Northern Europe during Pandemic -- Summers 2020 & 2021 & onwards

[Wotname]

Dockhead, thanks for continuing to post these summaries. They give us down under, a better picture of the Covid situation in N Europe.

[skipmac]

Have been traveling a lot recently so lost track of all the updates on this thread. But maybe some first hand observations.

We were in Paris last week. Very few wearing masks outside and on the street but mask wearing mandatory on all public transportation. Took the Metro several times and saw 99.9% compliance. All even wore the mask over mouth AND nose (wish Americans could figure that one out). Masks also mandatory in most stores, lobbies and all museums and other public attractions. Speaking of museums, the Louvre is cool but the Musée d'Orsay, especially the collection of impressionists (including pre and post) will take your breath away.

Now doing a river cruise in south central France (Lot) and things are a bit more casual here. Some cafes and restaurants all staff is masked, some not at all. Most stores everyone is wearing masks but a few not. Again almost no one wearing masks on the street.

Not that it has any significance but informally, everyone I ask says they have had the two jabs.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by skipmac

. . . Not that it has any significance but informally, everyone I ask says they have had the two jabs.

France has delivered 97 doses of vaccine per 100 people, almost as many as Sweden, and only slightly less than the U.S.


It is amazing how Europe accelerated the vaccine program after the slow start. The EU has basically caught up with the U.S. and is still vaccinating 0.78 people per 100 every day, day in and day out, compared to 0.15 in the U.S.



Based on "people vaccinated" (how many people have gotten at least one shot), it looks even better -- Europe has already passed the U.S., and in Finland it's already 65%. This is the result of the policy of stretching out doses in order to get a greater number of people with at least some protection.



It means that within weeks, the cumulative number of vaccinations per capita in Europe will far outpace the U.S., where I think we have hit a wall of vaccine reluctance which does not apparently exist in Europe.


I'm really optimistic now that not only Northern Europe, but Europe as a whole has basically crawled out from under this thing finally, and that life should be more or less back to normal from the autumn.



The Delta variant is of course a concern but at this rate of vaccination, surely we will soon reach the point where even that will start to be snuffed out.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

It means that within weeks, the cumulative number of vaccinations per capita in Europe will far outpace the U.S., where I think we have hit a wall of vaccine reluctance which does not apparently exist in Europe.

That wall of reluctance is rather disheartening. I actually know people that think the vaccine carries an alien AI tracker chip. Then there's the "it's a free country" group and the "Covid isn't any worse than a cold so why get a vaccine" group and the "it hasn't been tested" group plus a few more. Sigh.

[goboatingnow]

Just flew back from Greece to get my second AZ paradoxically those on non AZ are finished before me

Vaccine take up running at 98% currently , with 18-25 now eligible to register. They can chose phizer Moderna or Johnson

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Just flew back from Greece to get my second AZ paradoxically those on non AZ are finished before me

Vaccine take up running at 98% currently , with 18-25 now eligible to register. They can chose phizer Moderna or Johnson

Currently no travel restrictions within the EU for pcr tested , recovered from COVID or fully vaccinated

Life beginning to return to normal

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by skipmac

That wall of reluctance is rather disheartening. I actually know people that think the vaccine carries an alien AI tracker chip. Then there's the "it's a free country" group and the "Covid isn't any worse than a cold so why get a vaccine" group and the "it hasn't been tested" group plus a few more. Sigh.

Discouraging. But I guess in the longer run the result will be the same -- those people will end up getting infected, and so get immunized that way instead of the other.


Some of the things Tegnell in Sweden said at the beginning of the pandemic are looking rather prophetic now -- this is going to keep on going and on and on until nearly everyone has either been vaccinated or has been infected.


The Delta variant puts herd immunity even further out of reach.


I think the only thing we can say now is that as long as it's not killing large numbers of people, we're just going to have to live with it. And no one has the heart for any more restrictions.

[CatNewBee]

UK have declared the independence from covid and lifted all restrictions last monday. No masks, distancing or whatsoever mandatory from the govt, back to normal and back to own responsible behavior.

Big outrage in the EU media btw.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by CatNewBee

UK have declared the independence from covid and lifted all restrictions last monday. No masks, distancing or whatsoever mandatory from the govt, back to normal and back to own responsible behavior.

Big outrage in the EU media btw.

A policy that only has about 10% support within the U.K.

“But so as not to spoil freedom day, the public was not supposed to know about it. The Health Service Journal reports that three NHS chief executives have been banned from speaking to the media about the “unsustainable pressure” their hospitals are facing, and banned from commenting on the reckless removal of masks, social distancing and indoor gathering limits. They confirmed that NHS chiefs’ WhatsApp group has “quite a few angry people” commenting on leaders’ failure to signal the present danger. “There is a sense that we are expected [by government] to pretend it’s all over.”

Source :Guardian

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

A policy that only has about 10% support within the U.K.

“But so as not to spoil freedom day, the public was not supposed to know about it. The Health Service Journal reports that three NHS chief executives have been banned from speaking to the media about the “unsustainable pressure” their hospitals are facing, and banned from commenting on the reckless removal of masks, social distancing and indoor gathering limits. They confirmed that NHS chiefs’ WhatsApp group has “quite a few angry people” commenting on leaders’ failure to signal the present danger. “There is a sense that we are expected [by government] to pretend it’s all over.”

Source :Guardian

Sure, but after an entire year of extremely restrictive and oppressive measures, how much more do you think the public -- and the economy -- could endure in any case?


This is the folly of unsustainable measures. At some point it is impossible to continue them no matter how much you may need them.



There's not much death -- the vulbnerable are nearly all vaccinated now in the UK. I'm not sure that it's such a bad idea to declare "freedom".


A better idea would have been to implement measures which were less destructive and which were long term sustainable. But we missed that boat.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Sure, but after an entire year of extremely restrictive and oppressive measures, how much more do you think the public -- and the economy -- could endure in any case?


This is the folly of unsustainable measures. At some point it is impossible to continue them no matter how much you may need them.



There's not much death -- the vulbnerable are nearly all vaccinated now in the UK. I'm not sure that it's such a bad idea to declare "freedom".


A better idea would have been to implement measures which were less destructive and which were long term sustainable. But we missed that boat.

Yes but if the medical situation forces a change of political plan , exactly as the uk was forced to do last year , it will cause massive chaos and political fallout.

COVID isn’t listening to Boris

[sy_gilana]

Hi Dockhead.


What would the protocol be for a 60m motoryacht to do the Norwegian fjords if coming from The Netherlands, some crew vaccinated, others have recovered. ETA Mid August.

Maybe Denmark for 10 days then Norway?

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by sy_gilana

Hi Dockhead.


What would the protocol be for a 60m motoryacht to do the Norwegian fjords if coming from The Netherlands, some crew vaccinated, others have recovered. ETA Mid August.

Maybe Denmark for 10 days then Norway?

Not dockhead but here’s the info I have

“Passengers entering Norway who have proof of full vaccination or who have had COVID-19 in the last six months are exempt from quarantine providing they can show proof of vaccination/recovery. Currently, only presentation of a COVID-19 certificate (Norwegian, Danish, Swedish or EU digital COVID certificate) with a QR code which can be verified by the Norwegian authorities is considered to be a secure and verifiable way of proving vaccination or previous illness.

Partially vaccinated passengers must quarantine – at a private residence – for three days upon arrival and can exit quarantine after this time providing they test negative via PCR test. Full information on entry requirements for Norway can be found here.

Children between 12 and 18 must test negative via PCR or antigen test 24 hours before travel to Norway.

All passengers, with the exception of fully vaccinated persons and persons who have had COVID-19 during the past six months, are obliged to register when entering Norway by completing a travel registration form before travelling to the country. Registration can be completed here. In addition, they must take an antigen test at their port of entry in Norway.

“

[sy_gilana]

Thanks for that. So, if they clear in but stay on board for a qt period it should be allowed. (Private residence) I think it could be interpreted as such.

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by sy_gilana

Thanks for that. So, if they clear in but stay on board for a qt period it should be allowed. (Private residence) I think it could be interpreted as such.

One would assume that. Yes. But it may need clarification.