U.S. to close..

[atoll]

Originally Posted by UFO

Well that's the problem - Its not like humans have a great track record of screwing with nature, Just look at Australia we've made a few cock ups here!


These are 100% experimental vaccines, they have NEVER been tried or tested before covid. The current Pfizer one is based on a genetic manipulation of mRNA whilst the Oxford one is a genetically modified chimpanzee cold virus spliced with genetically modified Covid proteins. There is a reason that the genetic modification of plants has a long, slow and well tested path to ensure the safety of the planet and all species onboard, yet these vaccines are being rushed through at breakneck speed.



Its all very well to test and say there is no major issues on 50K people, but when you are rolling this out on a planetary level then its a whole different ballgame and as far as the LONG TERM effects of such a vaccine, they simply do not have a clue - It could have untold consequences on the human race which could range from devastating to pretty much nothing - The point is they do not know and will only find out (if they were to ever admit it) years or tens of years down the line.


So they are really throwing the dice here, as Clint used to say, "Are you feeling Lucky Punk?"



Putting the trillions of $ profit aside, is it really worth it to protect 0.016% of the worlds populace per year (actually less as there will still be major deaths after the vaccine) for the risk to the rest of the worlds populace and whatever may come of it in the future?

sound familiar,regarding how Mrna vaccines work using cell proteins

https://www.dana-farber.org/newsroom...birth-defects/

"More than 60 years after the drug thalidomide caused birth defects in thousands of children whose mothers took the drug while pregnant, scientists at Dana-Farber Cancer Institute have solved a mystery that has lingered ever since the dangers of the drug first became apparent: how did the drug produce such severe fetal harm?

The answer, published online today by the journal Elife, not only helps resolve an issue that has been the subject of scientific curiosity for two generations, but will be critical as pharmaceutical companies develop a promising new generation of anticancer drugs that share a basic chemical architecture with thalidomide, the study authors say.

Building on years of previous research, the researchers found that thalidomide acts by promoting the degradation of an unexpectedly wide range of transcription factors – cell proteins that help switch genes on or off – including one called SALL4. The result is the complete removal of SALL4 from cells."

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by UFO

Well that's the problem - Its not like humans have a great track record of screwing with nature, Just look at Australia we've made a few cock ups here!

Indeed the law of large numbers and regression to the mean always prevails, something to always keep in mind, for context.

So they are really throwing the dice here, as Clint used to say, "Are you feeling Lucky Punk?"

There's a lot to statistics but let's parse it down to these two terms:
-number needed to treat (NNT)
-number needed to harm (NNH)

Example:
NNT=how many people have to wear a seatbelt how many km/miles to save a life
NNH=how many people have to wear a seatbelt how many km/miles to kill someone (e.g. in an unusual accident sequence where the seatbelt somehow contributed to death)

So when the NNT is lower than the NNH, this means the intervention is more likely to help than harm (at least when the thing prevented is itself very bad).

But two other terms:
-Absolute risk
-Relative risk

Even if you don't wear a seatbelt, your absolute risk of dying in a car is very, very low. But if that car is in a serious accident, then the relative risk of you dying is high...relative to twin-you-in-a-parallel-universe who was wearing a seatbelt.

The thing about calculating risk is...you have to be familiar with as many contributing variables as possible, and there are infinite number of them. If your personality is not predisposed to collecting information and numbers, then you'll always be a one-legged man in an ass-kicking contest whenever the subject of discussing risk comes up. You'll be focused on this/that risk point that you think is important, because you're familiar with it and because you don't have context (other risk variables) to place it into (in other words heavily observation biased).

So what is a vaccine anyway. It's a clump of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids, salts that gets put under your skin. Go scrape your leg anywhere on the planet and you'll expose your immune system to new/novel combination of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids, and salts that it hasn't seen before. The principle different between a vaccination campaign and scraping your leg on a rock is that everyone has to scrape their leg on the same type of rock.

If exposing one's self to new combinations of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids and salts seems a scary proposition, it's best to stay on the couch.

Putting the trillions of $ profit aside, is it really worth it to protect 0.016% of the worlds populace per year (actually less as there will still be major deaths after the vaccine) for the risk to the rest of the worlds populace and whatever may come of it in the future?

At some point you have to realize that other people built your Lagoon 440, other people build/maintain the roads you drive on, other people build hospitals and go to school to learn how to work on them. It's easy to sit on your boat and call them all suckers, slave drones to a group think paradigm....but it's only easy to do this because some combination of govt officials made laws that somehow made it legal for you to afford a Lagoon 440, not contributing...not taking risks...just like everyone else does. In social science, people who reap excessive benefits without contributing (taking risks and all) are called free riders. You might want to review that subject at some point.

[UFO]

Originally Posted by Singularity

At some point you have to realize that other people built your Lagoon 440, other people build/maintain the roads you drive on, other people build hospitals and go to school to learn how to work on them. It's easy to sit on your boat and call them all suckers, slave drones to a group think paradigm....but it's only easy to do this because some combination of govt officials made laws that somehow made it legal for you to afford a Lagoon 440, not contributing...not taking risks...just like everyone else does. In social science, people who reap excessive benefits without contributing (taking risks and all) are called free riders. You might want to review that subject at some point.

Ohh as i do not want to take a risk with my families genetic material or that of most of the planet with an experimental vaccine which is being rolled out without any of the normal testing time frames used for standard vaccines, let alone a vaccine using genetically modified material which has never been attempted before, which will be used to protect a minuscule % of the worlds populace who in the bulk are all over the age of 75 where the planetary average age of death is lower than this at 72.6 I am a Freeloader? Really, I am not sure how you managed to make that connection, but I think that you fully pulled that one out of your posterior and to judge someone in such a way whom you have never met from a few posts that do not agree with you on a forum, just shows the kind of person that you are.



As Atoll pointed out above with thalidomide, drugs can and do have unintended consequences and that is just one example, but a good one - read the article. Its also not like the pharmaceutical companies put profits above people is it, I mean they really didn't know they were fueling an opium epidemic did they - how many people has that killed and lives been destroyed by it and that is just one of many sh$tty drugs they have released and continue to sell and are pushed by their dealers - GP's.



If normal vaccines are so safe for everyone then why have they paid out $4.4 Billion of tax payers money in the USA in damages for them since the mid 80's, perhaps you should do some research and download from the manufactures website the insert that comes with each vaccination and see the list of possible side effects ranging from fever, rash, fitting, permanently lowered consciousness (whatever that is - Brain Damage or Autism?) up to Death, although these are very rare they do occur in a % of the population - Great if it does not happen to you or your children, not so great if it does and don't forget this is a a NEW and Experimental type of vaccine with NO similar History of testing to fall back on, yet in a matter of months they are rolling out 100's of Millions of doses with the prospect of eventually jabbing the whole planet.


FYI I am very happy for anyone who feels the need to be a guinea pig and let all of us freeloaders ride off the back of them - It's simply a freedom of choice - Up to You, as they say.



I presume you have signed yourself and family up to be one of the first in line for the Covid vaccination?

[capn_billl]

Originally Posted by Lake-Effect

There's a good joke in there somewhere.

ALL vaccines are not recommended to pregnant, or soon to be pregnant women.

[Singularity]

Originally Posted by capn_billl

ALL vaccines are not recommended to pregnant, or soon to be pregnant women.

This is not correct; four vaccinations (flu, tetanus, diptheria, pertussus) as well as maybe a couple-few others are recommended to women who are pregnant, or are soon to become pregnant.

[Thumbs Up]

Originally Posted by Singularity

So what is a vaccine anyway. It's a clump of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids, salts that gets put under your skin. Go scrape your leg anywhere on the planet and you'll expose your immune system to new/novel combination of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids, and salts that it hasn't seen before. The principle different between a vaccination campaign and scraping your leg on a rock is that everyone has to scrape their leg on the same type of rock.

If exposing one's self to new combinations of fats/oils, proteins/amino acids, nucleic acids and salts seems a scary proposition, it's best to stay on the couch.

You scaring me now sing. Like PR for the vaccine industry. (or simply brainwahed by your "education") You and lake both paid bloggers? who'd a thunk. Everyone ought know by now that there is some nefarious sht goin on in the world. Some "choose not to know". Ya'll educated. Do some research!

[goboatingnow]

Simple , vaccinate or be quarantined. Or do you think it’s acceptable to let people with a highly contagious disease just walk around the place

[Oeanda]

Re the title- the word ‘too’ has two ‘o’s in it...just saying.

Edit- never mind - carry on...

[UFO]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Simple , vaccinate or be quarantined. Or do you think it’s acceptable to let people with a highly contagious disease just walk around the place

Fortunately even the powers in charge at the moment are not currently capable of such tyranny. Perhaps you missed the memo - It's only harmful to a minuscule % of the worlds Pop most of which are well beyond the average life expectancy of the planet already, to many of the rest its not even as bad a a nasty flu, or should we be locking up everyone who does not have the Flu jab as well? While were at it lets just lock up those who don't agree with the Government or the official corporate line along with those bloody hippies



But as I have already said for those that feel the need or have the fear I am happy for them to take an experimental genetically modified vaccine that has not undergone anywhere near thorough enough testing - Horses for courses.

[aqfishing]

Originally Posted by UFO

Fortunately even the powers in charge at the moment are not currently capable of such tyranny. Perhaps you missed the memo - It's only harmful to a minuscule % of the worlds Pop most of which are well beyond the average life expectancy of the planet already, to many of the rest its not even as bad a a nasty flu, or should we be locking up everyone who does not have the Flu jab as well? While were at it lets just lock up those who don't agree with the Government or the official corporate line along with those bloody hippies



But as I have already said for those that feel the need or have the fear I am happy for them to take an experimental genetically modified vaccine that has not undergone anywhere near thorough enough testing - Horses for courses.

I must say I tend to lean towards UFO’s comments. Those at high risk need to take care and let the rest carry on!

However there is a group of South African doctors doing some amazing work and may just have an answer. Big pharma is already trying to shut them down. Proper doctors with peer reviewed studies.

https://nkalex.medium.com/the-team-o...d-5f9852f1101d

https://omny.fm/shows/afternoons-wit...the-covid-code




Who knows!

[goboatingnow]

Fortunately even the powers in charge at the moment are not currently capable of such tyranny. Perhaps you missed the memo - It's only harmful to a minuscule % of the worlds Pop most of which are well beyond the average life expectancy of the planet already, to many of the rest its not even as bad a a nasty flu, or should we be locking up everyone who does not have the Flu jab as well? While were at it lets just lock up those who don't agree with the Government or the official corporate line along with those bloody hippies

This is the worst kind of fake fact , the underplaying of the seriousness of Covid , Firstly the disease can affect all ages and has a very long tail , even relatively minor versions can leave people with long term medical consequences, its not all about death

Secondly the sickness rate is enough to overwhelm hospital systems and in effect deny others with different sickness access to medical care.

I do not think its practical to allow people who have no scientific basis for it to opt out and in effect retain a pool of the virus

anti vaxers are essentially free loaders , just like " off the gridders " and " preppers " , they can only do what they do because the majority of people create systems that" actually allow them their "choices" . You can only be " off the grid" if theres a grid in the first place.

If everyone took that attitude , we'd have rampant Coivid for years

[UFO]

Originally Posted by aqfishing

I must say I tend to lean towards UFO’s comments. Those at high risk need to take care and let the rest carry on!

However there is a group of South African doctors doing some amazing work and may just have an answer. Big pharma is already trying to shut them down. Proper doctors with peer reviewed studies.

https://nkalex.medium.com/the-team-o...d-5f9852f1101d

https://omny.fm/shows/afternoons-wit...the-covid-code




Who knows!

Sorry if big pharma are against it, it must be a load of mumbo jumbo, especially as it has not been reported in the MSM and for your part in promoting it we will be sending the inquisition around to your house within the next 10 minutes with a range of tools for straightening out your heretical behaviour

[UFO]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

This is the worst kind of fake fact , the underplaying of the seriousness of Covid , Firstly the disease can affect all ages and has a very long tail , even relatively minor versions can leave people with long term medical consequences, its not all about death

Secondly the sickness rate is enough to overwhelm hospital systems and in effect deny others with different sickness access to medical care.

I do not think its practical to allow people who have no scientific basis for it to opt out and in effect retain a pool of the virus

anti vaxers are essentially free loaders , just like " off the gridders " and " preppers " , they can only do what they do because the majority of people create systems that" actually allow them their "choices" . You can only be " off the grid" if theres a grid in the first place.

If everyone took that attitude , we'd have rampant Coivid for years

Actually we wouldn't because we would all have a natural immunity!


FYI Viruses cause other issues, perhaps you should do some research and see what the Flu, Sore Throat, Measles, German Measles etc can leave you with if you are susceptible - So stop spreading such rubbish in regards to secondary issues - It happens with all viruses, Covid is no different there.



Once again its very fortunate that blinkered and fascist brainwashed MSM individuals are not currently in positions of power in most countries in the world - Forcing medical tyranny on people may be acceptable to you, but has yet to break the morals of many.



More of the Freeloader bolloxs - You people really need to grow up and get a life and try and undo some of the lifetimes worth of anally retentive brainwashing you have undergone.


Choice and freewill is very important in society, but I do understand that some of you that can not think for yourselves find it very comforting to be told what to think and say by the government and corporations - If you don't like the West for the freedoms we have then go and live in China or Iran, which may be more up your alley.

[Talk Story]

Curious to know if the those in favor of lockdowns are going to be thr first to take the vaccine?

[atoll]

bagging the last few anti-vaxers...........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw7M-fUaIb0