California Reg & Liability Insurance for Non-Resident?

[imagine2frolic]

Go down to the DMV, and they will bring out the big fat book of knowledge with all the rules straight from the horses mouth. When I bought Imagine in St. Maarten Ca. tried to get tax money. I asked them to look, and I saved tens of thousand dollars, and all by the book.

I am going from what I have read here, but it seems you can register Canadian, and not pay taxes until the boat hits Canadian water?........i2f

[David M]

For my own personal boat, I go through Boat US Marine Insurance. There has never been a problem and the rates are competitive.

[zeehag]

kali hasnt a use tax. kali hs a sales tax equalization problem and ar e bankrupt. DO call the state equalization board in sacramento,,.do not listen to anyone else other than that board. . you will have 30 days max to exit state of kali before you HAVE TO PAY tax.


btdt--kali residunce for more than 20 yrs...i just recently btdt.....but--do not even listen to me-- please call state board of equalization. dmv dont know squat about documentation of vessels, do know a lot about sales tax on state titled vessels and vehicles, but nothing for documented... go to horses mouth..in sacramento , or see dona jenkins, if you are in san diego-- she knows everything.

for insurance, go to whatever insurance company you want. progre3ssive is cheap and doesnt require survey..... just for liability

[bangkaboat]

Thanks for all of the sage advice! I am going to give the Cal DMV their pound of flesh & see if I can give my cousin's Riverside address, or friends' Malibu address, as a c/o residence. Hopefully, that works. If nothing else, flying the stars & stripes from my stern will give my x-Canadian friends in Texas a real thrill!

[imagine2frolic]

Z,

You are the DMV doesn't know squat, but they carry the big book with all the rules in it........i2f

[zeehag]

i2f--is why i like dona jenkins for her ability to make documentation easy....and i am no longer in kali except for my second boat-- she lives in sd under a bridge......

hurry and come out to play more in these waters!!!!

[Capt Phil]

If you are a non-US citizen, you must remove the vessel from USCG documentation rolls and have a choice of registering her in a state as a foreign owned vessel or, preferably,IMO, register her in a Canadian province as Canada does not have a nation-wide documentation process.
As far as taxes are concerned, if you bought the boat in California and it remains in CA past the drop dead date, 30 days, as I recall but could be wrong, you will be plagued to your grave and beyond by the CA Franchise Tax Board. By that I mean if you do not pay the tax owed, your estate will be responsible for the payment+interest+penalties and they will literally go to the ends of the earth to collect what they feel they are owed. This is a 'sales tax' as opposed to an annual use tax levied by all coastal counties and assessed in the spring of each year. If you are late on paying that county tax, they just sue you and get a judgement issued against you. They are not interested in excuses like I wasn't in the county or didn't really own the boat. Their attitude is that it will cost you more in legal fees to get the judgement removed than it would to pay the tax+penalties.
'Zee's suggestion of Donna Jenkins in San Diego is a good one. Her firm can handle the removal from USCG documentation, if necessary, as well as get you steered in the right direction for state registration (which I advise against in CA).
If you want further advice, PM me and I would be happy to outline my experiences over the years buying, selling and moving boats in and out of CA and the issues I have had with tax authorities in CA. It ain't a pretty story and I would never live or conduct business in that state again.
What ever you decide to do, document every move completely and thoroughly... you will need to produce proof of every single move you make. Cheers, Capt Phil

[bangkaboat]

Capt Phil, thanks for the advice! In fact, all canadian licensing and registering is Federal(nation-wide). I've already done much of the process through Mary Conlin Co.($190usd) & will be using a friend's LA address for insurance, etc., and paying the California tax. That'll take the pressure off getting the boat refitted & out of State. However, I am looking for someone to move her from BCYC in Newport Beach to Island Yacht Anchorage in Wilmington, ASAP. "Someone dropped the ball" so I need to move it today/tomorrow. That same someone is "arranging things", but I'm not going to rely too heavily on him, if I can arrange it myself.
Mike

[bangkaboat]

Originally Posted by zeehag

i2f--is why i like dona jenkins for her ability to make documentation easy....and i am no longer in kali except for my second boat-- she lives in sd under a bridge......

hurry and come out to play more in these waters!!!!

I'll bet there's a shortage of fish tacos around Ensenada, right now!

[Lancerbye]

I see you have been getting a lot of bad info from those who haven't done this before. You can buy the boat in California (offshore) use an Alberta address if you can. With the sales agreement you go and document it in Canada at one of the Ships registry office. Deregister in California.(first) Now you have a Canadian registered vessel which is a visiting vessel good for 6 months. You will not be charged GST until you enter Canada. Alberta has no PST. Fly the Canadian flag.

[Seahunter]

1) Do I need to re-register the boat, or am I allowed to keep it in California for up to 90 days unregistered?
Yes - No
2) Any idea who does liability insurance for a non-resident in California?(Marina requirement) I've tried General Mariners, but no go, & contacted my local Canadian insurers, but no go. Alternatively, is there a place to moor in the LA area where I don't require the liability insurance(not something I want but, maybe, no choice!)
No - Yacht, Boat and Cargo Ship Insurance by Douglas K. Smith Marine Insurance Services, Inc.

[webejammin]

We bought our catamaran in San Diego's Mission Bay last fall and went off shore to receive the boat officially, it's supposed takes a licenced captian to deliver the boat off shore 3 miles so you can take pic's of a GPS and it's Lattitudes and Longtitudes with a current daily news paper and the Captian's signiture if you want it official. As for as Canada taxes I'm not sure. It did take 4 months for the US coast guard to get the papers back to us so we could pay Washington state tax but that wasn't sent untill we were here on the Columbia River.

[Seahunter]

Originally Posted by zeehag

kali hasnt a use tax. kali hs a sales tax equalization problem and ar e bankrupt. DO call the state equalization board in sacramento,,.do not listen to anyone else other than that board. . you will have 30 days max to exit state of kali before you HAVE TO PAY tax.

California has a use tax, and a sales tax. Your info is ALL wrong.

[bangkaboat]

This is all great advice & much appreciated. Once I have the boat insured & in her new slip, I'll worry about the state requirements. Then again, not much chance of them collecting from me when in Asia. But the licensing will help in foreign ports, so it may be worth paying for/getting.

My understanding is, yes, there is a use tax in Cal & the requirement for licensing is within 30 days of purchase. Now, all I have to worry about is getting her moved & whether our election results will cause our Canadian dollar to become a peso again! After that, it's just open the hatches & dump mass quantities of money in! Why didn't I choose bird-watching as a hobby, instead? Or ant counting?
Mike

[Capt Phil]

Seahunter is correct as I recall. The 'sales' tax is levied by the the State Board of Equalization on all boat sold in state and the those that enter the state within 90 days of sale elsewhere. The exception is that if the boat which was purchased in state leaves within, I believe, 30 days and remains out of state for 90 CONTINUOUS days having been delivered offshore, ie, outside the 3 mile limit, delivered by a licensed Capt without the prospective buyer aboard who must join the vessel and consumate the sale outside the 3 mile limit documented by photos of the GPS position, newspaper dated the date of sale and an original copy of the delivery receipt signed by the delivery skipper identifying the vessel aboard which the prospective buyer was delivered to the point of sale. The sold vessel may re-enter the State of California for a period not to exceed 30 days to fuel, provision and affect repairs needed to leave the state. Failure to follow these procedures to the letter will cause the 'sales' tax to be levied by the state.
Hence the term '91 Day Yacht Club' for those keeping their boats in Ensenada for the requisite 3 months. I made a fair living delivering boats back and forth between Southern CA ports and Ensenada years ago so am familiar with the maritime kabooke dance.
Also boats purchased outside the CA are subject to the 'sales' tax if they enter CA waters, ie, within the 3 mile limit, before 90 days from the date of sales passes.
Counties bordering on the Pacific have a 'use' or property tax (not to be confusd with a 'sales' tax) which is levied annually, usually in the spring which used to be 1% of the assessed value of the vessel.
Trying to beat the state or county out of what they consider is THEIR money invites all kinds of nastiness. Hope this helps.
If any one has any updates to this procedure, please add the this thread because folks can really get burned if they don't know or disregard the rules. Capt Phil