Looking for Feedback On Croatia

[Lagoon4us]

Originally Posted by Barra

Thats good to hear Frank. Ive been getting revved up with 2nd hand stories of boats being asked to pay fees twice after they got done by a bogus first concession collector etc etc

So you were able to find plenty of non concession anchorages then and its just a case of a bit of planning or were the concessions just not that active?

thanks

In nine months we were asked to pay to anchor in only three places and we simply moved on, if you enter a bay where there is a few orange mooring bouy's and a 'Kornoba' (restaurant/pub/hotel) usually overlooking it then pick up the bouy and eat at the family 'Kornoba', if you are after a free anchorage and don'y intend to eat then go to one of the many bay's and anchor out.

We make our own water, power etc and don't need anything provided by others, we anchor and enjoy the natural attributes of the location. We try to spend our money in the small fishing villages and we leave the change in an effort to make these beautiful peoples life a little easier without imposing.

The national parks Korcula and Kornati for example held no interest for us we sailed through fascinated by rocks.........

In Vis we stayed 3 days at the ACI managed quayside, hired a car and visited truly fascinating area's.. Stuff you need to see for yourself!

So 3 times in 9 months!~1!! Don't be concerned by visions of being harassed by fee's it is all crap.

Try to move into an anchorage when the charterer's are moving out i.e. about 11:30am remember they need to be in 7 anchorages in 6 day's, they are on a planned schedule. We have always been third or fourth boat anchored prior to the 25 charter boats moving in at 5pm after their afternoon sailing!

Cheers/enjoy.

[Sinnot]

I've spent about 5 months sailing around Croatia and have never been asked for a fee to drop anchor. If you pick up a mooring buoy (mostly) you'll be asked to pay. If you go into a national park, then you will be expected to pay a fee for entering the park but they do provide mooring buoys for you.

[CarinaPDX]

On a philosophical note, it seems quite common for cruisers to worry about one thing or another they have heard about a place they are considering going, and in some cases alter plans to avoid these places. In almost all cases that is a mistake.

Regarding Croatia specifically, there have been complaints about the cost of cruising permits, then park fees, then anchoring/mooring fees. OK, no one likes to pay taxes and we all enjoy the freedom of anchoring, but this really needs to be put in perspective. The total amounts involved are trivial when spread out over a season of cruising. And with the many beautiful, free anchorages there are alternatives to paying for anchoring if that is an issue. In return we get to enjoy one of the world's premier cruising grounds - I feel the best in the Med.

On your way coming and going you will likely discover that free anchorages elsewhere in the Med can be difficult to find. On the Spanish, French, and Italian Med coasts many of the traditional anchorages are now buoyed off for swimming areas (farther from the beach than any lifeguard would ever want). That satisfies the (often municipal) marinas nearby, as well as the wealthy seaside homeowners who don't want their view cluttered with the hoi poloi.

Pay the fees and enjoy Croatia - it is an unforgettable experience. Just be sure to go straight to the customs office when arriving, and plan for business hours (do not drop the hook first no matter what!)

Greg

[Barra]

Originally Posted by CarinaPDX

On a philosophical note, it seems quite common for cruisers to worry about one thing or another they have heard about a place they are considering going, and in some cases alter plans to avoid these places. In almost all cases that is a mistake.

Regarding Croatia specifically, there have been complaints about the cost of cruising permits, then park fees, then anchoring/mooring fees. OK, no one likes to pay taxes and we all enjoy the freedom of anchoring, but this really needs to be put in perspective. The total amounts involved are trivial when spread out over a season of cruising. And with the many beautiful, free anchorages there are alternatives to paying for anchoring if that is an issue. In return we get to enjoy one of the world's premier cruising grounds - I feel the best in the Med.

On your way coming and going you will likely discover that free anchorages elsewhere in the Med can be difficult to find. On the Spanish, French, and Italian Med coasts many of the traditional anchorages are now buoyed off for swimming areas (farther from the beach than any lifeguard would ever want). That satisfies the (often municipal) marinas nearby, as well as the wealthy seaside homeowners who don't want their view cluttered with the hoi poloi.

Pay the fees and enjoy Croatia - it is an unforgettable experience. Just be sure to go straight to the customs office when arriving, and plan for business hours (do not drop the hook first no matter what!)

Greg

Fully agree with you Greg! I know of 2 aussie boats personally that will be avoiding croatia this summer due to friends stories from last year. This is exactly why i love this forum - i can check the facts from others that have been there done that.

We will be there for sure thanks to everyones great advice above (and the concession maps) and hopefully can make these other boats a bit jealous when we catch up with them in Greece!

re Spain and France I agree 50% - spain has bouyed off many of the previous anchorages in high summer meaning we had to pass through up to 5 different bays at times before we could find one we were "allowed" to anchor in. We found France to be much more accommodating as you would expect from a country where sailing is a national passion!

[Lagoon4us]

I reckon just fit a 'SUNSAIL' Boom cover, 'twill get you a lot of concessions.......

Don't miss Croatia it's one of the few places not screwed up by the American 'Fast Food' scourge.

Coldar another forum member was on board last night for drinks here in 'Milna' he bought a 2 litre bottle of 'KARLOVOSCHA' Beer with him, cost him $4:00 AUD equal in taste to any Aussie drop!!!!! Croatian Pizza $6:50 enough for two.....

[Palarran]

CarinaPDX,
What a great post. It was literate and pretty factual. To add one plus, I completely agree that to complain about fees as a component of the total cost of cruising is crazy. Go out to dinner and it costs 50 euros for a good meal. So to pay 1/2 that for a good and safe anchorage seems to be a deal to me.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by Palarran

CarinaPDX,
What a great post. It was literate and pretty factual. To add one plus, I completely agree that to complain about fees as a component of the total cost of cruising is crazy. Go out to dinner and it costs 50 euros for a good meal. So to pay 1/2 that for a good and safe anchorage seems to be a deal to me.

I for one disagree with you - To drop your own pick, be responsible for your own boat and crews safety is NOT something I am prepared to pay someone else for on general principal.

Happy to pay park fees, buy a meal at a restaurant for use of their mooring, pay for a mooring that is being maintained, pay for rubbish collection, anchorage in a marina or port etc. Likewise happy to pay a reasonable amount for a cruising permit but NOT HAPPY to pay for use of 100 odd square meters of open water with no other services being provided, that is only "safe" due to the natural landscape. Its a philosophical thing about who can "own" the water and charge for it - not the relative $ amount thats the issue.

Sounds like the concessions at least provide rubbish collection. Really looking forward to the croatia leg now that i am beginning to understand how it all ticks but i will be using the map to find my own anchorages and avoid the concessions where I can. Will still drop plenty of $s into the "real" local economy via markets, restaurants etc rather than through a concession holder with an arguably more tenuous connection to the local economy.

cheers
barra

[Lagoon4us]

It is simply not a problem, not an issue just come and enjoy and i'll bet at the end of the season you'll have the same feelings about Croatia STUNNING!

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Barra

I for one disagree with you - To drop your own pick, be responsible for your own boat and crews safety is NOT something I am prepared to pay someone else for on general principal.

I agree with you. When I park my car, supported by it's own wheels and secured by it's won handbrake I refuse to pay on general principle too.
Euh..... Wait a minute....

Happy to pay park fees, buy a meal at a restaurant for use of their mooring, pay for a mooring that is being maintained, pay for rubbish collection, anchorage in a marina or port etc. Likewise happy to pay a reasonable amount for a cruising permit but NOT HAPPY to pay for use of 100 odd square meters of open water with no other services being provided, that is only "safe" due to the natural landscape. Its a philosophical thing about who can "own" the water and charge for it - not the relative $ amount thats the issue.

There are AFAIK only a handfull of places where you have to pay for anchoring with your own hook. Those concessions we talk about here all provide mooring buoys, so services are being provided.

And they make sense somehow. Having lots of inexperienced cruises drop their hook in a bay every afternoon isn't particularly good for the wildlife.

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

Coldar another forum member was on board last night for drinks here in 'Milna' he bought a 2 litre bottle of 'KARLOVOSCHA' Beer with him, cost him $4:00 AUD equal in taste to any Aussie drop!!!!! Croatian Pizza $6:50 enough for two.....

Even better is the wine. Just walk in to a konoba with an empty bottle and have it filled directly from the barrel.
There is a vinyard on Hvar that has it's own little marina. The wine ages in casks in a cellar that is below sea level, with a window where you can look at the fish...
The wine is some of the best we've ever had.

[Barra]

Originally Posted by K_V_B

Even better is the wine. Just walk in to a konoba with an empty bottle and have it filled directly from the barrel.
There is a vinyard on Hvar that has it's own little marina. The wine ages in casks in a cellar that is below sea level, with a window where you can look at the fish...
The wine is some of the best we've ever had.

ok you cant say that and not tell me where exactly!

By the time we hit Hvar the french casks will be running low with 4 on board....

[K_V_B]

Originally Posted by Barra

ok you cant say that and not tell me where exactly!

By the time we hit Hvar the french casks will be running low with 4 on board....

Google "Zlatan Otok".

Mind you, his wine isn't cheap. It remains a nice stopover though.

[AngeW]

Originally Posted by Lagoon4us

It is simply not a problem, not an issue just come and enjoy and i'll bet at the end of the season you'll have the same feelings about Croatia STUNNING!

We are heading up through Albania, Montenegro and into Croatia in our Lagoon 380. Wondering how to manage Internet access for grib files and weather info on this part of our journey. Does anyone have any tips? I'm a bit nervous about the Bora, especially around Dubrovnik.
Cheers, Ange

[goboatingnow]

Originally Posted by AngeW

We are heading up through Albania, Montenegro and into Croatia in our Lagoon 380. Wondering how to manage Internet access for grib files and weather info on this part of our journey. Does anyone have any tips? I'm a bit nervous about the Bora, especially around Dubrovnik.
Cheers, Ange

You really don't get good enough forecasts to predict Boras. You might statements like the weather is conducive to Boras. Etc.

Dave

[CarinaPDX]

IIRC Boras are primarily a feature of winter weather, although they do sometimes occur in the summer. I spent two summers in Croatia and never had to deal with one, so I don't think this should be a major concern. The real concern is for afternoon thunderstorms which are very common. Like their tropical cousins, they start as cumulo-nimbus clouds over the coastal mountains in the morning, then work their way out to sea and are often quite active in the middle of the Adriatic at night. The main risk is that the boat is not adequately anchored and the crew ashore when the strong winds of a thunderstorm hit. In the Adriatic, always anchor like you will get 30-40 knot winds, because sometimes you will.

For weather forecasting generally, along with a lot of other useful information, I strongly recommend buying a NAVTEX system. NAVTEX broadcasts are available throughout Europe, and are in English (on the primary channel). I have a Furuno NX-300, which I did find very useful in the Med.

Greg