some in AUS defence that would love to kill me since they effed up a costly project “I told you so.”

What do you want to talk about? AUS theft of military relics from Solomon Islands? How to get into the lagoon on Raro everyone says you can’t get into? The unidentified species of Tiger Swallowtail in NY and Ontario? Why not to eat street food in Bangkok? I can’t do much on COVID, but I can talk about the many covers up and corrupt laws in NYS that impacted a lot of people.