Inboard engines and a changing world

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by Adelie

I'm no Tesla fan but they've got a semi with a 500mi range pulling 80,000lb if I recall correctly.

Really what is going to happen is that they will standardize somewhere around a 200-300mi range and install overhead catenaries over freeways and many arterials. Trucks will use battery to get to and from major arterials and pull power off the catenary on major roadways. They are already working on this in Europe and I believe California is starting a pilot project.

Is this similar to california's hi speed rail ?? lol

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Well not really

I doubt that genny is 350kw--more like 35kw max--will still burn lotsa fuel.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by geoleo

I doubt that genny is 350kw--more like 35kw max--will still burn lotsa fuel.

It really is a 350kw generator .

[HeywoodJ]

But it is not diesel powered. And while it is not a great way to power an EV, it does fill a hole where electric transmission is not available.

The first electric fast charger has been installed on the remote Nullarbor, described as one of the final frontiers for Australia's growing number of battery-powered vehicles.

Key points:

• Caiguna Roadhouse is 1,091km east of Perth and 1,634km west of Adelaide
• It is now home to the remote Nullarbor's first fast charger for electric vehicles
• Plans by the WA and SA governments for electric highways left out the Nullarbor

Caiguna Roadhouse, one of 10 outback roadhouses dotted along a 910-kilometre stretch of the Eyre Highway, has become the first to embrace electric vehicles with a carbon-neutral charger.

The installation powered by vegetable oil — used to fry food like hot chips — comes more than a decade after what many motoring enthusiasts say was the first known crossing by an electric vehicle.

The $75,000 Biofil system was crowd-funded and plugs a 720km gap between proposed fast chargers in Western Australia and South Australia.

It was invented by retired Perth mechanical engineer Jon Edwards and means electric motorists can recharge their vehicles in less than an hour instead of needing to stay overnight.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-01-...rbor/100762138

And the maker reports them as 50kW, and claims greater efficiency, if powered by diesel, than a diesel vehicle.

The system has been designed and developed by engineer Jon Edwards, specifically so roadhouses – initially across the Nullarbor – can filter their waste fryer oil and then use it to run in generator to power an EV fast charger.

The technology is called the Biofil, and a number of other electric vehicle owners held an EV show and tell day in the hometown of one particular roadhouse owner in early November to demonstrate the innovative charging solution.

While it may seem at first to be counterintuitive – why burn oil to power an EV when a combustion car can already drive these distances – Edwards and co have shown in the past that even using a diesel generator to power the Biofil uses less fuel than a diesel car would to drive the same distance.

https://thedriven.io/2021/11/30/ev-c...und-australia/

[Bowdrie]

Originally Posted by Adelie

Just takes time, money and will.

That could be said of just about anything imaginable.
The Doomsayers say there is no or very little time.
Money? where will it come from, who will pay? Will the consumers pay $25 for a gallon of gas, or $10 for a loaf of bread?
The printing presses are already running at warp speed, I guess just build more printing presses.
We're 30 trillion in debt, we print funny money just to pay the interest.
Wealth is created by producing something someone will buy, when a country divests itself of its manufacturing base it becomes a "service" society, basically a society in which everybody just sells insurance to each other.
That doesn't create real wealth, only cyphers on a paper with no backing or tangible product.
BASF, a huge company in Germany recently announced it was moving many of its operations to China.
They cited the main reason as being 'Un-reliable energy supplies' necessary to continue operations in Germany.
They were producing over 14,000 chemical products.
What about the people who worked there?
Can you say Lost Tax Base.
That's the tip of the iceberg.
Germany, (and by default the EU,) are going down the tubes, England is already on the ropes, Oz isn't far behind.
All these big ideas are predicated upon buying everything from steel, cement, and lithium, (and a million other things from China).
In the US the housing market has dropped 7% in just a few months.
I ask again, where is all this money for the 'Big Ideas' going to come from?
The "Will"? that's a joke.
What is tossed about as "Will" is more akin to "Hope", and anyone who has ever served in the military knows that "Hope is not a plan".

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by geoleo

Is this similar to california's hi speed rail ?? lol

It’s the same as all high speed rail including California’s. California’s high speed rail is slated to start service in 2029.
Most of Europe’s regular rail runs on overhead catenary.

[Adelie]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

That could be said of just about anything imaginable.
The Doomsayers say there is no or very little time.
Money? where will it come from, who will pay? Will the consumers pay $25 for a gallon of gas, or $10 for a loaf of bread?
The printing presses are already running at warp speed, I guess just build more printing presses.
We're 30 trillion in debt, we print funny money just to pay the interest.
Wealth is created by producing something someone will buy, when a country divests itself of its manufacturing base it becomes a "service" society, basically a society in which everybody just sells insurance to each other.
That doesn't create real wealth, only cyphers on a paper with no backing or tangible product.
BASF, a huge company in Germany recently announced it was moving many of its operations to China.
They cited the main reason as being 'Un-reliable energy supplies' necessary to continue operations in Germany.
They were producing over 14,000 chemical products.
What about the people who worked there?
Can you say Lost Tax Base.
That's the tip of the iceberg.
Germany, (and by default the EU,) are going down the tubes, England is already on the ropes, Oz isn't far behind.
All these big ideas are predicated upon buying everything from steel, cement, and lithium, (and a million other things from China).
In the US the housing market has dropped 7% in just a few months.
I ask again, where is all this money for the 'Big Ideas' going to come from?
The "Will"? that's a joke.
What is tossed about as "Will" is more akin to "Hope", and anyone who has ever served in the military knows that "Hope is not a plan".

While BASF looks to downsize in Europe due to high energy and feedstock prices due to the Russian invasion and they are opening plants in China that doesn’t mean they are moving there lock stock and barrel.
While China has lower labor costs, and is a customer for their products the needed gas and crude oil feed stocks are similarly priced or more expensive since they have a 7,000nm journey by ship to get there from the Middle East. Moving some production there will probably save them some money moving all production there would just mean the same problems but 8800km away from headquarters in a country known for lifting trade secretes from anybody producing there.

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Adelie

It’s the same as all high speed rail including California’s. California’s high speed rail is slated to start service in 2029.
Most of Europe’s regular rail runs on overhead catenary.

Not going to happen date will perpetually get pushed back like it has for thd last 2 decades

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by Bowdrie

Germany, (and by default the EU,) are going down the tubes, England is already on the ropes, Oz isn't far behind.
All these big ideas are predicated upon buying everything from steel, cement, and lithium, (and a million other things from China).

Thanks, but I disagree with you, England isn't on the ropes and potentially much better placed to deal with the energy crisis going on in Europe at the moment than many of the other countries.

So who will pay you ask? simple, in Europe those using petrol and diesel cars and don't want to switch. Writing is already on the cards and the tax systems already in place. What's more governments don't actually have to do anything to collect it, the retailers do the work and just hand it over. EU gov's similar and are the rates.

UK Fuel Duty Rates attached (20% VAT needs to be added to the figures). Petrol about £1.60 per and diesel £1.80 per litre at the moment.

There may be some users that need to keep using diesel like fishing boats, but the majority of us could switch over in time with the right incentive, like its cheaper to go electric than pay future dino fuel prices. Also started in London but spreading to other major UK cities are clean air zones. Drive inside the city limits with a vehicle and you pay depending on the amount of CO2 it produces, so trucks pay more. Small very efficient cars exempt, you can guess what everyone is buying. They have a choice but cutting down on oil is starting to ramp up.

Pete

[SV_FlyingTigress]

Originally Posted by newhaul

Things will change as the current world situation is showing the power grids are not up to the challenge and won't be for the foreseeable future . The total infrastructure takes several decades to update . ( takes time to make the equipment ) .
As much as everyone of you would like to see it facts are facts.

This is correct. I have material experience in large US power grid infrastructure condition monitoring and you have a lot of spots, particularly in high population concentration areas, that have massive amounts of infrastructure that is *way older* than you would ever guess. An those organizations 1) do not have the budget to replace it and kick the can down the road so the technical debt has been spiraling and 2) are un as quazi-governmental organizations and as such are immensely inefficient and often ineffective at transformation despite an ability to consume money like a supermassive black hole.

[Lake-Effect]

Originally Posted by Stephen_MO

... you have a lot of spots, particularly in high population concentration areas, that have massive amounts of infrastructure that is *way older* than you would ever guess. An those organizations 1) do not have the budget to replace it and kick the can down the road so the technical debt has been spiraling ...

2035 is a long way away. There will either be changes and developments that make it possible... or they will just say oops and pick another date.

Old electrical infrastructure will be replaced and upgraded eventually. We are actually getting more life out of existing grids because of increased efficiencies, and time-of-use surcharges which help flatten peak demands. Another potential plus is that more localized generation and feed-ins will reduce the amount of energy needed (and line losses) from distant power plants.

Many people also forget that EV charging will mainly be overnight, when other demand is low. Centrally-rotated EV charging is another way to keep peak demand in check.

[Chotu]

This thread is getting more relevant by the month.

It’s a coming: California bans sale of new diesel trucks. All of them.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/04/28/...s-by-2036.html

[newhaul]

Originally Posted by Chotu

This thread is getting more relevant by the month.

It’s a coming: California bans sale of new diesel trucks. All of them.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/04/28/...s-by-2036.html

They will come to realize the power grid can't support that many EVs and will move the implementation date just like a game of kick the can .

[geoleo]

CA has increasing black outs of electricity now and arent building more reliable juice--so how are they going to power all those trucks? Oh forgot-they are going to put sails on the trucks and windmills too.

[Statistical]

Originally Posted by geoleo

CA has increasing black outs of electricity now and arent building more reliable juice--so how are they going to power all those trucks? Oh forgot-they are going to put sails on the trucks and windmills too.

Most electrical vehicle charging happens overnight. Rarely are there blackouts at 2:30 AM. 25% of new light duty vehicles sold in CA in 2022 were plugins (plugin hybrids plus all electric). It is happening although the change is going to take decades.