The Frugal (AKA poor) Sailor

[JPA Cate]

I've also heard it said, "You can marry more money in 5 minutes than you can earn in two lifetimes."

--and just to keep the record straight, this advice was proffered to: a male!

Maybe this thread is turning into a "frugal is as frugal does" thread.

[weavis]

The concept of the thread has never changed. As with all things chat board, people interpret and a thread drift occurs. Its interesting how the intent of the thread is to encourage boating for those of us more financially challenged, and yet it seems even the thread title has to be examined and claimed by more affluent persona as an attribute of themselves. It is actually hard to write a descriptive thread title to convey the fullness of the intent of the thread! The tagline of the thread, unwritten of course, should read, "poor people only"... Basically if you want something and can afford to write a cheque for it, then the difficulties faced by lesser pockets is not yours.

In my mind, there was this idea of wanting to show how a person could get on the water with a low cost boat, a lot of hard work and being frugal in their purchases by shopping around or going second hand instead of new. I really object to the view that a person cannot go sailing without this or that or 3 EPIRBS or a Defib machine or a water maker etc... These are all things to aspire to as life and finances progress, or maybe even NEVER to own these things but still do coastal sailing around the locale where you live safely and enjoyably.

I love reading about the travels of cheaper smaller boats. A couple in their middle age took their Westerly Centaur from the UK and sailed over to Greece and back safely and cheaply! I have friends who sailed their Westerlys over to the USA from the UK! Even our own boatman61 sailed long distances in cheap boats and took himself to Portugal in a small boat to live. I believe ANYTHING can be achieved with judicious purchasing and careful and safe managements of funds and supplies.

A lesson learned.

In the UK of late that less and less cruiser type boats in the sub 10K bracket are being advertised. Might be the time of year...

Some of the best fun ever had on a 24 foot wood Eventide sailing Welsh waters. Hugely sturdy and always ready to go.

Never let anything including money stand in the way of achieving your goals.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqW4h7tmZ5c

[brownoarsman]

Weavis-are you saying less boats are for sale now? I was kind of thinking on picking up one of those small, cheap English cats you post occasionally for a summer...

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by weavis

. . . I really object to the view that a person cannot go sailing without this or that or 3 EPIRBS or a Defib machine or a water maker etc... These are all things to aspire to as life and finances progress, or maybe even NEVER to own these things but still do coastal sailing around the locale where you live safely and enjoyably.

. . . .

Never let anything including money stand in the way of achieving your goals.

In this, cruising is quite like the rest of life. It's possible on a very wide array of different budgets, and doing it on a bigger budget is not always better, even if a bigger budget does open up more choices.

There are tons of good boats for sale in the U.K. for 20k, 10k, and even less. That probably wasn't the case in previous eras, but a lot of small, good, simple cruising boats were built in the UK '70's and '80's when the sport achieved mass appeal, and you can now buy and use them for a song.

If these boats are less suitable (I didn't say UNsuitable) for long-distance cruising, than your average newish 40' boat today, they are MORE suitable for some of the most delightful cruising you can do, which is just knocking around the estuaries and beautiful coastal regions of Atlantic Europe. A bit less comfortable, but comfort is not the whole purpose of life, and this is all relative anyway.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by weavis

The concept of the thread has never changed. As with all things chat board, people interpret and a thread drift occurs. Its interesting how the intent of the thread is to encourage boating for those of us more financially challenged, and yet it seems even the thread title has to be examined and claimed by more affluent persona as an attribute of themselves. It is actually hard to write a descriptive thread title to convey the fullness of the intent of the thread! The tagline of the thread, unwritten of course, should read, "poor people only"... Basically if you want something and can afford to write a cheque for it, then the difficulties faced by lesser pockets is not yours.

In my mind, there was this idea of wanting to show how a person could get on the water with a low cost boat, a lot of hard work and being frugal in their purchases by shopping around or going second hand instead of new. I really object to the view that a person cannot go sailing without this or that or 3 EPIRBS or a Defib machine or a water maker etc... These are all things to aspire to as life and finances progress, or maybe even NEVER to own these things but still do coastal sailing around the locale where you live safely and enjoyably.

So what you're suggesting is that registered nurse Ken and his registered nurse wife who began cruising on a 19ft O'Day, should just butt out of the conversation and leave the "financially challenged" to figure things out for themselves? Fine, but I do find it odd that so many seem to think two working nurses are now the new "rich." I guess times have changed, so I'll take our defib machine, exit the conversation and allow the frugal sailors on CF to "eat cake."

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

So what you're suggesting is that registered nurse Ken and his registered nurse wife who began cruising on a 19ft O'Day, should just butt out of the conversation and leave the "financially challenged" to figure things out for themselves? . . .

Certainly no one suggested that!

Two very good approaches to solving the financial side of cruising have been shown here -- work hard, save, be frugal, invest well, and have more. Or be happy with less. Both of these approaches work well (within certain limits of course), in cruising as in the rest of life.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

So what you're suggesting is that registered nurse Ken and his registered nurse wife who began cruising on a 19ft O'Day, should just butt out of the conversation and leave the "financially challenged" to figure things out for themselves? Fine, but I do find it odd that so many seem to think two working nurses are now the new "rich." I guess times have changed, so I'll take our defib machine, exit the conversation and allow the frugal sailors on CF to "eat cake."

Gosh Ken.
I never even considered what you commented on. A touch oversensitive methinks? DO you consider yourself rich? I have never commented on anything you have written. I have merely restated the aim of this thread.

My point regarding EPIRBS and fibs was based on the many threads where CFers consider them necessary to go sailing.......

Go take a coffee or something...

[sailorboy1]

At anchorage the other day I met a retired nurse (nurses appear to be everywhere). She was on her way from Vermont to Florida alone because her husband wouldn't come. She was on an old Bristol 27 with no refrigeration or autopilot. She had been stuck at the anchorage like us for 3 days waiting for a gale to end and the weather to change to move on. Her plans for the next stop was a marina slip so she could get take a shower (I offered that she could come over and take a show on on boat).

She was very frugal in her boat choice. But in talking with her I could tell she had been staying in a lot of slips for the shower. Meanwhile on my 40 range boat we never have stayed in a slip.

The lesson here to me is that a frugal boat doesn't mean much if it can not support a comfortable life style. All she traded was money savings on her boat in order to give it to marinas.

BTW - she had AIS and I don't and made it through NYC without any problem. Funny how AIS has been needed even to the frugal people.

[weavis]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

At anchorage the other day I met a retired nurse (nurses appear to be everywhere). She was on her way from Vermont to Florida alone because her husband wouldn't come. She was on an old Bristol 27 with no refrigeration or autopilot. She had been stuck at the anchorage like us for 3 days waiting for a gale to end and the weather to change to move on. Her plans for the next stop was a marina slip so she could get take a shower (I offered that she could come over and take a show on on boat).

She was very frugal in her boat choice. But in talking with her I could tell she had been staying in a lot of slips for the shower. Meanwhile on my 40 range boat we never have stayed in a slip.

The lesson here to me is that a frugal boat doesn't mean much if it can not support a comfortable life style. All she traded was money savings on her boat in order to give it to marinas.

BTW - she had AIS and I don't and made it through NYC without any problem. Funny how AIS has been needed even to the frugal people.

Herin lies the mistake made. Frugal means a careful choice, perhaps not new or the best but one within the budget and fit for the purpose. It does not mean to do without unless unnecessary.

I would frugally purchase a shower....

[boatman61]

Frugality is a mindset.. simple as that.
A frugal person will look at what he wants and tailor to the minimal needed to achieve his/her needs..
Where I would be happy with a well organised bedsit on land.. someone else may consider the minimum is at least a one bed apartment.. and someone else would not consider anything less than a 3 bed house.. and that's scraping the barrel..
To me folks who say it cannot be done on less than 40ft.. and these days it seems its becoming 50ft are merely transferring shorebased ego's to the sea.
They'll have been the house with more beds than needed and five rooms on the ground floor.. the latest model car/s every year etc.
Its the cycle of Western life these days.. grab it all you may be dead tomorrow.
It can be seen on this forum for example.. look at the Avatars.. not many folks with boats under 40ft.. or ambitions for one.. 'Laser but looking for 40ft+'
Personally I don't care what a person has.. okay.. I may occasionally tweak Sailorboy's or Keno's tail for a giggle but would I want their Hunter or Oyster.. not in a year of Sundays..
Currently I have a boat that's 39ft LOA.. I hate it.. if I could get rid of it tomorrow I'd do it in a heartbeat and move back down to 30ft or less.
Different folks.. Different strokes..
I can do as much voyaging or more in a 22ft boat as they can in their boat.. another mindset..

[Mike OReilly]

Just got our boat tucked away for the coming Canadian winter. We're in an inexpensive, DIY, marina with minimal services and minimal costs. Almost all our worldly possessions now fit on our boat (LOA: 36-foot-9-inchs, identical to Spray btw ).

We are now off to visit friends, and then to house-sit for the winter. Cost (outside of food and travel): $100/month. So as weavis keeps saying, this life is possible for just about anyone. You don't need a big investment portfolio, big income or even a big pension.

Boaty said it perfectly: "A frugal person will look at what he wants and tailor to the minimal needed to achieve his/her needs.." I agree .

Wants vs needs -- this is the essence of living a frugal life. Frugality is not about deprivation or being miserly. It's not about chasing the cheapest price, it's about maximizing value. Mainly, it is about knowing who you are, and what you need.

[sailorchic34]

Originally Posted by weavis

Herin lies the mistake made. Frugal means a careful choice, perhaps not new or the best but one within the budget and fit for the purpose. It does not mean to do without unless unnecessary.

I would frugally purchase a shower....

I would not call it a mistake. Frugal means different things to different people...

Myself I use a solar shower on deck. Sometimes heating the water of the stove first. I do go to a marina after 2 weeks or so. Yes for a shower, but also to dump trash, wash cloths and re provision. Mind you I don't have a $$300-$4000 water maker or a $2000 dinghy, so spending $40-$60 a month for marina's is not a hardship. Of course the marina's on the west coast are lost less generally then east coast marina's.

Plus that unlimited hot water thingy of the marina shower is pretty nice if you have longer hair. Life's little luxuries....Can't really compare that to the typical 6 gallon hot water heater on a boat.

[sailorchic34]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Currently I have a boat that's 39ft LOA.. I hate it.. if I could get rid of it tomorrow I'd do it in a heartbeat and move back down to 30ft or less.

I love the size of my little 34' islander. I say little as beam is only 10 feet. It's a cozy little place I call home. I would not want a huge boat with all those systems. But then others like a Bigger boat, and there is not a thing wrong with that either. It's not a one size fits all world.

I'm glad to see Don now living his dream and am glad Ken enjoys the EU so much. It's all good.

[topmast]

Walked about for a couple of years (Input $1000 + some odd job earnings on the road) Crewed a lot and came home to build a boat so as continue a chosen lifestyle .Kept sort of a running tally and ended up with 22 T gaff ketch for about 12 grand of repurposed/dumpster/ masterful shopping. Having sailed in the med/caribe decided this coast was choicer.Enjoyed 40 yrs cruising and foraging north of Flattery and beachfront winters in Thailand. Never broke, always something ,hobby was fixandmake either for self gratification or your $. Tourists dropped 100,000 a summer on deck .IF I had to do it all over, I'd have bought even more residential rentals.and avoided the heart failure. Thane is still looking good in Victoria under new lucky owners. (see Three Hour Sail .captain and crew , home. on the google. Frugal?? think I never thought about it, it was a game.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by topmast

Frugal?? think I never thought about it, it was a game.

That's about right..