The Reality of Living in Australia and Covid

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Vaccination program in Australia is absolutely unbelievable, if these numbers can be believed:


Attachment 246511


Oz passed the U.S. a week or two ago and will pass the EU in the next days, for people with at least one dose in them.


Who would have expected such a zero to hero feat?


The people fully vaccinated numbers are much less than this, but that's not the important metric. The rate of vaccination continues at over 1 per 100 per day despite already reaching a fairly high vaccination rate. This is phenomenal.


And reflected already in the daily case numbers, which are increasing at a non-exponential rate.


I would thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon. This is what the end looks like.


Norway and Denmark have already declared an end to the pandemic and have pulled off everything. I hope Sweden and Finland will follow soon. I was starting to think normal life would never return.

I think it more honest to say that Norway and Denmark have declared an end to restrictions ( after 561 days in the case of Norway ).

I would thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon.
We care little for your thoughts, in most Australian states there are no restrictions.



Here in Australia we are not surprised, its Australia, its what we do.
We were building aircraft some 20 years before we were building motor cars. You probably didn't know that.

You should visit one day.

[GILow]

Now that the vaccine rates are increasing there seems to be an endless stream of NGOs, politicians, religious leaders and b list celebrities lining up to explain how their actions are to thank for the increase.

None of them want to acknowledge that there’s nothing like the prospect of dying horribly to focus the mind and get the jab. All it took was a decent outbreak in a state and hey presto, the punters are tripping over themselves to get vaxxed.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I think it more honest to say that Norway and Denmark have declared an end to restrictions ( after 561 days in the case of Norway ).

I would thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon.
We care little for your thoughts, in most Australian states there are no restrictions.

Just because you don't experience them yourself in your town, doesn't mean they don't exist. The Stringency Index for Oz is at over 70 and has been over 70 for most of the pandemic, among the strictest measures in the world:





Maybe most Australian STATES are not under much restrictions, but most of the Australian POPULATION certainly is, and has been, for a long time.


As to "561 days of restrictions in Norway" -- I thought we had this conversation already. In Norway, like in the rest of our region, the restrictions have been mostly stuff like recommendations to wash your hands frequently. There was never any lockdown in Norway; everyone was always free to move around as one liked, but for one brief period of a few weeks when people were asked not to visit their country homes. Schools were closed only briefly and have been open without interruption for more than a year. You are confused if you think that looks anything like Australia. I think Melbourne holds the world record for days of stay at home orders -- the opposite extreme from Oslo which had exactly zero days of stay at home orders. https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2021...ckdown-record/



Whether all those restrictions were worth it or not, I'm not commenting -- we'll know more after the dust settles. But it is a fact that the measures in Oz were extreme compared to the rest of the world.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by GILow

Now that the vaccine rates are increasing there seems to be an endless stream of NGOs, politicians, religious leaders and b list celebrities lining up to explain how their actions are to thank for the increase.

None of them want to acknowledge that there’s nothing like the prospect of dying horribly to focus the mind and get the jab. All it took was a decent outbreak in a state and hey presto, the punters are tripping over themselves to get vaxxed.

To quote my mate Ed Zackery - central government screws up procurement combined with no covid = happy.
Covid combined with vaccine supply = oops better put me socks on.

[Fore and Aft]

Ping this is another great down under fact even if we have to give the East Islanders credit.
Is anyone else noticing that mentioning Covid at BBQ's or with strangers is a social gamble not worth taking?
Cheers
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ind...128.html%3famp

[GordMay]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

...1. I would thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon. This is what the end looks like.
2. Norway and Denmark have already declared an end to the pandemic and have pulled off everything. I hope Sweden and Finland will follow soon. I was starting to think normal life would never return.

1. Of course you would.
From the very beginning, you’ve never expressed support for restrictions, which don’t conform to your libertarian world-view, nor support your privileged [*jet-setting, socialite, yachtsman] lifestyle. You’ve consistently expressed your dismissive perspectives, and disapproval, very eloquently.
* Not criticizing, just observing.


Norway recently lifted COVID-19 restrictions.

2. That distortion appears to be a misrepresentation of a health official’s recent interview with a Norwegian newspaper.
Geir Bukholm said, in an interview, that Norway would begin to view COVID-19 as a respiratory disease with seasonal variation. He explained that the country’s vaccination rate meant that those at high risk from COVID-19 were protected and that the disease was now not likely to burden its health care system — though he said the pandemic wasn’t over, citing countries with low vaccination rates.

“Our position, as stated in the news article, is that at this point in the pandemic we must start approaching covid-19 as one of several respiratory diseases circulating with seasonal variation,” Vold’s statement said. “This means that the control measures that will be applicable for various respiratory diseases will require the same level of societal preparedness. This does not mean that illness from corona virus and the seasonal flu are similar.”

It continued: “On an individual level, people must receive the correct treatment for the specific disease. We will be continuously following the epidemiology of both covid-19 and other respiratory diseases and will be prepared to react differently [if] circumstances worsen.”

[1] Interview ➥ https://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/...-med-influensa

In ENGLISH ➥ https://covidcalltohumanity.org/wp-c...Translated.pdf

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by GordMay

1. Of course you would.
From the very beginning, you’ve never expressed support for restrictions, which don’t conform to your libertarian world-view, nor support your privileged [jet-setting, socialite, yachtsman] lifestyle. You’ve consistently expressed your dismissive perspectives, and disapproval, very eloquently.

Well, my views have evolved. And Australia is a particularly interesting case as it could be (possibly with NZ) a unique case of very strict measures which seem to have delivered really good results. In other parts of the world, strict measures are associated with poor results, with a high degree of correlation.



But you're wrong to say that my objection to needlessly strict pandemic measures has to do with my "privileged" lifestyle. Nor is any of this all that "libertarian" -- for example, I don't have any big problem with vaccine mandates despite SeaworthyLass's very intelligent and powerful arguments against them. Every libertarian has a point at which the common good trumps individual rights. Vaccination for me is well beyond that point, although I do admit that I might be wrong about somethings that SeaworthyLass might be right about.


My main objection to overly strict pandemic measures are that they might be stupid -- that is, doing more harm than good, something not even considered by fanatics. And even more, that overly strict pandemic measures might be benefiting a particular social group -- older, wealthier, whiter people who have a lot to fear from the virus but nothing to fear from unemployment, school closings, etc.; versus younger, healthier, poorer people who are not at much risk from the virus but whose lives can be devastated by unemployment or school closings, etc.



But I don't claim to know what measures are right, or that there is even a single set of measures which are right for all countries in all circumstances. As I keep saying -- we need time for the dust to settle and for a proper sober analysis to be done. It's good, though, to keep the question in mind -- is this really worthwhile? Are we doing more harm than good?

Originally Posted by GordMay

Norway recently lifted COVID-19 restrictions.

2. That distortion appears to be a misrepresentation of a health official’s recent interview with a Norwegian newspaper.
Geir Bukholm said, in an interview, that Norway would begin to view COVID-19 as a respiratory disease with seasonal variation. He explained that the country’s vaccination rate meant that those at high risk from COVID-19 were protected and that the disease was now not likely to burden its health care system — though he said the pandemic wasn’t over, citing countries with low vaccination rates.

“Our position, as stated in the news article, is that at this point in the pandemic we must start approaching covid-19 as one of several respiratory diseases circulating with seasonal variation,” Vold’s statement said. “This means that the control measures that will be applicable for various respiratory diseases will require the same level of societal preparedness. This does not mean that illness from corona virus and the seasonal flu are similar.”

It continued: “On an individual level, people must receive the correct treatment for the specific disease. We will be continuously following the epidemiology of both covid-19 and other respiratory diseases and will be prepared to react differently [if] circumstances worsen.”

[1] Interview ➥ https://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/...-med-influensa

I don't know what you think is a distortion. Norway (also Denmark) has ended the state of emergency (as of 25 September) and has officially gone over to treating COVID as an ordinary respiratory disease rather than a pandemic, just as explained in your quote. No one said the pandemic is over worldwide. Just that it is no longer considered a pandemic in Norway. That's what people were wildly celebrating in the streets of Oslo recently. The official return to normal life.



I'm writing this from Helsinki, and we're not quite there yet here, but getting close. Actually it looks like we're the last Nordic country to declare the end of the pandemic -- I see Sweden just did so as well. I can tell you that the universal mood here is that we've had quite enough of "temporary" and "emergency" measures and it's high time to get back to completely normal life. Even if we never had any really burdensome restrictions. I get the feeling that what were supposed to be short-term emergency measures have taken on a quality of permanence in much of the world, which seems to me to be some kind of nightmare.


Japan is another country which has just ended its state of emergency. See: https://iamamalaysian.com/2021/10/04...ing-to-normal/

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Fore and Aft

Ping this is another great down under fact even if we have to give the East Islanders credit.
Is anyone else noticing that mentioning Covid at BBQ's or with strangers is a social gamble not worth taking?
Cheers
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ind...128.html%3famp

I believe that it is a prohibited topic of conversation at hairdressers.

Speaking of which I sighted a message just yesterday from a NSW hairdresser that a family member frequents ' It is non of our business whether you are vaccinated or not. However if you are not vaccinated please call to discuss your appointment.'

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Just because you don't experience them yourself in your town, doesn't mean they don't exist.
I don't live in a town. 'Town' is a day out for me.I do however have family in both Melbourne and the ACT and friends strung out along the east coast. I have a pretty good idea what has been and is going on - apart from Sydney - not even the state government knows what is going on there . I don't have to rely on graphs.

The Stringency Index for Oz is at over 70 and has been over 70 for most of the pandemic, among the strictest measures in the world:


Attachment 246512


Maybe most Australian STATES are not under much restrictions, but most of the Australian POPULATION certainly is, and has been, for a long time.

Melbourne has been the place that has suffered these long restrictions but even these present restrictions have only been in place since mid July -they came in while I was on holiday overseas. Melbourne has 5 million of Australia's 25 million people - hardly *most* of the country's population.
As to "561 days of restrictions in Norway" -- I thought we had this conversation already. In Norway, like in the rest of our region, the restrictions have been mostly stuff like recommendations to wash your hands frequently. There was never any lockdown in Norway; everyone was always free to move around as one liked, but for one brief period of a few weeks when people were asked not to visit their country homes. Schools were closed only briefly and have been open without interruption for more than a year. You are confused if you think that looks anything like Australia. I think Melbourne holds the world record for days of stay at home orders -- the opposite extreme from Oslo which had exactly zero days of stay at home orders. https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2021...ckdown-record/



Whether all those restrictions were worth it or not, I'm not commenting -- we'll know more after the dust settles. But it is a fact that the measures in Oz ***were*** extreme compared to the rest of the world.

Past tense? Measures in Melbourne still are quite extreme but are expected to ease at the end of this month when we get past 80% double vaxxed.

Compared to the rest of the world? Try Chile.

[El Pinguino]

A lovely sunny day here so I am about to head out.
A bit of news that slipped past most of us yesterday. Victoria has eased border restrictions on most of NSW apart from Sydney. Someone decided they made no sense any more as Vic now has more Covid than NSW.

NSW has hit their first target and are easing Sydney restrictions on Monday.

And NZ has accepted that Covid will become endemic throughout the country.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/hea...le-say-experts

[RaymondR]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Vaccines help even in the healthy young. Helping is enough reason for me. No one is forcing young people to be vaccinated . All vaccines were offered on a voluntary basis.

Here 90% take up suggests the anti Vaxxers argument held very little sway.

This argument is now stale. Vaccines for COVID are here to stay. Most people will take them. Move along now nothing to see here

And whether or not you get yourself vaccinated is a personal choice the same as looking left and right before crossing a busy road and if you choose not then you're no loss to the gene pool.

[UFO]

Originally Posted by El Pinguino

I would thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon.
We care little for your thoughts, in most Australian states there are no restrictions.

Really, Must be nice in your alternate reality..... Whilst back to the real world there are a few million who would disagree with you.

[El Pinguino]

Originally Posted by UFO

Really, Must be nice in your alternate reality..... Whilst back to the real world there are a few million who would disagree with you.

You are aware that I was quoting Dockhead, it was he who gave us that gratuitous advice ' I would (be) thinking about pulling off the restrictions pretty soon'. Post 1410

[Group9]

Originally Posted by sinnerman

This is a boaters forum . Not a "how life sucks under COVID blog".

Let's keep it that way.

There are plenty of other places for people to vent frustrations other than this forum.

I come here to brighten up my day, not be dragged down by the daily BS.

My two cents

It’s basically become the boating doom and gloom site. Best thing to do, (and I really need to take my own advice) is to get off the internet and get in the water.

We have become a society of crying babies. Imagine how upset we would have been in WW2.

[Alan Mighty]

Alert for Medicare-card bearing Aussie cruisers who happen to be over age 70:

story is the Aus govt will at the end of October 2021 end free vaccination with Zostavax against shingles. Thereafter vax against shingles will hit the pocket for $A300-ish.

Vax against shingles is 'likely' valid for 5 years, no more.

https://www.health.gov.au/health-top...tion-service-0

https://nationalseniors.com.au/news/...-vaccinate-now