Autopilot: "To Replace or Not to Replace. That is the Question"

[Roniszoro]

Forgive the Hamlet riff.

I have a Raymarine ST6000 below deck autopilot that works just fine. But it must be at least 18 years old. I'm thinking of a longish, 500-1000NM, offshore passage, single-handing. While the unit works just fine, I've had one die on a friend boat 300 NM from Bermuda. It was less than fun when double-handing. So do I replace my unit with a new Raymarine EV system, which folks rave about? I do have a back up tiller pilot system that attaches to the emergency rudder as well as a wind vane. I tend to follow the "if it isn't broken, don't fix it" philosophy, but that may not be the right answer in this case. You thoughts are encouraged.

[Allied39]

I single hand. I have a CPT primary and a wind vane. My spare old Navico is being serviced, I normally have it aboard.
When I do a very long single handed run which I am planning for I am looking at setting up a below decks to act as a primary spare.
A lot of things can break....few would cause as much hassle as being without an autopilot.....but all this you know.
If I were you I would park a CPT on board, about the best and most economical way to go about being worry free.
Old is not always bad....in many cases it's better....less cheap plastic components which seem to be all the rage in the search for higher profits.

Thats just my opinion.

[Hobiehobie]

I am going to pile on with my own scenario and ask the forum what it thinks…

I am a somewhat experienced ocean sailor but relatively new to single handed sailing. Planning on a single handed sail from NY to Azores in June this year and then a two-up from Azores to UK.

I sail a 2007 Hylas 54 cutter with Lewmar/Whitlock Mamba solid rod steering system driving a partial skeg rudder via an in line motor unit. Rudder stock has operable emergency tiller that can be fitted into the top and moved by control lines to winches (theoretically!). Steering Control head is Raymarine autopilot control at wheel with additional remote control hand held unit (raymarine system all new 2019).

Whole system has worked perfectly so far. Before the solo sail I am going to replace the current motor drive with new and keep the old one as spare (relatively easy to replace motor drive at sea), maybe get a spare autopilot control head, and a spare rudder position sensor. I have followed the drive train from wheel to rudder post to check all joints, bolts, ball joints are good/tight/greased and that the two sealed gear boxes that change direction of rods have no play between the input rod and the output rod.

I have power options to keep the steering juiced up (engine, generator, solar). I don’t think I can add a wind vane on a boat of this displacement of 48,000 lbs.

I am going to try out Mr Evans’ bungee steering system for upwind and off wind steering as soon as the boat is back in the water. But what else should I, or can I do to mitigate any possible problems. Your thoughts and experience very much appreciated.

[Scubaseas]

I also single hand. Raymarine below deck and adding a CPT as a backup or even primary (less power draw) for upcoming long hauls.

[Roniszoro]

Originally Posted by Hobiehobie

I am going to pile on with my own scenario and ask the forum what it thinks…

I am a somewhat experienced ocean sailor but relatively new to single handed sailing. Planning on a single handed sail from NY to Azores in June this year and then a two-up from Azores to UK.

I sail a 2007 Hylas 54 cutter with Lewmar/Whitlock Mamba solid rod steering system driving a partial skeg rudder via an in line motor unit. Rudder stock has operable emergency tiller that can be fitted into the top and moved by control lines to winches (theoretically!). Steering Control head is Raymarine autopilot control at wheel with additional remote control hand held unit (raymarine system all new 2019).

Whole system has worked perfectly so far. Before the solo sail I am going to replace the current motor drive with new and keep the old one as spare (relatively easy to replace motor drive at sea), maybe get a spare autopilot control head, and a spare rudder position sensor. I have followed the drive train from wheel to rudder post to check all joints, bolts, ball joints are good/tight/greased and that the two sealed gear boxes that change direction of rods have no play between the input rod and the output rod.

I have power options to keep the steering juiced up (engine, generator, solar). I don’t think I can add a wind vane on a boat of this displacement of 48,000 lbs.

I am going to try out Mr Evans’ bungee steering system for upwind and off wind steering as soon as the boat is back in the water. But what else should I, or can I do to mitigate any possible problems. Your thoughts and experience very much appreciated.

I would suggest you not conclude that a wind vane would not do an excellent job of steering your boat without having done a lot a research on the topic. By windvane I mean a servo-pendulum one like a Monitor, Aries or Windpilot Pacific. These, as you likely know, transmit directions to your wheel as opposed to a Hydrovane which is a rudder. It is certainly worth a phone call to Scanmar in California. They are most helpful folks.

[Allied39]

Oh, and just to add....my windvane is the best. A SS servo pendulum. I don't use her (her name is Sweetie) on short runs....but offshore she is my go to when the wind is adequate.

[Roniszoro]

Originally Posted by Allied39

Oh, and just to add....my windvane is the best. A SS servo pendulum. I don't use her (her name is Sweetie) on short runs....but offshore she is my go to when the wind is adequate.

What brand is Sweetie?

[pdx_sailing]

I certianly understand the desire to have a back up pilot for long crossing, but I find it interesting that in these threads people want to remove a perfectly good working unit the is 4-15 yrs old, and replace with a brand new unit piror to a big trip. Electronics in general fail early in life or at end of life. So if its working why change it out until it fails? Buy another drive as a back up just in case, as stated they aren't that hard to change out.

sailomat windvane upto 55' maybe? Current Model: SAILOMAT 800 - SAILOMAT

[Roniszoro]

Originally Posted by pdx_sailing

I certianly understand the desire to have a back up pilot for long crossing, but I find it interesting that in these threads people want to remove a perfectly good working unit the is 4-15 yrs old, and replace with a brand new unit piror to a big trip. Electronics in general fail early in life or at end of life. So if its working why change it out until it fails? Buy another drive as a back up just in case, as stated they aren't that hard to change out.

sailomat windvane upto 55' maybe? Current Model: SAILOMAT 800 - SAILOMAT

I think the conversation is about whether one should replace an older unit. When the ST6000 died on our way to Bermuda, it gave no warning. The ram just puked. I think that is one of the issues. We were racing in the Double-Handed Divisions, so we just hand steered the rest of the way. In Bermuda, the owner replaced the ST6000 with a complete, new EV-400 system which was and still is terrific 5000NM later. Electronic stuff tends to not warn us that it is failing until it fails.

As to Sailomat, it is my understanding that they are no longer in business. But if one could steer a 55 foot boat, so can a Monitor, Aries or Windpilot Pacific.

[Allied39]

Originally Posted by Roniszoro

What brand is Sweetie?

Sweetie is a Norvane. I chose it because it is all SS construction, only three servo units that I knew of, the Monitor and Fleming being the others, at the time.

Folks love their monitors, and I believe Flemings too. But the Flemings were simply stupid $$ and I had no intention of sending $$ in that direction.

I went with the Norvane because the guy I dealt with was superb and the price was good.

Norvane is now defunct....but no issue for me, I make my own spares on the rare occasion they are needed.

[ChrisJHC]

From your description, you have a working autopilot, a spare emergency autopilot and a wind vane.

You have plenty of redundancy should your primary autopilot fail.

I don’t see a need to replace a perfectly good working autopilot “just in case”.

[Captain Bill]

I replaced my ST5000 with an EV-1 based autopilot 8.5 years ago. The EV-1 is superior to that old technology in pretty much all respects. I was able to leave my old pump, rudder position sensor, and flux gate compass in place from the ST5000. I decided that while making off shore passages an autopilot was just too valuable to be without. I left the wiring in place and have a Seatalk to Seatalkng converter in my network. I keep my old autopilot head on board and if I should loose my EV-1 I can have the old ST5000 up and running in about an hour. I also have a spare pump on board and a spare rudder position indicator as I got a new one with the new autopilot.

[stormalong]

For many years I bought every used spare for my 1985 vintage Autohelm 6000 autopilot that I saw. I still have many spares for it.

Around 2007 I bought a Raymarine S3G to replace it. Within 30 days of installing it both the control head and the course computer failed. Not at once, first the control head and within a week of getting it back the course computer failed. Spent a lot of time cooling my heels while Raymarine got around to fixing them. That was in the Caribbean and in Panama.

Once I got to New Zealand for the typhoon season I wired a big high current switch to allow either autopilot to control the drive and to select which course computer had power. Since then I have not had an autopilot failure.

Moral of the story: What you are prepared to deal with does not fail.