Banging on starter?

[fireant]

The cause of the problem is sticking armature. At first hitting the starter body will loosen it up. It will get worse the more you use it, Starter needs a rebuild.
You got a new one Great, buy a starter rebuild kit and do it yourself. Also make sure you replace the end bearings.
Also take sandpaper and clean the surface the brushes make contact with.

Now you got a spare starter and the know how to rebuild it.

[more]

Originally Posted by boatpoker

I think you'll find that Bosch starters and many you'll find on Kubota engines were also built in China.

or on lot new car and almost on all oem part

[Island Time O25]

I'm in Boston area so pretty much similar to Seattle as far as being "an arm and a leg" kind of area. But we still have in industrial neighborhoods rebuild/repair shops for alternators, starters, etc. Not as many as 30 years ago but they still exist.

For under $150-200 I would go with rebuild. For over $200 I would just buy a spare starter at $88. Had a similar situation with the alternator which came with the boat. I also have 5432 engine, circa early 80s. The alternator was 100A or 120A Powerline from the early 90s. It gave up ghost in mid 2010s. Went to several rebuild shops, left it with each of them but they were unable to find parts for it as the company went out of business by that time.

A marinized Motorola or Hitachi were over $600-650 plus tax and shipping. Got a brand new cheap 105A Chinese version on ebay for $70, incl delivery. Figured if I have to replace it every few seasons I still would be ahead of the game. Still working 10 years later.

[Island Time O25]

A while back I had a 28 footer with a Yanmar. The starter was not turning. A new starter from Yanmar dealer was quoted close to $900. So that was out of question as the boat was for sale for $5,000. A salty sailor friend offered his help so we ended up openning it, cleaning the brushes, the shaft and whatnot, otherwise it was in good shape and it was working fine afterwards.

Prior to that repair, while I was searching for starter, I learned that most of the various starter brands are Lucas or Lucas knock offs inside. As well as many old windlasses used the same Lucas gear from the starters. And can be interchangeable if one knows which model, etc. Same idea as Universals are just marinized Kubotas.

[Jammer]

Originally Posted by Calaban-Alleria

Personally I would probably pursue the rebuild anyway. There are lots of shops that specialize in that sort of work. Look em up, drive around.
That way you have a new one and a spare - always a good thing - guarantees you will never be in a situation where you need it

This is good advice.


A high quality rebuild on an OEM core will outperform and outlast a cheap copy.

[Iron E]

Originally Posted by massnspace

I think the person who said banging on the starter fixing it proves it is a faulty starter is correct. Corroded wiring would not really be fixed by banging, I think….

But….

The starter WAS working perfectly last time it was used. Was not running slowly or any other signs of illness…


I understand that the eBay starters are probably not as good as the original, but I cannot even source an original online. Anything I find is either a cheap knock off or made by some other company not related to my engine manufacturer. For $88 shipped, I think I will take the risk.

By the way, the motor in question is a Universal M-40, which is I think the same as teh Kubota 5432 tractor engine. I found an old M-40 parts manual, but it seems to list every other part except the starter.

Any input into what it would cost to either get an original (good quality) starter, or a rebuild, would be appreciated. And as far as rebuild cost, please bear in mind I live in a city where a 16 ounce latte is $7, and a pint of microbrew beer is $8-$9.

David
Seattle

If you're asking about having your starter rebuilt, then call established repair shops in your area and ask them who they recommend. The shops I would call would be AAA certified and ASE Certified.
Ask them who they trust, not all rebuild shops are alike.
When you take your starter in, tell them exactly what you did to get it to work.
There are several causes for the hammer tapping cure:
• Stuck, corroded, dirty internal starter parts
• Solenoid
• Worn Brushes or Commutator

Letting them know gives them an extra keen eye for the issues. In 25 years of running a shop, I had many starters rebuilt, only to have the same issue resurface.
Finding a good and reliable rebuild shop and letting them know the issue was key to not having comebacks.

[Cheechako]

Originally Posted by massnspace

Well I pulled the trigger and just bought a new one. $88 shipped. I will try to post an update when it goes in….

I don’t know about other parts of the country, but it seems here in Seattle even getting someone to look at something like his is very hard….no one calls back, and even if I could find someone, I am guessing the cost of a rebuild will be extreme. Even if the Chinese one craps out after a few years I’ll be happy with that….for $88.

I would keep the original in reserve, open and observe the inside. It may simply be dirty and gummed up. Often the brushes are not worn at all. The pinion gets gummed up on the shaft.

I think in Seattle it was Ballard Electric who rebuilds everything from electric motors to starters etc. They were popular with the boating and Antique car crowd. I think they are still in business but if they are the same I don't know......

[massnspace]

Called 2 rebuilders today. One said it would most likely be “between $300 and $450” for a rebuild, and that was only if it was a straightforward job with no surprises….(so I am guessing $600), and the other hung up on me (or connection failed) after being on hold for 15 minutes.

So. My brand new $88 starter is in the mail….

And anyone planning on cruising through or moving to the fine Seattle area should prepare for these types of prices. I would guess things have doubled or even tripled in price here over the last 10-15 years….not the same as it used to be….

[Don C L]

I'd still do what others have suggested, get the replacement and rebuild the one you have and hang on to it.
In my old Plymouth Valiant it was the solenoid in the starter that needed the whack.

[massnspace]

Originally Posted by Don C L

I'd still do what others have suggested, get the replacement and rebuild the one you have and hang on to it.
In my old Plymouth Valiant it was the solenoid in the starter that needed the whack.

Not going to pay that much just for a backup. And that starter is close to 45 years old…..time for the garbage can. I could buy about 7 brand new ones for multiple backups for the same price as a rebuild.

Also, I have towing insurance that, yearly, costs me a fraction of what a rebuild would cost……

[clownfishsydney]

Old car starter motor trick!

[thomm225]

Originally Posted by massnspace

Not going to pay that much just for a backup. And that starter is close to 45 years old…..time for the garbage can. I could buy about 7 brand new ones for multiple backups for the same price as a rebuild.

Also, I have towing insurance that, yearly, costs me a fraction of what a rebuild would cost……

Right.

Rebuilds and repairs like that were great 30-40 years ago, but today, it's just too expensive for the labor which is why we replace with an inexpensive unit no matter what it might be.

Bad circuit card, radio, starter, radiator, power supply, alternator, etc.

Then toss the old one in the trash. Or take to salvage.

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by massnspace

Sailboat would not start yesterday. Older marine diesel.

Took a small hammer, banged on the starter, then it turned over and started no problems.

I had read about that trick and yes, it did work, but why? And will it happen again? What is the long-term fix???

It worked because the Brushes got hung up in their guides. Banging shook them loose. You need to remove starter, get new brushes -remove old brushes, clean guides- install new brushes clean entire starter when off- good to go .

[fireant]

No idea for the cost of the starter rebuild kit for your part. But it cant be that expensive. If never done it before then YOUTUBE is your friend.
They are really not hard to do. Besides it feels good to accomplish something and learn on the way.
Its how feel about it, But i used to have a shop and like to tinker.

[Shaneesprit]

Try and have your starter rebuilt if it’s an original one, rather than a cheap Chinese version.
You could strip and clean it but really it’s needing a rebuild.