Buying a boat in Panama. Could use some advice, please.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by philaw

So why do I get up at 6:20am every morning and go to work? Ha ha ha



Part of the plan is to buy a house and rent it out so I have something to come back to. Having your mortgage paid while you do that would feel like having your cake and eating it. The Azores are most definitely on my list.

Multifamily is WAY better for cash flow than single family. Suggest you investigate that as an option.

We REALLY liked the Azores. If we hadnt recently built a place in Panamá we just might move there. Good place for an AirBnb property too. Azores market appears poised for a big run up in valuations too so timing I think is right. Discussing buying an investment property there.

[philaw]

Originally Posted by Q Xopa

Yes, Ok I stand corrected.

I was thinking more of Pacific/ South coast which is where Vista Mar is. I'm sure you could get it done there too with a bit of messing around. They are new and still working out how and what services they can provide. But they seem open and helpful. Personally its good to see some competition. Its a bit of a drive from Shelter Bay, couple of hours ish.

Having bought a boat in Panama I can recommend it. However it of course has some hurdles to leap, as does anywhere.

Panama is in many ways limited with boat resources but there are also many ways to overcome them with a bit of lateral thinking.

That particular boat, just going off his videos, does look pretty nicely done.
I have enjoyed his videos and his style he presented. The boat looks capable and adequate yet not too ambitious.

I just posted it in case it's useful to anyone else. I'm not going for this boat now and the only thing I'm certain of is how much I have to learn.

Originally Posted by belizesailor

Edwin, the yard manager at SB, is a great guy, but note that SB marks up contractor prices by quite a lot. I have been successful at negotiating them way down because I knew what the contractor normally charged. The upside to going thru the marina is that they will then warranty the job and deal w any disputes (still get that in writting of course). And they of course will translate if thats an issue. You can contract directly, but are on your own then.

I decided against buying this boat, but having these details about yards in Panama available for us to reference won't hurt.

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by philaw

I just posted it in case it's useful to anyone else. I'm not going for this boat now and the only thing I'm certain of is how much I have to learn.







I decided against buying this boat, but having these details about yards in Panama available for us to reference won't hurt.

Yes, posting that more for informational purposes was my intent.

[Q Xopa]

Originally Posted by belizesailor

Multifamily is WAY better for cash flow than single family. Suggest you investigate that as an option.

We REALLY liked the Azores. If we hadnt recently built a place in Panamá we just might move there. Good place for an AirBnb property too. Azores market appears poised for a big run up in valuations too so timing I think is right. Discussing buying an investment property there.

A bit off topic but yes totally agree- Multi family👍

[SlyMcFLy]

Hi from Panama I’m currently in Vista Mar marina on the Pacific side. If you buy the boat, take it to Linton Bay marina and simply hire a boat manager to have bottom cleaned, air it out, run engine monthly, check battery water, etc. lots of people capable of doing this for you

That said I’d look really carefully at any blue water, turnkey, boat for $10 k. Probably some hidden issues.

[Bill Streever]

Lots of opinions on this topic, to be sure. So I'll throw mine out there: I would not recommend buying a boat until you are ready to use it. A lot can happen in a year, both to the boat (even stored) and to your plans. And, as many others pointed out, there are lots of boats on the market all the time.

[philaw]

Originally Posted by SlyMcFLy

Hi from Panama I’m currently in Vista Mar marina on the Pacific side. If you buy the boat, take it to Linton Bay marina and simply hire a boat manager to have bottom cleaned, air it out, run engine monthly, check battery water, etc. lots of people capable of doing this for you

That said I’d look really carefully at any blue water, turnkey, boat for $10 k. Probably some hidden issues.

Thanks for the advice. I decided not to go for it. It was the one from the Adventures of Tarka Youtube channel, so a unusual case. Being in Panama alone seems to drive prices down.

[philaw]

Originally Posted by Bill Streever

Lots of opinions on this topic, to be sure. So I'll throw mine out there: I would not recommend buying a boat until you are ready to use it. A lot can happen in a year, both to the boat (even stored) and to your plans. And, as many others pointed out, there are lots of boats on the market all the time.

I think that being drawn towards thinking and talking about boats, and contemplating buying them, is hard to avoid. Part of me wants to just get a boat and live on it while I learn, and another part thinks that I should just crew as long as possible, attempt to get on a transat, and try to string it out through my whole sabbatical year. Waiting until it's really needed is advice I shouldn't argue with.

[themediadoctor]

Scrolling down, I see the owner posted a note in June that the boat was in a slip at VistaMar Marina in Coronado. That's Pacific side. Very familiar with VistaMar. Coronado is in the "Arco Seca," the "dry arc" west of Panama City and gets less rain (not no rain, just less) than the Caribbean coast: Coronado averages 6" of rain annually: Colon (near Shelter Bay) averages 129" a year. It's also less humid on average, so better for boat storage. I'm planning to move a powerboat to VistaMar in a couple of years and have been there by car four times, met with the owner and staff etc. He has a lift trailer (NOT a travel lift, a hydraulic trailer) that he uses to pull out quite large sailboats, and he has a dry storage yard. I haven't asked the rate for leaving a boat on the hard there, but I imagine its not exorbitant. Advantages are (1) conditions less harsh than the Caribbean coast, (2) they will look after your boat, check on it etc, (3) 24-hour security so your sails, rigging, dinghy, tackle etc don't go missing. Check out crime reports on Noonsite; there are multiple reports of petty theft in San Blas, and a case this spring of a family attacked on board their boat, father killed, children injured. Three local youth were arrested for the crime. It's not a scary, violent place, but leaving a boat there unattended for a year is inviting opportunistic crime. There's a Facebook group called the Panama Posse that brings 30-ish boats down from California to VistaMar every year. I'm sure they could give you some first-hand, well-founded advice about the Pacific ports. Hope this helps.

[tiopirata]

[QUOTE=Stingo;2924365]..... my Nigerian uncle is also yacht broker AND surveyor, not that the two, by any nature, have a confluct in interest. None. Trust me.....[/QUOTE

There is no conflict of interest, I am not the only broker or the only surveyor in Panama. Other sources and opinions are readily available, including yours which seems to lack manners.

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by Stingo

Another thing about Panama, is that to get anywhere decent you have two choices:
- beat against the wind and current all the way back to the West Indies, or
- head across the Pacific and cover about 4,000NM before finding a vaguely affordable island.

Virtually day sailing to Pacific Mexico from Panama, why not?

And eastbound, easy sail to Cartagena then a close reach to Jamaica.

Anyhow, Panama itself is a terrific cruising ground.

[tomcone]

Why are you determined to leave it in Panama? You should have it surveyed, and look at it yourself before buying. Then just sail it, or have someone else deliver it, to a more desirable location. It is a cruising boat afterall.

[LagoonJim]

Hey Phil, I've browsed through the responses, and have a slightly different take for you. This all assumes you are sure this size/model boat is the right one for you, and you will buy sometime, somewhere in next 12-24 months.

Having recently laid up in Shelter Bay for a few months, cruised the San Blas, and transited the canal, my thoughts are as follows:

-Shelter Bay is awesome place to keep a boat long term(money aside) because:
>easy access/flights from the US
>great place to get critical work done(Edwin Chavez runs the yard there, great dude, top notch work, and there are several long term cruisers that do work, sail loft, refrigeration, electrical, etc.)
>prices are better than US(at least California) for hauls, etc.
>safe and overall security situation when boat unattended best I saw in W. Caribe(remote location, other ex pat boaters, activity, and basic guards, etc.)
>you'll learn a lot when there by meeting other cruisers(dockside chats)
>just simply a fun vacation spot when working on a cruising boat(swimming pool, great bar, quite, many knowledgeable people, mechanics, other cruisers)
>little hotel on location so you have a place to stay if boats on hard and being worked on(or live on it, like several of the long term ex pats do there...on the hard...)

-If you are serious about cruising soon, don't plan on doing anything significant with the boat for 6 months to a year. Sure you can do like me and buy on Monday, literally slip the mooring in Ft. Lauderdale on Tuesday, and take off for the Weetern Carribean, but I promise you will have more fun if you live with the boat a while, somewhere, anywhere. That Capt. Ron stuff gets real old real quick.

-Panama great because out of hurricane zone, but in the tropics, and milk run from SB to San Blas for great shakedown cruising(just realized SB and SB initials are same, another good omen)

-parts reasonably available in Panama, some stuff dirt cheap, like industrial parts, fuel, etc. and usually no problem to bring stuff in your bags(customs never stopped me, unlike Belize, Honduras, Mexico, etc.)

-buying a boat there...I think no big deal, plenty of help all around, language barrier not a problem, no more likely to get screwed than in the states IMHO

-Panama has KFC...(kidding)

Look dude, seriously, I found a boat that was down there before I bought mine in Florida. I really thought doing Florida was more 'sensible' for all the reasons I've read above. If I had to do it again, I would have rather saved the money and chilled in Panama for a year.

No matter what anyone else leads you to believe on this post, trust me when I tell you, on the scale of simply buying a boat and doing what you sound like you are eventually going to do, doing this Panama idea you have is not stupid at all, and might actually be a pretty sweet way to go about it.

Once a month vacations to Panama wouldn't be the worse thing while still working and prepping...

Happy to share more of my experience if you are interested.

Best,

Jim

[discokachina]

I have some friends who have been living on their sailboat in a marina in the San Blas Islands for about 6 years that are extremely knowledgeable on boat maintenance. PM me and I will put you in touch!

[belizesailor]

Originally Posted by discokachina

I have some friends who have been living on their sailboat in a marina in the San Blas Islands for about 6 years that are extremely knowledgeable on boat maintenance. PM me and I will put you in touch!

Just so you and others know, there are no marinas in the San Blas, but there are a few within day sail range.