Unhealthy Lifestyle = Greater Risk

[Delancey]

Can’t help but notice that the States are full of fatties (67% overweight), that 30% of COVID hospitalizations/deaths are people who are by definition obese, and that our government does nothing to address this issue.

I guess it makes sense because in the US a lot of people make a lot of money off of fat people. From corn farmers to fast food franchises to our for-profit health care industry, big people are big business.

I ran across this public service message from El Salvador which promotes healthy living as a way to fight the pandemic through prevention rather than cure. Link to video below with English subtitles.

This also makes sense to me because El Salvador isn’t quite as wealthy as the USA. They need to get the best value out of their more limited resources and clearly promoting not being fat is a win-win for the individual and the nation.

Since this is an international forum I would be interested to learn how things are elsewhere. Do you live in a county full of fat people? Are your death totals skewed by the overweight and obese? Does you government try to address this issue or do they just tell you to get the jab and keep shoveling more food into your face?

https://youtu.be/bzGP45A4TRU

[LakeSuperior]

While cruising through Europe 10 years ago I was taken back by two separate independent cockpit happy hour discussions where it was strongly put to me that the British Government should pass a law that limited how much each person could weigh.

The extra medical care for the overweight was driving up the cost of healthcare paid by the taxpayers, and they were tired of footing the bill. They felt that government should step in and fix the problem.

[bgallinger]

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior

While cruising through Europe 10 years ago I was taken back by two separate independent cockpit happy hour discussions where it was strongly put to me that the British Government should pass a law that limited how much each person could weigh.

The extra medical care for the overweight was driving up the cost of healthcare paid by the taxpayers, and they were tired of footing the bill. They felt that government should step in and fix the problem.

I guess that is the european answer to everything....Pass ANOTHER law, regulation, certification, license, or restriction.

[Taichungman]

I guess it depends on where you get your stats. I just googled and It's 42% in USA, 31% in El Salvador, 22% Taiwan and over 70% in Mexico. So, it appears income level has nothing to do with it.



And good idea about putting government in charge of what you can eat, weigh, say, read an think.

[siamese]

IMO, it was Obama's end game to nationalize health care in part to make it impossible for people to be fat. Or at least, way to expensive to be fat because you'd have to pay penalties for being obese. Had Obama been more clear about his end game, the opposition to Obama care would have been overwhelming.

I simply don't get people being okay with being fat. My stepdaughter, aged 42, is HUGE. Well over 300lbs., as is her husband. Do they not have mirrors?

If I woke up fat one morning, and was suddenly fat, I couldn't leave the house until I was thin again. I wouldn't want my body to be a walking (waddling) billboard that said 'I can't control myself'.

How can a bowl of ice cream, or a pizza be more appealing than being fit enough to enjoy more activities and to have better overall health?

Odd how fat people say, 'I'm big...' to describe themselves. What, you mean you're nine feet tall? Why don't you just say you're fat. Own it.

And, what' the deal with "big, beautiful women". Basically, any woman who's fat, can declare herself to be "curvy" and to be a BBW. So, if you're a skinny but ugly woman, can you eat your way to beauty?

We're not allowed to be repulsed by fat people, and certainly not allowed to comment on it. 'Gee, Mary, you've certainly gotten fat since I saw you last' is a totally inappropriate statement. We have to accept fatness in others, and embrace it. On the other hand, if you say 'Gee, Mary, you look fantastic, you must have lost weight'. Mary will accept that as a compliment. Just remember to keep your mouth shut when she gains it back. That street only runs one way.

Back to the government thing. As fat as the U.S. population is, I don't favor having the government control obesity. That's just a reflection of my general view of the role of government.

As long as private health insurance exists, I see no reason why personal choices shouldn't affect our insurance rates. Any unhealthy behavior should trigger a higher rate. Skydiving with dynamite...higher rate. Being prone to a particular disease because of your DNA is not your fault, so no penalty. If by choice, you get fat, why should you enjoy the same rate as me? I'm hungry right now, so I'm going to have a healthy lunch, and then go hiking up and down the nearby sand dunes for 40 minutes. Explain to me why I should subsidize someone else's lack of control.

[sagablu]

The underlying issue is freedom to do what you want without the responsibility of the consequences. Health insurance costs in the United States are the same for people who live a healthy lifestyle and those who do not. So I could be blowing through $2,000 a month of medication for a self-induced condition and I might pay the same as someone on no medication and no known health risks. Health insurance like every other insurance product should be risk weighted. If your BMI is above x, you should pay more. In addition proper tools of incentives to correct the problem need to be provided. Completely understand it's easy to say and harder to do but without such intervention health insurance will become unaffordable. For perspective, I have been in the health insurance industry for 33 years, I see the direct correlation between claims and what I'll nicely call lifestyle. Quick fact, 3% of the population drives 50% of the cost of health care in the US

[SailingHoot]

Oof take this thread to facebook

[grantmc]

Originally Posted by sagablu

The underlying issue is freedom to do what you want without the responsibility of the consequences. Health insurance costs in the United States are the same for people who live a healthy lifestyle and those who do not. So I could be blowing through $2,000 a month of medication for a self-induced condition and I might pay the same as someone on no medication and no known health risks. Health insurance like every other insurance product should be risk weighted. If your BMI is above x, you should pay more. In addition proper tools of incentives to correct the problem need to be provided. Completely understand it's easy to say and harder to do but without such intervention health insurance will become unaffordable. For perspective, I have been in the health insurance industry for 33 years, I see the direct correlation between claims and what I'll nicely call lifestyle. Quick fact, 3% of the population drives 50% of the cost of health care in the US

I certainly pickup the compassionate health insurance worker in your post, wow. If you were such an influencer why didn't you set premiums based on bmi? Certainly done for age,

The biggest part of the correlation is caused by old people; those awful people making lifestyle choices to stay alive well beyond their working life.

[sagablu]

Originally Posted by grantmc

I certainly pickup the compassionate health insurance worker in your post, wow. If you were such an influencer why didn't you set premiums based on bmi? Certainly done for age,

The biggest part of the correlation is caused by old people; those awful people making lifestyle choices to stay alive well beyond their working life.

I disagree with you conclusion. The want the long-term issue is the increasing cost of health insurance, and the increasing drain on governmental systems such as Medicare and Medicaid in the US and NHS in the UK. If things continue as they are, private health insurance will become unaffordable to most and the governmental systems will be on their way to insolvency. This is already happening. Health insurance has become so expensive that the young and even some of the old are going without. So what happens after that, who will always have insurance? Those with underlying conditions, many of which are lifestyle related. So the system is in a death spiral. Not enough young and healthy to subsidize the older and sicker. My compassion leans towards Good people who have bad things happen to them, this is the purpose of insurance. It is not and never was designed to subsidize those who make bad decisions. Try buying car insurance after a few DWIs, see how that works out. My concern is a long-term viability of the system, which is unfortunately being dragged down by individual life decisions. I'll save my compassion for someone with a chronic illness that they had no part in developing, accident victims, etc.

You need a survey to get boat insurance, correct? Maybe that should be the standard?

[rsvmille]

Good ideas do not require force.

Tyranny is not an effective countermeasure for viruses or eating disorders.

Government intervention heavily subsidizes processed foods, corporate large-scale agribusiness, and pharma alike. Then they use regulations, mandates, and propaganda (think food pyramid) to choose winners by fiat, promote or give these companies further advantage and crush smaller competitiors or non-profitable ideas. It is most unfortunate that all the extra-Constitutional regulatory agencies has created a massive unelected bureaucracy that is a revolving door with these corporations, who then kick profits back to politicians, and lobbying - writing bills etc.

Unfortunately, the state presents itself as the solution to the problems which it creates and naive people are all to happy to give up their liberty for the protection racket.

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by Taichungman

I guess it depends on where you get your stats. I just googled and It's 42% in USA, 31% in El Salvador, 22% Taiwan and over 70% in Mexico. So, it appears income level has nothing to do with it.



And good idea about putting government in charge of what you can eat, weigh, say, read an think.

Dude there is no way only 42% of Americans are overweight! Maybe obese, but not overweight. No way!

[letsgetsailing3]

We need to look at health care holistically.

Health care isn't just taking meds or going to the doctor. It's what you eat, how much you sleep, and how much you stay in shape.

So if folks aren't taking care of themselves, should someone else pick up the tab?

Maybe we should share the costs with the individual, and tax unhealthy choices, while putting that money in a fund to subsidize the medical costs associated with those choices.

It's not so much dictating choices as making people pay the costs for theirs. Make your own choices, but pay your share for them.

[poiu]

Originally Posted by Delancey

Can’t help but notice that the States are full of fatties (67% overweight), that 30% of COVID hospitalizations/deaths are people who are by definition obese, and that our government does nothing to address this issue.

I guess it makes sense because in the US a lot of people make a lot of money off of fat people. From corn farmers to fast food franchises to our for-profit health care industry, big people are big business.

I ran across this public service message from El Salvador which promotes healthy living as a way to fight the pandemic through prevention rather than cure. Link to video below with English subtitles.

This also makes sense to me because El Salvador isn’t quite as wealthy as the USA. They need to get the best value out of their more limited resources and clearly promoting not being fat is a win-win for the individual and the nation.

Since this is an international forum I would be interested to learn how things are elsewhere. Do you live in a county full of fat people? Are your death totals skewed by the overweight and obese? Does you government try to address this issue or do they just tell you to get the jab and keep shoveling more food into your face?

https://youtu.be/bzGP45A4TRU

That advert shows how screwed up government advice on health and diets is. They say drink orange juice, but avoid sugar. Orange juice is sugar juice. Governments are clueless. It’s not about support for big Ag, or some other business supporting conspiracy, it is just ignorance and bad science, that’s all.

Also, don’t look to the US, or any other government to fix this problem. They caused the problem. They did it with the awful dietary advice in the various iterations of the ‘food pyramid’ and in the ‘my plate’ and in previous decades of terrible similar advice.

Do you really think they will now do a U turn, give the correct advice and admit that decades of bad advice has killed tens of millions of Americans and made a hundred million fat and sick needlessly? Dream on.

[hpeer]

I think it is about “personal responsibility” in general. And there is lots of precedent for “taxing” folks who do not comply. Think about speeding tickets, DUI arrests, or tax on tobacco and liquor.

BMI
<20 normal or skinny if low enough
20-30 fat, over weight
>30 obese
> 40 morbidly obese

I have been working to reduce weight for some years with some success. From 33 down to 27ish. Recently someone I had lately met called me “skinny.” I take that as an indication of skewed norms.

[Delancey]

Originally Posted by poiu

That advert shows how screwed up government advice on health and diets is. They say drink orange juice, but avoid sugar. Orange juice is sugar juice. Governments are clueless. It’s not about support for big Ag, or some other business supporting conspiracy, it is just ignorance and bad science, that’s all.

I’ve heard a lot people say the citrus fruits referred to in the video are good natural sources for vitamin C. These are smart people who say this. They also say oranges are an export crop for the country.

In the video they talk about things like exercise to promote good health besides a just eating a good diet. Did you watch it?

Since I already know what it’s like here in the US, my question was about places outside of my realm of experience and was kind of specifically directed at people outside of the US. Sorry