Over and out

[hzcruiser]

Originally Posted by MLOI

Hmmm, common usage here in Oz at least, differs.

Over - means I have finished talking.
Out - means I have finished listening on this frequency.

So a common conversation might start with a hail on 16, then a request to go up to 72. Chat away, then finish with one person saying 'over', and the other saying 'over and out' - ie im done talking and going back to 16.

Maybe down south this is "common", Mike, not so much here in Sydney, I'd say. And I'm cringing, too, when I hear it, but only really encounter it in (mediocre) movies nowadays.

Why would "out" mean I'm finished listening on this frequency anyway? IMHO, the proper term would be <station name>, clear.



73 de heinz, VK2STM

[wiekeith]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Any double entendres in the children's cartoon Captain Pugwash, are purely conicidental.

I think you need to be a Brit and of a certain age to appreciate that one

[StuM]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Any double entendres in the children's cartoon Captain Pugwash, are purely conicidental.

An urban legend. A couple of newspapers had to pay damages for saying they existed.

[senormechanico]

t

Originally Posted by vonotto

Having used a radio most of my life at work and when I was in the Marines and HATING to tie up the freq I still cringe when someone says "Be advised".

You don't need to tell me to "be advised" just say what you need and I will "be advised".

Off topic, but not too far...


There used to be a master gardener on TV in the PNW who was very good with plants, but not so much with his use of English.
He was probably raised in the USA all his life, but whenever he started a sentence of how to accomplish something, he had a stock bunch of words which were totally unnecessary. Instead of saying "Plant it in a hole 6 inches deep" and water it, it always started like this:


"Is what you do is, is you plant it in a hole 6 inches deep.
And then is what you do is , is you water it."


Nails on a chalkboard !

[DnA9413]

Regarding "Break".

Again, in the US Army, before frequency hopping radios (which randomly hop frequencies ~100 times/second) operators were told to break a message every 10-15 seconds to make it harder for enemy radio direction finders to zero in on your location. Not sure if it every really did any good, but that was the reason we were trained to do it.

Dan

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by DnA9413

Regarding "Break".

Again, in the US Army, before frequency hopping radios (which randomly hop frequencies ~100 times/second) operators were told to break a message every 10-15 seconds to make it harder for enemy radio direction finders to zero in on your location. Not sure if it every really did any good, but that was the reason we were trained to do it.

Dan

I was going to explain the same thing, it's from the old days, as in WWII, you break for 3 to 5 sec to make it difficult for the bad guys to DF you. A couple of stations could DF you, triangulate it, and you have in coming artillery.

Frequency hopping like Singcars and Havequick are anti jam primarily, but do make it harder to DF. They are not secure though whatever that is worth, still need the ky-58 and a fill for that. with modern electronics, you can DF almost instantaneously, I don't know why the USCG still has you do a long count to DF, I'd guess they still have old equipment?

I think the USCG does it out of not knowing any better, cause the few that unkey the Mike don't do so long enough for you to say anything, so it's not to clear the air for emergency comms.

[MLOI]

Originally Posted by hzcruiser

Maybe down south this is "common", Mike, not so much here in Sydney, I'd say.
Why would "out" mean I'm finished listening on this frequency anyway? IMHO, the proper term would be <station name>, clear.

Actually I heard it used more in QLD than anywhere else. Mainly casual chats between cruisers. Just an easy / lazy shorhand I guess.

Everyone knows that victorians are too uptight to not do everything by the book.

Mike

[edmundsteele]

FWIW, British army military radio procedure in the 60’s was that “Wilco” meant, “Will cooperate”. So the difference between “Roger” – phonetic alphabet letter “R” meaning “received” and “Wilco” is that the first translates as, “Yes, I heard you” and the second meant, “I not only heard you but I will cooperate with whatever you requested”.

This is whisky barrel outa cowtown, catchin’ you on the flipside, out.

[StuM]

Originally Posted by edmundsteele

FWIW, British army military radio procedure in the 60’s was that “Wilco” meant, “Will cooperate”. So the difference between “Roger” – phonetic alphabet letter “R” meaning “received” and “Wilco” is that the first translates as, “Yes, I heard you” and the second meant, “I not only heard you but I will cooperate with whatever you requested”.

This is whisky barrel outa cowtown, catchin’ you on the flipside, out.

Actually "Will Comply". More commonly in response to an instruction or order rather a request.

[parkstone bay]

"Over" means "I have finished speaking, and I expect a reply"
"Out" means "I have finished speaking and I do not expect a reply"

Neither proword has anything to do with frequencies or channel-hopping! The question is: "does the sender expect a reply?" If "Yes", he or she finishes with "Over"; if "No" he or she will use "Out".

Simples.

[cyan]

Originally Posted by parkstone bay

"Over" means "I have finished speaking, and I expect a reply"
"Out" means "I have finished speaking and I do not expect a reply"

Neither proword has anything to do with frequencies or channel-hopping! The question is: "does the sender expect a reply?" If "Yes", he or she finishes with "Over"; if "No" he or she will use "Out".

Simples.

Well sure, but this ignores the practical nature of noisy VHF communication. Some single-syllable prowords like "out" can be hard to decipher in bad reception situations. It's all about human error correction. Even two syllables such as "over" are better because you can miss part of one or the other and still understand the message. "over and out" solves the one-syllable vulnerability in such cases, logical or not. It's also better to say "negative" instead of "no" for the same reasons. The whole phoenetic alphabet works pretty well to solve this too. Well, except for Golf and Mike. Those are just dumb, IMO.

[Jim Cate]

Here in Oz, many of the volunteer coastal stations have remote duplex repeaters, often stationed on top of high ground. These repeaters are powered by solar arrays and batteries in most cases. In order to conserve battery power, the transmitters turn off after some period of time... IIRC 90 seconds is often the period. So, when using those facilities, the operators are trained to release the PTT switch once a minute when making long transmissions like wx forecasts or notices to mariners. They don't usually bother with the "break", and don't appear to solicit other traffic during the short silent period... just enough to reset the timer on the remote station.

I doubt if they are worried about being targeted by artillery or drones! But you never know in Queensland...

Jim

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by StuM

Actually "Will Comply". More commonly Always in response to an instruction or order rather a request.

There, I fixed it for ya

Now I will wait for someone to point out a case where it is used as a request!!!!

[Wotname]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Here in Oz, many of the volunteer coastal stations have remote duplex repeaters, often stationed on top of high ground. These repeaters are powered by solar arrays and batteries in most cases. In order to conserve battery power, the transmitters turn off after some period of time... IIRC 90 seconds is often the period. So, when using those facilities, the operators are trained to release the PTT switch once a minute when making long transmissions like wx forecasts or notices to mariners. They don't usually bother with the "break", and don't appear to solicit other traffic during the short silent period... just enough to reset the timer on the remote station.

I doubt if they are worried about being targeted by artillery or drones! But you never know in Queensland...

Jim

Thanks Jim, you have just resolved another one of my life's mysteries. I always wondered why there were all those annoying short unannounced breaks in their long transmissions. I naively put it down to poor technique or them having to scratch their noses or being interrupted by someone entering the room or whatever. Now I know better and will appreciate their good technique when I next hear the mic being rekeyed .

Qld is pretty safe I reckon but maybe not so out Pine Gap way

[El Pinguino]

'And could/would you pick up a slab on your way back to the boat....?'

'Wilco'

Now... the requester said 'could' or 'would'... so it was a request....

If the requester had omitted the 'could you' or the 'would you' it would have been an instruction or order....