Asleep on Watch

[darylat8750]

IMHO: A good Capt.

1. Is clear about what they expect of the crew and is a good teacher if new crew is involved.

2. Utilise crews strengths and minimizes the effect of their weaknesses. (I'm worthless between 4 and 6 AM. No amount of coffee will keep me functioning without at least a few cat naps then. My friend and favorite Capt is up at 5 everyday no matter what. We work well together..)

3. Has equipment and other stuff available to assist with known weakness. Some sort of "Dead man" button like they use on trains or egg timer makes much sense. If you have radar and/or AIS everyone should know how to use it. (I can set a protection bubble around my boat with alarms. It could miss a small panga once in a while but I have yet to see one that the radar did not see.)


Crossing the strait between Cuba and Yucatan one night I saw a huge log. It turned out I didn't have to maneuver to miss it but it was close. I was amazed that it was there and even more amazed that I saw it in the moon light.

[iabmatos]

Originally Posted by Sojourner

^^^THIS. I'm a great fan of the egg timer. Ain't nothing physically gonna happen to you offshore in 15-20 minutes. And yes, though it is technically possible to spot floating debris in the dark, on our boat, with the pilothouse setup and dingy on the foredeck, I doubt you'd see it anyway...

Hello everyone,

How about the forward-looking sonars? Wouldn't they be useful to spot and ALERT a sleepy crew about semi-submersed containers, whales, trees or other large pieces of debris when sailing at some 5 knots? What is their typical operating range?

Cheers,

Ismael

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by iabmatos

Hello everyone,

How about the forward-looking sonars? Wouldn't they be useful to spot and ALERT a sleepy crew about semi-submersed containers, whales, trees or other large pieces of debris when sailing at some 5 knots? What is their typical operating range?

Cheers,

Ismael

No. An awake, responsible watch person who's doing their job works much better.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by darylat8750

IMHO: A good Capt.

1. Is clear about what they expect of the crew and is a good teacher if new crew is involved.

2. Utilise crews strengths and minimizes the effect of their weaknesses. (I'm worthless between 4 and 6 AM. No amount of coffee will keep me functioning without at least a few cat naps then. My friend and favorite Capt is up at 5 everyday no matter what. We work well together..)

3. Has equipment and other stuff available to assist with known weakness. Some sort of "Dead man" button like they use on trains or egg timer makes much sense. If you have radar and/or AIS everyone should know how to use it. (I can set a protection bubble around my boat with alarms. It could miss a small panga once in a while but I have yet to see one that the radar did not see.)


Crossing the strait between Cuba and Yucatan one night I saw a huge log. It turned out I didn't have to maneuver to miss it but it was close. I was amazed that it was there and even more amazed that I saw it in the moon light.

How would you like it if I as a registered nurse decided that I required a two hour nap each night while working in the hospital? And just let the cardiac telemetry alarms do the watch for me.

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by iabmatos

What is their typical operating range?



Cheers,



Ismael

It’s my understanding about 2 to 5 sec at normal cruise

[Tricolor]

Originally Posted by darylat8750

IMHO: A good Capt.

1. Is clear about what they expect of the crew and is a good teacher if new crew is involved.

2. Utilise crews strengths and minimizes the effect of their weaknesses. (I'm worthless between 4 and 6 AM. No amount of coffee will keep me functioning without at least a few cat naps then. My friend and favorite Capt is up at 5 everyday no matter what. We work well together..)

3. Has equipment and other stuff available to assist with known weakness. Some sort of "Dead man" button like they use on trains or egg timer makes much sense. If you have radar and/or AIS everyone should know how to use it. (I can set a protection bubble around my boat with alarms. It could miss a small panga once in a while but I have yet to see one that the radar did not see.)


Crossing the strait between Cuba and Yucatan one night I saw a huge log. It turned out I didn't have to maneuver to miss it but it was close. I was amazed that it was there and even more amazed that I saw it in the moon light.

Originally Posted by Kenomac

How would you like it if I as a registered nurse decided that I required a two hour nap each night while working in the hospital? And just let the cardiac telemetry alarms do the watch for me.

What should he do then? divorce her.. Stop sailing.. invite crew he don't want.. or simply accept the fact that he is a single hand sailor..

I advice the last and live for the rest happily together, the perfect marriage does not exist.

[darylat8750]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

How would you like it if I as a registered nurse decided that I required a two hour nap each night while working in the hospital? And just let the cardiac telemetry alarms do the watch for me.

I think the hours worked in the medical profession is absurd. I worked in a hospital while going to college. I talked to a Dr. who asked me what the weather was like as he hadn't even seen out a window for 2 days. Accidents caused by fatigue can be argued to be actionable.

If you need a 2 hour nap every night I would not hire you for the night shift. I would not hire you to be a professional crew member either. If you took a nap on your shift I would fire you. If you worked so tired that you made a mistake and killed my wife I would sue you. I would not apply for a job as a professional boat crew member. I didn't think we were talking about professionals here. On my boat we work with the skills, talent and shortcomings of what we have available.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

It’s my understanding about 2 to 5 sec at normal cruise

Correct.

I have one, and it's useless for this purpose. The only thing it is good for is poking around in steep-to anchorages.

[JPA Cate]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

Correct.

I have one, and it's useless for this purpose. The only thing it is good for is poking around in steep-to anchorages.

Actually, imho, it is most useful for spotting rocks and reefs you can't see in the water, whether from tannins, cloud reflection, or runoff waters, at least, that's where it has been most useful for us. It is especially handy in poorly charted areas. And such "poking around", done quite slowly, so one can stop in a boat length or so, before striking the darn thing.

I agree with Dockhead, it is useless for surface stuff at sea, you'd be going too fast, and not be able to tell which way to turn, and probably unable to do a 180 deg. turn under sail, anyway.

Ann

[Dsanduril]

I'm surprised that this hasn't been mentioned yet, but one way to keep awake is to turn off the autopilot. Being actively engaged in the steering of the boat keeps the brain functioning and makes it much more difficult to fall asleep. More and more (and I'm as guilty as anyone) we let our boats drive themselves across the ocean. Being actively involved in the driving makes it much easier to stay alert to all the other factors. The unfortunate flip side of this is that you generally (not all of us are Superman) have to have shorter watches as staying continuously alert at this level for long periods isn't easy (and there are lots of studies to support that contention).

For the black-and-white crowd, the OP didn't put too much detail into the scenario. There's a chance that there is some culpability on the part of the captain. Is the watch schedule too long? Were watchstanding responsibilities not properly explained? Is the ship environment such that the crew was too scared to inform the captain that they couldn't stay awake (in which case the crew will likely be just as happy about parting ways as you are)? There are lots of things that can lead to dereliction of duty and some of those can be put at least as much at the foot of command as at the individual.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Zofran is the drug of choice to stop vomiting on our boat, it's the drug of choice on cruise ships world wide to stop passengers from vomiting, and it's the "magic bullet" in hospitals to stop patients from vomiting.

But why let actual medical results obtained by healthcare professionals trump second-hand internet advice? And yes, it does work in 10-15 minutes when crushed and placed under the tongue where it's absorbed quickly. Just ask any one who's taken the magic bullet prescription drug.

Query: Does Zofran relieve all the symptoms of sea sickness, or does it simply stop vomiting? The one time I suffered from advanced seasickness, I would feel much better after vomiting, but the improvement was transitory, and soon I was back to feeling really crappy, enough so to render me pretty useless.

Prevention is generally better than relief after the fact, and that is how we use Stugeron for ourselves.

Jim

[jtsailjt]

Originally Posted by Dockhead

I have exactly the same attitude about watchkeeping. It's a serious responsibility similar to driving a car, even if the process is somewhat different. And the analogies to single-handing are not apt, in my opinion -- when you are sleeping in the cockpit while single handed, you are not responsible for anyone but yourself. If you are sleeping in the cockpit with a boat full of people sleeping below who have put their trust in you to drive the boat, avoiding hazards and collisions, well that's just totally different.
.

It seems that you only half understand why we are required to keep watch. It’s good that you understand your watchkeepers responsibility to the other members of the crew on your boat, but you’re forgetting all about your similar responsibility to sleeping crew members on other boats you might collide with. If, partially due to poor watchkeeping on the vessel you are responsible for, your anchor roller comes crashing into their cabin at 3AM, it won’t matter to them whether you are single handing or have several other crew members onboard. You’ve just ruined their day. Good watchkeeping isn’t something we do just to protect those aboard our own boat from harm, it’s also to avoid harming others out there. Yes, they also have an equal obligation to watch out for you but we are all fallible and that’s why rule 5 of the Colregs uses words like “every” and “all,” so there’s overlap and everyone understands their obligation to watch out for each other as well as for them self.

“Every vessel shall at all times maintain a proper look-out by sight as well as by hearing as well as by all available means appropriate in the prevailing circumstances and conditions so as to make a full appraisal of the situation and of the risk of collision.”

It doesn’t specify that anyone is exempt, whether they be singlehanded or the whole 10 person crew is badly hung over because they celebrated too hard last night or the vessels owner is pinching pennies so didn’t hire an adequate number of crew members. None of those are valid excuses. “Every vessel at all times” seems pretty clear to me.
The colregs aren’t just to keep you safe, they’re to keep everyone safe. As a watch keeper your obligation is not just to your crew, you have an equal obligation to everyone else out there, whether they are aboard your boat or some other boat.

[rallyman1122]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

I find someone who fails to stay awake on watch duty to be totally useless during the remainder of their time onboard. On both occasions, there was no confrontation, nothing said, my wife and I simply assumed all subsequent watches while the individuals then continued to spend most of their time onboard sleeping. I didn’t care what their reason was, medical or lack of responsibility; I didn’t want to hear any excuses.

That’s just the way it is on our boat, if you don’t like it..... Go sleep on someone else’s boat.

Note: My wife and I are both Registered Nurses used to working long shifts and taking our responsibilities to protect others rather seriously. We expect to be treated the same way by others.

Wow! For registered nurses, there is an amazing lack concern to the possibility of a medical condition causing the issue. Glad I won't be sailing with you! Or being treated by you in your professional life.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by jtsailjt

It seems that you only half understand why we are required to keep watch. It’s good that you understand your watchkeepers responsibility to the other members of the crew on your boat, but you’re forgetting all about your similar responsibility to sleeping crew members on other boats you might collide with. If, partially due to poor watchkeeping on the vessel you are responsible for, your anchor roller comes crashing into their cabin at 3AM, it won’t matter to them whether you are single handing or have several other crew members onboard. You’ve just ruined their day. Good watchkeeping isn’t something we do just to protect those aboard our own boat from harm, it’s also to avoid harming others out there. Yes, they also have an equal obligation to watch out for you but we are all fallible and that’s why rule 5 of the Colregs uses words like “every” and “all,” so there’s overlap and everyone understands their obligation to watch out for each other as well as for them self.

“Every vessel shall at all times maintain a proper look-out by sight as well as by hearing as well as by all available means appropriate in the prevailing circumstances and conditions so as to make a full appraisal of the situation and of the risk of collision.”

It doesn’t specify that anyone is exempt, whether they be singlehanded or the whole 10 person crew is badly hung over because they celebrated too hard last night or the vessels owner is pinching pennies so didn’t hire an adequate number of crew members. None of those are valid excuses. “Every vessel at all times” seems pretty clear to me.
The colregs aren’t just to keep you safe, they’re to keep everyone safe. As a watch keeper your obligation is not just to your crew, you have an equal obligation to everyone else out there, whether they are aboard your boat or some other boat.

The question of whether or not single handing is immoral or not is quite a drift from the subject of this thread. There are open threads for discussing this.

It's a different question because people on OTHER boats have their own watchkeepers. People on YOUR boat have only you. See the difference? This doesn't prove that single-handing is OK, and I'm just not going there in this thread. It only proves that it is a different question.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by rallyman1122

Wow! For registered nurses, there is an amazing lack concern to the possibility of a medical condition causing the issue. Glad I won't be sailing with you! Or being treated by you in your professional life.

I agree with you 100%, you definitely won’t be sailing with us.