Advice for relocating the family (USA)

[Sand crab]

The Race to Alaska is crazy, no motors allowed. If you have one they make you take it off your boat. As a result nutjobs, I mean R2AK participants rig up all manner of human powered propulsion if the wind doesn't cooperate. There was a team of 6 or 7 women that won a few years ago who had a clever bicycle to propeller gizmo. The wind was real light so they took turns pedaling 24/7. I think the team was called Sail Like a Girl.
Port Townsend also has the Wooden Boat School and are one of the few marinas that allow DIY.

There are quite a few waterfront State Parks but 45' is the max for the State Park Buoys btw so smaller than that would be better.
The marinas are only allowed so many liveaboards, one has to leave before someone else can take his place. There's a waiting list at all of them but my friend got the go ahead in about 6 months. I know a guy that lives aboard a trawler with his wife and 2 kids. The kids catch the bus to the local school.

Seattle's best affordable housing are the houseboats just like in that movie. These slips have transferable liveaboard status. Affordable by Seattle standards anyway.

[Rumrace]

I meant it’s a vacation cause the view is too distracting. I’m from Great Lakes and I’d just forget about a race and wander.
In Georgian Bay a race north or south is outside South and North Cannel too many delightful places to stop and way off course.
Leaving me on the pacific without my trusty Yanmar. No chance. Reckless idea. Certainly liable for life loss.
One tour boat motored to rejoin the race AtoB no offence no one in their class to contest. No one motors in a race.

[Smokeys Kitchen]

To Paul (the OP),

Did I read something up thread correctly? You are wanting to get a boat and live on it with the family while fitting it out? Apologies if I mis-read it, but;

Having kinda done that, albeit with just my wife, it is difficult. I think it could be very problematic with kids.

More importantly, it can be very difficult to find a marina in one of your first choice areas that will let you live aboard. Those slots are very coveted in this current environment. It can be done, but takes a lot of persistence and leg work and luck as well as willingness to adjust where you want to live.

With that said - I agree with several folks here that think Port Townsend would be a great place for a family and meet most if not all of your criteria.

Just food for thought

Ron

[Idaho]

The list of SoCal destinations forgot San Clemente Island.

It is 60 mi offshore, with at least 2 decent anchorages. The south end is well protected from the prevailing.

Diving there is interesting. Good spearfishing and lobstering, but do not touch the unexploded bombs that you will find, and do not go ashore.

That end of island is an aerial gunnery range, and dangerous ordinance is common on the beach and in the best dive locations.

The Navy will chase you off if they want to shoot and drop bombs, so don't worry.

[Tetepare]

Baltimore. Homes in the progressive areas are inexpensive. Dockage is expensive but with no boat it’s not an issue.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by Smokeys Kitchen

To Paul (the OP),

Did I read something up thread correctly? You are wanting to get a boat and live on it with the family while fitting it out? Apologies if I mis-read it, but;

Having kinda done that, albeit with just my wife, it is difficult. I think it could be very problematic with kids.

More importantly, it can be very difficult to find a marina in one of your first choice areas that will let you live aboard. Those slots are very coveted in this current environment. It can be done, but takes a lot of persistence and leg work and luck as well as willingness to adjust where you want to live.

With that said - I agree with several folks here that think Port Townsend would be a great place for a family and meet most if not all of your criteria.

Just food for thought

Ron

Good eye, Ron, for picking that out. Yes, it did sound as if he were considering that. I will try to explain what it is that makes it difficult, but please feel free to add to what I write, to help him see why it is difficult.

1) Space is limited, so after breakfast, all all cleanup (washing dishes and stowing them) must be done. Then you get out all the tools needed for the job, and they take up [precious] space in the area you want to work in. Unless lunch for you and the crew is cheese and crackers, it will also mean putting everything away and getting it back out afterwards. It is very, very difficult to have two different projects going on on a boat at once, because the space is limited and all jobs involve a lot of to-ing and fro-ing. It isn't like a conventional living space where you could work in different rooms because the boat IS a room.

2) An example: Jim and I, who have lived aboard mostly for the period of 37 years, only do projects one at a time. The sewing project of making a boom bag involved going into a marina with a very wide dock, so that we could lay out and cut out the fabric for it, and mark all the places that needed straps or openings. Bring out the sewing machine from the locker and place it on the saloon table. [Whoops! there goes the saloon! with 17 feet of cloth to sew on, there is now no access to the head, without stopping sewing and getting the fabric that slopped onto the cabin sole out of the way.] And everything is like that. If we're going to do an oil change (fairly frequently as the schedule is every 200 hrs. on the engine, and always before a passage so that one doesn't go over. Our engine is under a hinged box which forms one of the "tables" in the galley, and when it is open, there is no access to the cockpit. It will remain open till the job is done, usually takes about 2 hrs., what with all the other checks on the engine and the cleanup. One pumps the oil out by hand (running the engine first helps lower the viscosity so it is easier to pump), and efforts are made to not spill a drop. It is just that space is precious and limited, and boats are a one job at a time environment at the length levels we are considering.

3) Projects involving sanding and painting and varnishing can be difficult both for the mess they generate and which must be cleaned up as you go along, and for the fact that it's best to leave the boat entirely for a few hours for the varnish to dry. We'd go visiting around the anchorage, everybody knows what it is like to have to wait for it to dry enough that you are unlikely to wreck it accidentally--especially the final coat.

I'd suggest you find the most affordable small rental because you'll need to get used to living small], and not try to live on the boat if you're doing major projects. You will need someone to help you with many, like re-bedding stanchions, for example, when you need someone below decks with the wrench and paper towels and someone above, with the screwdriver (to keep the screw from turning). Going aloft can be done alone, but it is safer and easier with someone helping from below, who can go get what you forgot and send it up to you. Depending on the child and his or her capability level, kids can be involved in this, gofering is very helpful, and teaches them about tools.

Ann

[PaulCrawhorn]

No, this is a 5-year plan, and things need to be done in order.

The final stages are me living in the boat, and going cruising, best as my skills at that time allow.

A kid or two might want to join me but optional by then, both directions.

[PaulCrawhorn]

I have to say Port Townsend is sounding better and better.

If only it was on the more Seattle-accessible side, but then by now it would no longer be so nice eh?

My only qualm is so much grey cloudy/wet weather, but I guess can't have everything

[PaulCrawhorn]

Originally Posted by disputin

If you are looking for IT work in Seattle you might want to look at Bremerton, WA



Kitsap transit has 30 minute/$2 each way high speed ferry to downtown Seattle M-F

during work hours.



Washington State ferry for walk on is free going into downtown Seattle and $7.00 for the return. It takes 1 hour but runs all most 24 hours a day.



Bremerton Marina is 500 ft from the ferry terminal. With the new Orca public transit card it's good for all the public ferries, trains and bus systems.





Sean

Excellent! thanks, the ferry options are hard to grok...

[Tetepare]

Ann is so right. We’re refitting on weekends, of course living on the boat for the weekend. Wife cleans it up, I tear it apart. Wife vacuums, a couple hours later I’m tearing out the companionway frame and crap is going everywhere. I try to flush the bird nests out of the boom, wife yells because I forgot to close the ports. Wife wants to go sailing, but my 20 minute project is well into the third hour. Wife is working on the galley and I need that thing she’s blocking…again.

AND we have a house. The garage has three ongoing boat projects (woodworking). I can’t imagine how tough it would be to do these projects in weather windows.

We sold a 26 year old near perfect boat. The dream of refit is fraught with hard work, inconvenience and mess. We are earning our rainbows and unicorns.

[Rumrace]

I have heard lots of romantic fantasies about living in a boat. Might make sense on the west coast while the Pacific current is still running an opportunistic climate.
Here in the Great Lakes only a handful of hardy individuals think an inch of fibreglass is a good dwelling in -35C weather. Where fish tank bubblers keep the ice from crushing the hull. The clubs and marinas are purging themselves live aboard. Georgian Bay Trent Severn it’s a think of the past. It would require clubs to stay open.
The Trent system gets drained in spots for the winter but trust me it’s a block of ice.
Toronto recently lost one marina who allowed winter boats. They all went scrambling for the last one in wintering.
In a home you’re paying every month into your equity. In a boat your life investment is in depreciation.
I’m a walking contradiction. I just repaired my air conditioning and I have zero HAV skills. Learning how to be a marine mechanic ( all trades) is pretty naive and disrespectful of us. I do enjoy seeing my dentist pretending to be a diesel mechanic.
Truth is we should spend more time getting pros to fix our boats so we can relax boating. My Yanmar has 650 hours. It’s spoiled rotten running perfect. I changed the alternator pulleys and belts. That’s it. I swore off cast iron engine junk years ago. If it breaks its getting repaired by a pro.
Have these romantic threads are from folks without boats and never boated.

[JoetheCobbler]

Originally Posted by Rumrace

I have heard lots of romantic fantasies about living in a boat. Might make sense on the west coast while the Pacific current is still running an opportunistic climate.
Here in the Great Lakes only a handful of hardy individuals think an inch of fibreglass is a good dwelling in -35C weather. Where fish tank bubblers keep the ice from crushing the hull. The clubs and marinas are purging themselves live aboard. Georgian Bay Trent Severn it’s a think of the past. It would require clubs to stay open.
The Trent system gets drained in spots for the winter but trust me it’s a block of ice.
Toronto recently lost one marina who allowed winter boats. They all went scrambling for the last one in wintering.
In a home you’re paying every month into your equity. In a boat your life investment is in depreciation.
I’m a walking contradiction. I just repaired my air conditioning and I have zero HAV skills. Learning how to be a marine mechanic ( all trades) is pretty naive and disrespectful of us. I do enjoy seeing my dentist pretending to be a diesel mechanic.
Truth is we should spend more time getting pros to fix our boats so we can relax boating. My Yanmar has 650 hours. It’s spoiled rotten running perfect. I changed the alternator pulleys and belts. That’s it. I swore off cast iron engine junk years ago. If it breaks its getting repaired by a pro.
Have these romantic threads are from folks without boats and never boated.

Some people have narrow skill sets.
In 06 I bought a used vessel for pennies, moved aboard with family and 4 dogs with little money and less income.
Sailed the Eastern USA seasonally and lived aboard winters a few times near lake Ontario in NY.
Had/ have homebuilt woodstove, do all maintenance, and repair.
Engine, electric,sails, canvas, fiberglass, epoxy,etc. Whatever needs done.
Now, years later,the dogs all croaked, the woman long gone,I homeschooled the kids and they're all grown.
I still have the boat, still living aboard, currently in the north, refitting and rerigging to set off in the fall.
Not everyone is inept and helpless.
Many people are extremely capable.
That's what makes cruising easy .
Life ain't hard, people make it hard.

[Rumrace]

Sure the Mother of necessity is a powerful Dame. I’ve built boats for fun. Built some amazing marine engines. It’s not my profession. I drove professionals nuts to learn skills. I’d go broke as a marine mechanic.
Both my antique bikes are restored by me. Took years more than a pro.
I’m just too old to be naive enough to believe I can make more financial return working my trade than learning a new boating repair skill.
As to cast iron my current fun project is an 80’s Donzi 18. I tossed the cast iron 454 in scrap metal. Has an all aluminum LS3 new motor mounts. I didn’t even build the engine. Crate motor now Marinized 500hp from cast iron is too tough on the knuckles.

Lots of free boats around which will float.
There is a club on the islands with 20 rotting Dinghy and 3 free boats, deserted property everywhere. Boat bunkys full of used junk. I’d bulldoze the place return it to a yacht club. No club here will bring in a new liveaboard. Any freed slip is going to seasonal or transient. I’m not paying 5,500 a year to walk through some liveaboards debris field or constant noise.
Rationalizing a luxury pastime sport in a fantasy thread as economic housing represents such a tiny segment of the boating industry it gets silly.
I use to do a lot more immigration law than I do today. I’ve heard just about every immigrant fantasy, lie or desperate need you can imagine. It’s the one branch of law where lies will eventually get you. I’m not an asset to immigrating to the US only Canada.
We review immigration and more recent years refugee law every September. I can’t recall any having live aboard fantasies. I do know two past clients who own cottage boats.

[PaulCrawhorn]

Some places are more open to hosting liveaboard cruisers than others. I do not plan to stay in one spot once we are ready to head out there.

Please stick to the OP topic - the question is WHERE for us to get started, not opinions about the project itself.

If you don't have constructive suggestions, please consider just moving along without comment.

Thanks!

[PineyWoodsPete]

Originally Posted by PaulCrawhorn

I do not yet have the boat, need to not only fit it for nomadic cruising / passagemaking but to gather lots more training and experience. I do not care so much about "fun easy pleasant" trips, no tourism, as much as challenging, out into the open sea for a few weeks at a time then come back would be fine?


Access to fellow DIY sailors, mentors, marine services is definitely most important (with good schools, social factors for the kids)

Tolerance of liveaboards is right up there, paying rent on land definitely will crimp the fitting-out budget

> A partial list of places to sail to in Southern California:

> Santa Rosa, Santa Cruz, Anacapa, Santa Barbara Ventura, Chanel Islands/Oxnard, Santa Barbara Island, Paradise Cove/Malibu, Catalina Island/Avalon/Isthmus Cove/Cat Harbor/etc., Marina del Ray, San Pedro, Long Beach, Alamitos Bay, Newport Beach, Dana Point, Oceanside, Mission Bay, Shelter Island Basin, Glorietta Bay, Chula Vista.

Newport Beach happens to be a place that caught my eye, Orange County in general.

Would others on this list be as good or better than San Diego itself, given my original criteria?

Being so far south, nothing like Florida right?

I'm guessing crazy more expensive than Washington an hour away from Seattle?

There's probably no more delightful place on the planet fitting your needs than well-protected San Diego Bay. The only bitter fruit in this paradise is the life-threatening low coastal water temp. For anyone but those born to it, wetsuit only for any length of time in the water. And too cold for my bones 'till well down Mexico, excepting the balmy Sea of Cortez once you get up it a bit.

Up here in wide-open Monterey Bay, the sea temp just inched up a bit from 52 deg. F. Moving from GA in the late 60's to Oceanside courtesy of the USMC we were appalled to see our small kids dash into the water, then scream in horror and run out - not the Panama City beach they were accustomed to! We had no idea...

We've enjoyed cruising the Channel Is. and the So. Cal coast several times under sail, and more recently by M/V, as far down as San Diego.