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Randyonr3 · 23-05-2010, 07:40

With all the threads lately about saving buy cruising on a small boat and small budget, something has come to mind...
Last evening the wife and I were having a cup of tea in the cockpit as the sun started to drop, loving every minute and we notice a couple on a small boat near by, comming out and heading off.. This morning I ran across them again on the way out and as they passed I asked,
"Headed out for the Day?"
He stopped and said that they were feeling cooped up inside and needed some fresh air..
Now in our (so called) condo by many, we have the room to strech out and relax, work on our hobbies, or do many things that keep us busy and pleased and have never felt cramped for space..
I'm wondering if by having a small boat causeing the cramped feeling, you end up going out for space and spending money that you wouldnt if you were on a larger boat?

**David M** · 23-05-2010, 07:44

Someone on this board said, and I forgot who, "Buy the largest smallest boat you can".

osirissail · 23-05-2010, 07:59

Your Beneteau 42 footer is dead a square in the "average cruising couple" size boat. Any thing smaller and you are stepping over each other and/or moving "piles" of this and that from one part of the boat to another so you can find a place to sit down.
- - Why? Well I am a firm believer that classical espoused human evolution is wrong. We did not evolve from common ancestors with the apes million of years ago - we evolved from some freak mating between a "bear and a pack rat." The bear because all we really care about seems to be a good back rub/scratch. And the pack-rat because we accumulate stuff that we will never use in a decade but cannot bear to part with.
- - Cost of cruising - from the various threads on the subject - seems to be directly related to "size of your boat," Under 30 ft and there is barely room for 2 people let alone any non-relevant stuff. 30-40 feet and you start having boat systems and extraneous stuff adding dramatically to the cost of operation. Not to mention the emergence of huge piles of stuff in the cabin that has to be moved every few hours so you can get to something or do something.
- - 40-45 feet and you hit the happy optimum of enough space to store all that stuff in lockers (or in the V-berth with door closed so you don't see it). And you have cabin space to relax and dine without having to un-fold and fold-up tables and bunks.
- - 45 ft plus and you get into serious storage which fills up rapidly as the extra boat systems require more spare parts and tools for repairs. Cabins become huge so you can start buying stuff from shopping malls and souvenir shops that you really don't need but would "look good" on the big side-wall/bulkhead/extra bathroom.
- - The absolute happiest and efficient and comfortable is that 42 ft boat with a well designed cabin.

**hummingway** · 23-05-2010, 08:08

I like being in a biger boat but I get that cooped feeling when I'm at the dock and particualrily when there are lots of boats around. When the docks are relatively empty and the view opens up I don't. Best feeling is anchored out and then I feel like I have all the space in the world.

MarkJ · 23-05-2010, 08:27

Yeah, I reckon 42 is about spot on average... or is it 'median'? Whats the word statisticians use for the most popular? Anyway 42 is right about there. Between 40 (OK 39 to include us!) and 42 I think most folks are pretty happy with their boat fitting a couple.

I reckon the optimum for me would be a Bene 46 (or 50!!), but thats may-never-happen land.
However much under our size is getting difficult for all those reasons expressed, just that fraction of space where we don't have to be moving to allow the other person to move, or not be face to face with them 24 hours per day.

I do feel for some that read this forum and then think its all bliss on a 30 footer. Its not. The added difficulties are, well, difficult

. But thats not to say they can't be managed.

'Go NOW' is everyone’s adage. But if it was the difference between 1 or 2 years working and 30 to 40 feet, then I would be recommending the extra 2 years as a slave.

Theres lots of equations in the cruising stuff... and so many are unanswerable, but bigger is better and after that work out how to pay for it

My family has always had a philosophy of spending on the big things and skimp[ing on the small things. So we always lived in big houses, but had 1 grain of rice to feed us all. In balance, if the balance is agreed, then its the way to for us (but not everyone).

Mark

DeepFrz · 23-05-2010, 08:59

I have read that in a small boat (30 - 60 ft), all else being equal, the cubic volume doubles for every 5 ft of length. (Of course all else is never equal and I have been on big small boats and small big boats.) But that "rule of thumb" about the 5 ft/double cubic space is a good one to keep in mind. Taking this into consideration then the average 42 ft. will have twice the volume as the average 37 ft.

When I look at boat ads, and I do quite often, I notice that many of the 30 somethings have a lot of things lying about, where as the 40 somethings are much neater as everything is put away in its place. This is especially true in the galley.

However I have sailed on a 50 something that was almost as messy as some of the 30 somethings I see...

however that may have been the fault of the 3 crew members, and not the boat...

David_Old_Jersey · 23-05-2010, 09:08

Sometimes a 27 roomed house is not big enough for 2 people (to eat, sleep and sh#t for sure - but not to avoid strangling each other

)........at other times

a single bed has enough space

Different folks and different pairings / groups need different sized spaces at different times. Onboard and ashore. A bigger boat gives more "me" space that is important to most in varying measures - but IME (far less than many here have onboard) being in any single relatively small (and even a 75 foot boat is not that big compared to "normal" onshore living size standards) environment for an extended period (let alone 24/7/365/forever

) leads to going stir crazy sooner or later...........

Whilst each to their own etc etc

I do puzzle sometimes about the dislike (disdain?) of being ashore declared by some

IMO onshore for a Sailor / voyager is not only the biggest resource, but also provides all the space and adventures one can handle.

So, perhaps the biggest advantage of a smaller boat is............frees up the onshore budget to venture inland on extended forays? (for those who like that sort of thing of course). Therefore no reason that the annual accomadation for the crew of a 30 / 35 foot cruising boat should not include a balcony with view of the Alps during skiing season and a queen sized bed & jacuzzi overlooking a tropical beach. With maid service

. Gonna need a big boat (and a very tall Cat

) to acheive that............or a smaller boat

It's a BIG and interesting world out there

-- would seem a shame to miss out the bits beyond the wet edges

Go Small! Go Now! Go Ashore!

barnakiel · 23-05-2010, 09:24

I do not think small space is much of an issue, IF it is in sync with the people who inhabit it.

So, we will have people feeling cramped in small boats and others feeling lost in the big ones.

Now as far as going out of space is considered - you too will get to the same point in a big boat. It will happen just a bit later, when you will find it more dramatic to part with more junk.

But too small a boat is an issue just as too big one is and all people dreaming of sailing off in a small sail boat - BEWARE. Maybe it is not you. Test ride before you devote.

I like mine though.

b.

**Ex-Calif** · 24-05-2010, 00:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ

Yeah, I reckon 42 is about spot on average... or is it 'median'? Whats the word statisticians use for the most popular? Anyway 42 is right about there. Between 40 (OK 39 to include us!) and 42 I think most folks are pretty happy with their boat fitting a couple.

Smarty pants statistical term of the day = Mode

Average - The sum of data divided by N (number of data points)
Median - The number representing mid-point of responses
Mode - The most frequent response.

As far as boat size goes for a couple? 42 get right comfy. 38 for a cat gets darned palatial.

@randyonr3 - For the couple "going out for some space" - They could have packed a couple of sandwiches, headed to the local mall to enjoy the free aircon and spent the afternoon people watching. All boat systems shut down so no wear and tear. They might have been saving money over you?

Probably not...

**Boracay** · 24-05-2010, 02:12

I did a quick survey of Cruisers, Cruiser racers and Pilothouse yachts, 28 to 65, on Yachtworld and the modal length came to 13m, 42.6'.

The modal price, however, came to $US 237,500.

My research method is highly suspect, however.

David_Old_Jersey · 24-05-2010, 02:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boracay

The modal price, however, came to $US 237,500.

No wonder that living budget is a keen subject

Pelagic · 24-05-2010, 02:54

The length of a boat is probably the least thing I look at, since design issues start from the inside out.

Your sailing philosophy, criteria and itinerary, will dictate whether speed out-trumps comfort and how much you expect to collect along the way

On an attractive mono hull:

I first look at displacement to get a sense of her “bale capacity”, because I will always want the option to add to her cargo, so there should be additional reserves in space

Second is the ergonomics, because I live there and I enjoy places for privacy, places for socializing and a comfortable toilet.

Then systems and execution because I like things to work well as a seagoing vessel.

Like any home, I would suggest you buy the biggest and best built boat you can afford and manage, without becoming a slave to the boat.

As others say, it is not the destination, but the voyage that counts and that part is very personal to every boat owner.