Life Raft Discussion.... Yes or No?

[Exile]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

You’re right... you wouldn't be happy on our boat. Besides, all crew positions for the trans Atlantic voyage are now filled.

Lemme guess, falling asleep on watch and high-minded sanctimony are absolute disqualifiers.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by Exile

Lemme guess, falling asleep on watch and high-minded sanctimony are absolute disqualifiers.

Two Registered Nurses, an electrical/mechanical/diesel engineer and a Canadian friend with six Atlantic crossings on a Discovery 55 under his belt make up our present crew of four guys who plan on having a very easy going 3-4 week adventure.

No sleepyheads allowed.

[kmacdonald]

Originally Posted by Exile

Lemme guess, falling asleep on watch and high-minded sanctimony are absolute disqualifiers.

Well, watch and happy hours always seem to coincide. You don't have a problem with that do you?

[daletournier]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

If you can't get a weather forecast while on passage you might want to reconsider making passages past your weather forecast window or invest in that capability instead of a life raft. IMHO that would be the RATIONAL decision.

Hmmm.....this would suggest you haven't sailed off shore. Weather prediction via satalite is awesome EXCEPT they just aren't always correct, they can change quickly. I have invested in long range forecast capability and a life raft.

[meirriba]

Many posts above, I have suggested to the OP to have both a dighy prepared with survival equipment AND a liferaft (to be sold when not needed anymore)
However, nobody seems interested in another issue I have raised: dinghy fuel...
How far can you sail your dinghy from sinking point? And if the fuel is gone, how you proceed?

[Pete7]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

You can use engine water pump">raw water pump and inlet valve to pump out water also. https://www.groco.net/products/valve...ervice-adaptor

Do you have experience of this, or is it something you read on line or in a book? The amount of raw water used to cool a small diesel engine is tiny and so is any pumping capacity in an emergency.

What pumps do you carry on your boat? since it is quite small, then even a single burst seacock can quickly develop into a serious problem because you don't have the ability to carry lots of water in the hull. Presumably since you don't like rafts then you have a robust solution involving pumps.

Pete

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by meirriba

Many posts above, I have suggested to the OP to have both a dighy prepared with survival equipment AND a liferaft (to be sold when not needed anymore)
However, nobody seems interested in another issue I have raised: dinghy fuel...
How far can you sail your dinghy from sinking point? And if the fuel is gone, how you proceed?

The dinghy fuel is irrelevant because as described in the early posts, it wouldn't be used for transportation, the dinghy would only be used as a substitute for the life raft. You'd proceed the the same way as in a life raft, by just sitting there waiting to be rescued.

[Uricanejack]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

You’re right... you wouldn't be happy on our boat. Besides, all crew positions for the trans Atlantic voyage are now filled.

So why were you asking for opinions here?

If you want validation for a decision you have already made.
There are plenty of experts here who will validate your decision.
A few others like myself. Who are clearly fear mongering wimps. Will disagree.

If you and your friends are happy with it. Do what you want.

I will repeat my question to you as the owner and skipper of the boat. Its your responsibility.

Do you respect and value the lives of your crew enough to provide a life raft?.

With 4 persons on board. A 4 person offshore life raft, aprox $2000

Odds are you will never need to answer the question in extremis.

If something happens will you as owner and skipper be able say you took all reasonable and practicable precautions to ensure your crews safety?

I would say no.

[kmacdonald]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Do you have experience of this, or is it something you read on line or in a book? The amount of raw water used to cool a small diesel engine is tiny and so is any pumping capacity in an emergency.

What pumps do you carry on your boat? since it is quite small, then even a single burst seacock can quickly develop into a serious problem because you don't have the ability to carry lots of water in the hull. Presumably since you don't like rafts then you have a robust solution involving pumps.

Pete

Again, prevention is relied on. I maintain my boat. I have a single hand operated bilge pump. I use a small honda de-watering pump to lower the water level in my pool before covering for winter. Works great. When you say the water volume pumped by a small diesel raw water pump, what do you mean? What horsepower engine? What do you consider "tiny" volume? Please be a little more specific and yes, it will require reading a book or manual for those answers. I used a groco valve on the raw water intakes on my Bertram and each engine pumped 55 GPM for a total of 110 GPM's. Is that tiny in your book? I'm really interested to see the GPM,s from a small diesel.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by kmacdonald

Again, prevention is relied on. I maintain my boat. I have a single hand operated bilge pump. I use a small honda de-watering pump to lower the water level in my pool before covering for winter. Works great. When you say the water volume pumped by a small diesel raw water pump, what do you mean? What horsepower engine? What do you consider "tiny" volume? Please be a little more specific and yes, it will require reading a book or manual for those answers. I used a groco valve on the raw water intakes on my Bertram and each engine pumped 55 GPM for a total of 110 GPM's. Is that tiny in your book? I'm really interested to see the GPM,s from a small diesel.

Tiny, like 6.5-7 GPM in a lossless system.

That’s with the engine wrapped up to 3000 rpm.

Oberdorfer 202M.

[meirriba]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

The dinghy fuel is irrelevant because as described in the early posts, it wouldn't be used for transportation, the dinghy would only be used as a substitute for the life raft. You'd proceed the the same way as in a life raft, by just sitting there waiting to be rescued.

Well, this is the answer I have expected😄
What you need to consider in this case that an unpowered dinghy would be highly unstable in any gale condition, as without power you will very fast find yourself beam to wind/waves. Prepare a good sea anchor or drogue for the dinghy.
At least this is my experience of using RIB's for around 50 years.
But I have seen that you have already decided to add a liferaft to your boat, so you may have advantages of both.
Bon voyage.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by meirriba

Well, this is the answer I have expected😄
What you need to consider in this case that an unpowered dinghy would be highly unstable in any gale condition, as without power you will very fast find yourself beam to wind/waves. Prepare a good sea anchor or drogue for the dinghy.
At least this is my experience of using RIB's for around 50 years.
But I have seen that you have already decided to add a liferaft to your boat, so you may have advantages of both.
Bon voyage.

Thanks for your help. This discussion aided very much in making my decision.

[TeddyDiver]

Dougal Robertson had some experience with dinghy vs liferaft, thou materials used on liferafts might have improved since.

[kmacdonald]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

Thanks for your help. This discussion aided very much in making my decision.

I don't think I could have gotten the lines untied without all the wonderful help here. What a gem this place turned out to be.

[kmacdonald]

I'd like to get some suggestions on Drogues and ground tackle for use on a rubber dinghy/life raft.