Main Cat Crew Rescued Off Oregon Inlet NC

[contrail]

By the way, some friends of mine on a Leopard 43, against my strongest possible advice, actually did Oregon Inlet earlier this year! They did ground very briefly (in the "easy" area, wherever that is) but got off quite quickly and proceeded without damage or incident. And it wasn't in bad weather.

[Jenta]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

The anchor line failed. Catamarans just can’t carry enough chain. It’s really that simple.
Captain Mark

I can't resonate with that statement. Maybe a certain class of catamaran, but certainly not the ones we hang with.

On our Lagoon 440 we carry 100 meters (330 feet) of 13mm chain with our 85-pound Mantus and 1" 3 strand nylon bridle. I don't think that isn't enough chain. Our backup/secondary is an FX-85 Fortress with 250 feet of 1" 3 strand nylon. Granted, we're not a racing cat and we can carry a lot of weight without paying a huge penalty. I know most of our cruising mates on cats are equipped similarly.
We still try to keep the weight down, but not for things that are important to safety. That chain and the anchor up front add nearly 1000 pounds but totally worth it.

That being said - I can't imagine trying to anchor out there and "ride it out" especially when you can't really see when the end of the nasty conditions will be and if indeed things will deteriorate further before you can pick up and move.

[caradow]

Originally Posted by SailFastTri

Picture shows sails were stowed. It’s tempting to pile on the opinions here but there’s just not enough info here to make judgments. There’s got to be more to this. I wonder why they were there? (AFAIK Oregon inlet isn’t navigable for sailboats under any circumstances, and is at best a fair weather inlet for shallow draft powerboats). Why anchored in open ocean heavy seas, on a lee shore, if they could sail or power?

👍👍👍 Those are my thoughts exactly!
Capt Mark’s comments leads a lot to be examined. First of all his statement about cats not able to carry enough chain is a bit biased and he needs an education on cats. They indeed can carry enough chain especially when most actually carry the chain in front of the mast instead of an anchor locker on the bow. Other than the obvious that you correctly brought attention to I would like to know what type of anchor, what weight , how much rode but again more importantly what was the skipper thinking in the first place. Wrong place wrong time.

[SailFastTri]

Originally Posted by contrail

By the way, some friends of mine on a Leopard 43, against my strongest possible advice, actually did Oregon Inlet earlier this year! They did ground very briefly (in the "easy" area, wherever that is) but got off quite quickly and proceeded without damage or incident. And it wasn't in bad weather.

Was this them? (Copied From ActiveCaption)
20-APR-2022
Cat Kindness
We are a 2006 43 foot Leopard Sailing Catamaran with a 4.5 foot draft and made a decision traverse the inlet from inside out to the ocean. ⛵️ The Oregon Inlet is an interesting, challenging, humbling beast. We tried to get as much information as we could regarding our passage. We got recent sonar info. We talked to the Coast Guard. We went to the Army Corp of Engineers website. It is surprising how little recent information there is about the inlet available online. Most information out there has the old bridge. We even attempted to see if we could pay a local fisherman to let us follow them out. When we talked to local knowledge, we were told to hug the red so we took that to stay to the port side of the route. ⛵️ Maps are not updated here, so it is difficult to get an idea of even which span of the bridge you are to go through. We asked and were told the markers will bring you right to the opening span. More accurately and not told, the markers bring you along the bridge from the North to South and the span to go under is all the way on the South side. Based on the sonar map deep water was to port at the north side of the bridge so all seemed to be aligning as we hugged the port side along the bridge heading South. The sonar information said the deep water ended halfway but we knew the depth changed with currents daily so we relied on what we thought the locals said regarding hugging the red(we took to mean port). Interestingly enough, there were green buoys along the bridge but no reds to hug. We took the bridge itself to be the red and this is where information started to conflict. ⛵️ We ended up aground in front of one of the pylons of the bridge. The sonar data was dead accurate. Apparently you have to hug the green until you get through the bridge which is also very shallow but then hug the red and even go behind one of the reds in the outlet. We called the Coast Guard and Boat US to inform them we were aground. The Coast Guard was quite surprised by where we went aground as we were still on the inside west side of the bridge, not even in the inlet where the rough water is. ⛵️ However Going outside the red was mentioned locally and reinforced by the sonar information, We were able to rotate the boat in the sand and get her floating freely again on our own. After we realized the sonar data was accurate, we had a source of truth which coincided with what Boat US shared. So we decided not to quit. We used the sonar info to find our way to the span. You must hug the green buoys on this side of the bridge and use the sonar data for the exact path. The buoys are not enough. ⛵️ It was relatively deep where we went under the bridge. The outlet then splits South and North in the ocean. We headed North. It was a very calm day and there were still breakers everywhere except the relatively narrow passages. Very, very shallow everywhere else. Shallow but passable where you were to go. With the sonar data(three days old) we knew at this point where to go. We needed to go behind one of the red buoys. Going outside the red was mentioned locally and reinforced by the sonar information. The sonar data loaded into Aquamaps and it being recent, at least for us, ended up being the most reliable information. Allowing us to see our current location with depth represented by color made the passage possible without guesswork. The buoys only provided a rough guide. ⛵️ I would strongly not recommend if conditions are not calm, data is not recent, or visibility is impaired. Before we were able to get off the sand, we were prepared to wait for incoming tide or get pulled off and perhaps stay at the local marina. However, perseverance won in the the end. All in all the inlet lives up to its reputation but perhaps not in the way we thought. ⛵️ The Oregon Inlet is known for how it changes, even daily, so what worked for us may not work for all. Our hope in sharing this is to give a small piece of insight to this infamous inlet.

[Manateeman]

It’s good to see any vessel with sufficient anchor gear. Perhaps I over simplified, but honestly, just based on what I see in mass produced boats, I feel sorry for most buyers because survivability seems to take a backseat to convenience.
And I’m not exempting monohulls. Boat design I most regret ever having anything to do with building was J boats.
I really like the Chris White foil mast...Atlantic 40 something. First time I saw one I rowed over to talk. Very impressed. Two people sailed her a long way.
Would I own one?..nope. I’m not going to put my life savings in anything that can flip over and become a total loss. I don’t like most catamarans.
This story had a happy ending. Nobody got hurt.
Clearly some catamaran owners are knowledgeable and DO carry sufficient gear.
What about those sailors still on the learning curve. All the Ken, Barbie and the cat blogs make it look all so simple, all so doable, all sun and fun. You charter a condominium catamaran in the tropics then you go cruising.
So keelhaul the manatees but we think this sad story warrants a closer look.
I need a barge to carry the pizza oven.
Happy trails.
Mark and the blubber butts

[smj]

And I’m not going to put my life savings into anything that can sink and become a total loss, but I still like monohulls. [emoji23]
Obviously these people made a bad choice on when and where to sail, and they’ve paid a stiff price.
I think another factor in your anchor gear is where you plan on cruising. If you plan on cruising the Pacific then maybe 300-400 feet of chain would become more of a necessity. If one plans to cruise the Bahamas then that much chain is an overkill.
We carry 80’ of chain and it’s very rare that we use all the chain. Of course we draw 3’ and don’t mind anchoring in shallow water.

[Simi 60]

Originally Posted by SailFastTri

I think both of you are missing the main issue.

Lack of skills?

Videos always make things look better than they are but it hardly looks like a call in the CG and abandoned ship moment.

[alctel]

This is a 100% 'should not have been there' situation rather than a 'wrong boat' situation.

[smj]

Looks like no fun.

https://fb.watch/fUGc5TPzj9/

[Tetepare]

12’ waves my ass. Long period.

[SailFastTri]

Originally Posted by smj

snip
Obviously these people made a bad choice on when and where to sail, and they’ve paid a stiff price.
snip.

Bingo! That's the key takeaway I was alluding to in my earlier post.
The conditions were well forecast. I'm not sure where they started or what the decision process was, but they severely misjudged when they decided to go there at that time.

[thinwater]

Looks like the boat arrived safe on the beach. A good many boats would have pounded to death in the surf.


I carried all-chain on my 32-foot cat. Statements that a cat cannot carry all-chain are plain silly. They simply did not. They did not rig a bridle. The chafe gear was out of position. They though Oregon Inlet was an escape route (ha). They can't read a weather forecast that was clear a week in advance. Probably not good at beating to weather in strong conditions (that boat should have been able to manage that with short sails and perhaps low engine revs).



Mistakes were made and lessons learned.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

The report states their line snapped. Therein lies the root cause. Line vs chain.

You’re jumping to a root cause of an incident based on a blurb? That’s not a root cause…..we don’t/can’t know the root cause based on the limited information available.

[caradow]

Originally Posted by Manateeman

It’s good to see any vessel with sufficient anchor gear. Perhaps I over simplified, but honestly, just based on what I see in mass produced boats, I feel sorry for most buyers because survivability seems to take a backseat to convenience.
And I’m not exempting monohulls. Boat design I most regret ever having anything to do with building was J boats.
I really like the Chris White foil mast...Atlantic 40 something. First time I saw one I rowed over to talk. Very impressed. Two people sailed her a long way.
Would I own one?..nope. I’m not going to put my life savings in anything that can flip over and become a total loss. I don’t like most catamarans.
This story had a happy ending. Nobody got hurt.
Clearly some catamaran owners are knowledgeable and DO carry sufficient gear.
What about those sailors still on the learning curve. All the Ken, Barbie and the cat blogs make it look all so simple, all so doable, all sun and fun. You charter a condominium catamaran in the tropics then you go cruising.
So keelhaul the manatees but we think this sad story warrants a closer look.
I need a barge to carry the pizza oven.
Happy trails.
Mark and the blubber butts

Well a few things you said bother me and if this gets much attention then maybe fair to start a new thread.
!) what was your regret on building J-Boats?
2) also about putting your life savings on a boat that flips over (catamaran) and is a total loss. At the same time you mention the Chris White boats. Apparently you are not aware of the CW 57 that was flipped by a tornado floated in the Atlantic for a considerable period of time and was salvaged, today the boat is beautiful and sailing by Chris White himself.

[Manateeman]

Catamarans are just not my cup of tea. Yes I was aware. We are from the same home town...Dartmouth MA . He’s got a lot more money I think. You can admire a design or construction and not choose to own it. I’d buy a big aluminum power catamaran for an oceanographic boat. The University of Hawaii has a beautiful one but I don’t have the money to run it.
I think there is a problem when you load up any catamaran. Anchors, beer...whatever. The design was not optimized for carrying weight. Was this a contributing factor?
Flip. Well I’m not certain of the percent recovered but a flipped catamaran does present some unique salvage challenges. Any boat can sink but most take a little time to do so. I wrote a thread about devices to prevent flips but I didn’t see any results that looked foolproof. Something can always happen to your co-captain.
Both of you may be hot shot skippers but one is down and the other needs sleep.
Now you turn the helm over to the engineer. Which design becomes more difficult ...mono or cat...because you are in teaching mode.
J Boats. I liked the 24. At that time TPI was building the Annapolis Navy boats.
Beautiful, strong beyond belief, well engineered. The sea trial was a gale and they did everything perfectly. It’s like a Rolls Royce at sea.
I would not advise anyone to buy any other J boat but a 24. Just my opinion.
I feel sorry for people who buy them. TPI didn’t design nor spec them. Some people think they are great. Fine. Happy trails. Don’t ask me to go sailing on one.
If you don’t like my opinions on boats just put me on the ignore list. Not ever manatee likes pizza.
Happy trails. Mark and his manatee crew.