Sailing From Jax Florida To Puerto Rico Please Respond. Any Input Appreciated

[elskede]

hello anomaly. i did a search for 'sailing from jacksonville florida to puerto rico.' it's nov 3rd 2012. i retired in october. im gonna spend the next 3 months selling all my boat's, truck/camper, motorcycle, 73 nova, my whole house etc etc....and im retiring in puerto rico...that being said. i've decided im sailing a macgregor 26 down. i'll buy it in florida and take off. i may beef up the rigging and the portlights before i go. other than that....ill set her up with what i've been cruising with for the last bunch of years...my solar setup, genset, windvane...all my gear and go! how long did the trip take you and from what i gather i leave from the north of florida and head due west to hit the trades, then head south...anyone familiar with this???
thank you.
Stephen K
elskede cal 34
anyone's input would be appreciated...
oh yeah, also, i plan to leave in late january feb or march 2013....thank you

[Hudson Force]

Originally Posted by elskede

.................... and from what i gather i leave from the north of florida and head due west to hit the trades, then head south...anyone familiar with this???.................

Hmmm.....due west out of Jacksonville, Florida puts you on Interstate 10 toward Tallahasse. East might be a better option, but that will not be taking you "to hit the trades" those are way south. On board the 26' MacGregor I would do the fair weather island hop route starting from near Ft. Lauderdale and down through the Bahamas. Actually, that's not true. I'd probably fly to Puerto Rico and buy a cheap boat there, but I may be less of an adventurer.

[elskede]

yeah. what a retard!! you figured it out...i was thinking east...been a long day!! that's why i gotta get retired! im working 5am till1 in the morning 5 days a week and then today was a light day....i only worked noon to 9pm or so...do you think i could leave outta the keys and get there quicker? im not sure..that's just what i was picking up from here in seattle. that if i leave south,. like miami, i gotta go north east up quite a ways..then back down? maybe i just leae outta the keys and goto bahamas and work my way over? will this work? also. yes, id like to just goto bahamas and buy a cheap macgregor...however. there arent many there? i do have a question into macgregor in california to ask if they have a dealer down there...but all the searches i did turnee up nothing,..have you been there? have you ever sailed there? thank you.

[Hannah on 'Rita T']

Your plans are about as bad as your vocabulary and your geography. Please excise the pejorative from your future posts. But, to answer your question: 1) don't do it in a McGregor, 2) sail from Lauderdale or Ft. Pierce over to the Bahamas, work south through the Bahamas, through the Turks and Caicos, over tot he Dominican Republic and then across the Mona Passage to Puerto Rico. By then you should have an idea whether you are going north up to the San Juan area or south to Ponce/Salinas or east to Fajardo.

[Hudson Force]

Hannah's route is the more specific instruction that I would follow. Also, I would not choose a Macgregor for this trip, but with that choice, I would recommend patience waiting for the best weather for crossings and a means to keep in communication to receive good accurate reports.

[elskede]

ok, well you wouldn't make the trip anyways...so thank you for your input...macgregor or the queen mary. you wouldn't be there.....
would you?
give me a break...this is not about the boat. it's about the path from florida to puerto rico..like i said. i can and may strengthen it and beef up rigging. obviously it will be a completely different hull than rolls off the lot...please enjoy your evening.
that being said...lets stick to the point.
what is the route you would take. and if i was going straight there...no stopping and messing about anywheres...where from florida would you leave from and what is your waypoints and routes and estimated time it would take to get there?
thank you.
stephen kenneth
this is almost unbearable...i just joined this a few days ago and it's a frikin soap opera with you guys...please dont include me in your soap opera...just stick with the 'sailing'. not the drama. thank you

[Dockhead]

Let's just all calm down, ok?

I see Hannah on Rita misunderstood the OP - he was calling himself a "retard", in a friendly, self-deprecating way, not Hannah or anyone else. Hannah misunderstand, got bent out of shape, the the OP got offended himself.

This is really stupid and unnecessary. The OP asked for help - please give it to him.

I can't help with winds and currents, but there are plenty of guys here who know the area and can. The "trades" are Easterly down there, so you don't want them.

As to the boat - a Mac 26 would not be my first choice, on the other hand you could probably motor the whole way in a couple of days, on a plane, in real calm weather. Any boat will do if you choose the right weather. Main thing is to get the prevailing winds and current right - guys?

[Dockhead]

Here's what I Googled up:

"The debate continues regarding our route to the Caribbean. Our initial inclination was to continue our travels South (mainly ICW) and then head over to the Bahamas from Miami....to be followed by Turks & Caicos, Puerto Rico and then the Virgin Islands - and just take the winds in our face...the "Thorny Path".

"Then there is "Route 65", heading east from Northern Florida until approx. 65 degrees longitude, then head South. Route 66 was not our first choice with just two of us as crew, as this passage would be 7+ days of constant sailing. Our max time off-shore on the Atlantic to date has been 4 days (with 2 crew) and 2.5 days sans crew. Our biggest concern is being caught in unexpected rough weather and being miles & miles from land. And, admittedly, after reading the blog of "Indigo Moon", although I was very much impressed with this sailing couple, I was a little concerned when I read about the rougher aspects of their solo "Route 65" voyage. But then this needed to be weighed against the oncoming roughness of tradewinds if we just head South."

http://www.sailblogs.com/member/luck...xjMsgID=109978


So getting to PR from JAX is not a walk in the park - because of the prevailing E SE winds. According to these guys, either head E way out to sea, then turn S. Or sail down the coast to Miami, then take the "Thorny Path". Sounds pretty tough either way on a small boat.

[elskede]

ok. well said. i apologize that i can't use cap's. i bought a 'chromebook' a few days ago and the caps won't work. this is a weird device.
ok. dockhead. thank you. i am not wanting my newest boat to be the least seaworthy of vessel's i ever owned. however. i can buy a 'new' one. and it sounds neat. and it does what i want; and my 10 and 13 year old want. sail. water ski.
i can strengthen her with stringers. i can put another sheild of lexi over the windows. i can also fill the salon sole up with lead along with water ballast and i can beef up the rigging. all of this i can do in a weekend. i re-rigged my cal 34 last summer. did all the work myself. new toggles, swedge fittings and 5/16th rigging. got it done in a weekend and it only cost me $700.00. I was lucky, i got the guy's to lift the mast for free...that being said. the macgregor has a 'tiny' stick. i have to consider that....now.
you hit it on the money.
i can motor there. add a bigger tank. refuel on the way along with whatever else i can bring and motor the whole way (motorsail) and just go like h$$lll till were there. stop in bahamas for fuel or whatever anyone familiar with a route that would work would recommend...?
i've been trying to do some math....i did talk with a company that runs freight out of jax and they can make it there in 3 days...which surprised me...so i with our weather reports and forecasts being so solid these days.....(for instance) we knew that hurricane was gonna devistate new york and new jersey last week and we knew 'when it was gonna happen.
so....i get the boat ready. i plan my weather window.....and i sprint......where in florida should i sprint from to get to puerto rico.
and i want to say that i do appreciate everyones input.
if i come off as a psycho. im sorry. im in no hurry. i figure it will be 3 months before she's rigged and im ready to go. but im dedicated to getting as much input as possible.
and it will happen.
im doing this on a shoestring compared to what im sure most of you have in the bank.
i don't.
that being said.
even if i did. i'd still buy the macgregor 26. and im in no way trying to act like this is the 'best boat' and im not trying to give it a commercial and id rather not have brought it up......
but dockhead hit the hammer on the nail............. i can motor there rather quickly......then once im there i can relax and sail to my hearts content...(even if i only do 3 knots) and then i can fire up the giant o.b. and tow the boys around.
if it's not feasable tell me.
if it is..tell me...
(this is a neat group with a lot of smart people...a lot smarter than me)
so if im burning fuel and im doing at around 10 knots at a gallon an/hr (boat is not full dispacement, it will plane) with the sails up too to balance her out and get xtra kick....(of course, fuel wise, i have to follow the 2/3rds rule for xtra) can it even be done with your best route of choice?
opinions count to me.
thank you.
thank you very much.
what is the best port to shoot out of in florida...i was figuring i'd run at 15 knots (max spd is 24) i'll run 24/7 till i get there with watches taken (while i sleep in 2hr increments)....ill do a 3 shift......6 on 2 off......(won't be on the standard 24hr schedule) my hands will take 2hrs every 12...giving me breaks here and there......and a thanks again.
stephen kenneth
http://macgregor26.com/index/5_min_1_ea_oct_15_2009.htm

[elskede]

hello: i didn't think this question was going to turn into a situation. i will now sit back and let people give me pointers on the 'best' route that yoouru would recommend. i will listen.
i have one thing that amazes me. this guy 'roger' really did some neat designing on this vessel. see for yourself. study the drawings. see the ballast system. some water. some permanant. then the dagger board. iv'e owned a daggerboard (when i was like 9) on a 'snark" anyone remember them?
anyways...study this...it's actually a really neat concept. and of course, i know this is not the 'best sailor' and it's not the 'best powerboat' but im commited to be on the water and for me...for where im at in my life....i'd love to buy her and have a new boat. easy maintenance and affordable. what's the difference....wow....im doing 5 knots in my fin keel sailboat; or wow!! im doing 3.4 knots in my macgregor.....at least i can have pride in the fact that im out on the water having fun....and when the kids get antsy pants i can tow them around on an innertube or ski's and have fun that way too....then go anchor out....or for crying out loud....i can pull up the rudder and daggger board and drive right up on the beach and kick back for as long as i want....i know that the tide will come back in 6 hours or so.... or maybe not....who cares....she'll be set up and ill be retired....she'll come in at some point!
thank you again for your input.
stephen kenneth
DRAWINGS
http://macgregor26.com/index/gale_2_min.htm

[Hudson Force]

I doubt it you'll find any other routes advised than Dockhead's and Hannah or Rita's. As I said, my choice would be the "Thorny Path" as well described by Bruce Van Zant in his book, "A Gentleman's Guide to Passages South". Dockhead's "Route 65" choice is the long term offshore plan. If you were to select this choice of passing east of the Gulfstream before going south; then, Fernandina, Jacksonville or Saint Augustine would all be good departure ports. Good luck & keep us posted of your adventures.

[elskede]

thank you capt force. if i leave out of the keys....and motors upail... would that work? im thinking of buying a mac26 up here. working on it in my yard...then when everything is sold..tow her to florida w/ my f250 and camper and kinda make a journey of the trip to fl. then sell the truck n camper setup and motorsail to puerto rico..if i did and i went 15 knots...how long would it take with a day layover for stops for fuel?
thank you for your input.
stephen kenneth

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by elskede

ok. well said. i apologize that i can't use cap's. i bought a 'chromebook' a few days ago and the caps won't work. this is a weird device.
ok. dockhead. thank you. i am not wanting my newest boat to be the least seaworthy of vessel's i ever owned. however. i can buy a 'new' one. and it sounds neat. and it does what i want; and my 10 and 13 year old want. sail. water ski.
i can strengthen her with stringers. i can put another sheild of lexi over the windows. i can also fill the salon sole up with lead along with water ballast and i can beef up the rigging. all of this i can do in a weekend. i re-rigged my cal 34 last summer. did all the work myself. new toggles, swedge fittings and 5/16th rigging. got it done in a weekend and it only cost me $700.00. I was lucky, i got the guy's to lift the mast for free...that being said. the macgregor has a 'tiny' stick. i have to consider that....now.
you hit it on the money.
i can motor there. add a bigger tank. refuel on the way along with whatever else i can bring and motor the whole way (motorsail) and just go like h$$lll till were there. stop in bahamas for fuel or whatever anyone familiar with a route that would work would recommend...?
i've been trying to do some math....i did talk with a company that runs freight out of jax and they can make it there in 3 days...which surprised me...so i with our weather reports and forecasts being so solid these days.....(for instance) we knew that hurricane was gonna devistate new york and new jersey last week and we knew 'when it was gonna happen.
so....i get the boat ready. i plan my weather window.....and i sprint......where in florida should i sprint from to get to puerto rico.
and i want to say that i do appreciate everyones input.
if i come off as a psycho. im sorry. im in no hurry. i figure it will be 3 months before she's rigged and im ready to go. but im dedicated to getting as much input as possible.
and it will happen.
im doing this on a shoestring compared to what im sure most of you have in the bank.
i don't.
that being said.
even if i did. i'd still buy the macgregor 26. and im in no way trying to act like this is the 'best boat' and im not trying to give it a commercial and id rather not have brought it up......
but dockhead hit the hammer on the nail............. i can motor there rather quickly......then once im there i can relax and sail to my hearts content...(even if i only do 3 knots) and then i can fire up the giant o.b. and tow the boys around.
if it's not feasable tell me.
if it is..tell me...
(this is a neat group with a lot of smart people...a lot smarter than me)
so if im burning fuel and im doing at around 10 knots at a gallon an/hr (boat is not full dispacement, it will plane) with the sails up too to balance her out and get xtra kick....(of course, fuel wise, i have to follow the 2/3rds rule for xtra) can it even be done with your best route of choice?
opinions count to me.
thank you.
thank you very much.
what is the best port to shoot out of in florida...i was figuring i'd run at 15 knots (max spd is 24) i'll run 24/7 till i get there with watches taken (while i sleep in 2hr increments)....ill do a 3 shift......6 on 2 off......(won't be on the standard 24hr schedule) my hands will take 2hrs every 12...giving me breaks here and there......and a thanks again.
stephen kenneth
http://macgregor26.com/index/5_min_1_ea_oct_15_2009.htm

A couple more tips:

1. A boat like that will be extremely sensitive to weight, so I would not go about changing the design adding lead or stringers. It will be plenty strong enough (boats are always stronger than we are). You will need more tankage but you have to be careful not to overload the boat or unbalance it.

2. You really need to buy the charts and work out a passage plan. You can't just head out and put the throttle forward. On the "thorny path" you will be bashing into head seas whenever there is any wind, and it will be hard, uncomfortable and slow. Keep that in mind. You might get 4 mpg at 15 knots on flat water, but that will quickly become 1 mpg at 5 knots bashing into head seas against the wind. So you will need to break it up into as many shorter hops as you can, and be ready to wait for the best possible weather for every hop. You will need to carefully plan fuel and range for every hop, considering what can happen if the seas get up. Some people take months for that trip even in much bigger and more seaworthy boats.


Rather than all that bashing upwind, if you haven't bought the boat yet, I would really second the suggestion above that you consider flying out and buy the boat there.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by elskede

ok, well you wouldn't make the trip anyways...so thank you for your input...macgregor or the queen mary. you wouldn't be there.....
would you?
give me a break...this is not about the boat. it's about the path from florida to puerto rico..like i said. i can and may strengthen it and beef up rigging. obviously it will be a completely different hull than rolls off the lot...please enjoy your evening.
that being said...lets stick to the point.
what is the route you would take. and if i was going straight there...no stopping and messing about anywheres...where from florida would you leave from and what is your waypoints and routes and estimated time it would take to get there?
thank you.
stephen kenneth
this is almost unbearable...i just joined this a few days ago and it's a frikin soap opera with you guys...please dont include me in your soap opera...just stick with the 'sailing'. not the drama. thank you

Elskede, I admire your grit, but these people are not giving you "soap opera" scenarios. Saying "west" instead of "east" is not a big deal. We all figured out what you meant. But the comments are all spot on. For instance, you won't catch the trades up by Jacksonville, and that does reveal a significant lack of knowledge about the area you want to sail in. You'll have to go well out to sea for that boat in order to get out of the Gulf Stream, introducing new risks. For instance, you would have to cross the Gulf Stream again to get to a safe harbor if you needed it. These really *did* stick to the sailing, and there was no drama involved. You've picked a dangerous route, and you aren't adequately familiar with it, and the advice you got as an alternate approach is a good idea.

Since virtually no one here would try to do what you are trying to do on the boat you have, it is unlikely that anyone has waypoints saved, and in any case you 1) should choose them yourself, and b) have multiple backups in case you break some running rigging or something and have to pull in sooner/sail more slowly/encounter a storm/encounter unexpected headwinds/etc. Not only should you have a "plan B" (and plan "C") for all your waypoints, you should also have a plan B for your entire route.

A lot of the inlets along the east coast, places you might go if you were in trouble, are themselves on the treacherous side and would be risky to try if your boat were compromised in some way, assuming you could safely cross the Gulfstream. Often they aren't very close together, meaning that there may not be any safe harbor you can reach in an emergency. That's one reason to recommend the island-hopping. If the weather turns bad or you have a mechanical problem, you can stay put for a day or two.

By the way, the Gulfstream, which you cannot completely avoid, is a strong southerly current. A boat of your size and type does not want to be in the Gulfstream should a strong northerly wind develop for some reason. You will find yourself in rough water and the waves, pushed from behind and piling up against the wind, may be big and very close together. That's a bad scenario in a small boat even with a lot of experience. (This is also true of your return trip.)

What kind of weather forecasting experience do you have, and what kind of technology will you have with you so you can keep an eye on it? If you island-hop, you will probably be able to gather more complete weather information at each stop.

You're being given very good advice here. At first I was really thinking you should go for it, but I would moderate that view to "Go for it if you're ready to hear the very good advice you're being given here."

Oh yeah -- taking this level of risk you really should make sure you have an EPIRB.

Finally -- it IS partly about the boat. Your choice of boat magnifies the problems you will likely encounter. It is important to be realistic about your boat.

All sailing is risky; we all know that. But you're facing some significant risks that really are avoidable. You would be smart to listen to the thoughtful advice that's been given to you here. I am relatively new to sailing and I can see with absolute clarity that you've been given good advice. Let the sniping roll off your back. Sometimes people just can't resist it.

[Rakuflames]

Originally Posted by elskede

thank you capt force. if i leave out of the keys....and motors upail... would that work? im thinking of buying a mac26 up here. working on it in my yard...then when everything is sold..tow her to florida w/ my f250 and camper and kinda make a journey of the trip to fl. then sell the truck n camper setup and motorsail to puerto rico..if i did and i went 15 knots...how long would it take with a day layover for stops for fuel?
thank you for your input.
stephen kenneth

Do you have dividers? Plot your preferred course out on a chart (I use a grease pencil so I can erase as needed), and ... measure the distances. Be sure to take likely ESE winds into consideration as it undoubtedly will cause some leeway, and consider when you're willing to motor and when you want to sail. Determining the distance is something only you can do. In fact, how far you can motor without running short of fuel may well be a major deciding factor on your route.

Also check your engine specs. Mine are very clear that I should turn the engine off if I'm heeling more than 10 degrees because the oil cannot pump to all parts of the engine on a steeper heel. You can control that by setting your sails "sloppy" so they don't pull with full power but if your engine is anything like mine, you'll have to keep a sharp eye on the clinomoter when motorsailing. Didn't you say you have a MacGregor now? Maybe you could take it out and determine where this is likely to happen on that model of boat. My boat tends to heel a lot (designed that way), and I'm careful about how I set my sails when I motorsail.