Tiller and neck pain

[fretbrner]

Hey,

I am looking at a 32' with a tiller.

I have used tillers for most of my time on a boat but it was only on small day sailors and I haven't sailed for more than a few hours at a time when out.

My goal with this boat is to do extended cruises. I was wondering if anyone does extended cruising with a tiller equipped cruiser(Seems most serious cruise boats have wheel steering). Do you experience any neck or back pains that you may not get with a wheel after a few days or even weeks at sea?

I can get a wheel version of the same boat but they go for more for some reason and I like the idea of having more space in cockpit when at anchor and tiller pilots are simpler (and cheaper), among the other pro's of the tiller. But would rather spend a few more grand for the same boat with wheel if its not going to leave me crippled after a jaunt to the barrier reef, Lord Howe island or New Caladonia.

Anyone develop neck problems due to the years of sailing their tiller equipped vessel?

Cheers

[Pete7]

Surely for extended offshore passages you will be using a good quality autopilot or wind vane therefore not hand steering for any length of time. Also fit a tiller extension and sit out a bit.

Pete

[valhalla360]

For offshore, you likely will use the autopilot the vast majority of the time with either system.

It's if you do something like run the ICW that you may be at the tiller for hours at a time and that could be multiple days in a row. Yes, constantly craning your neck around 90 degrees will likely leave it sore.

Define "serious cruising" for us. We've never really done the offshore thing but we've ran thousands of miles while full time cruising. does that make us "serious". (not being sarcastic just needing clarification on the question)

[Tillsbury]

Invest in a good quality tiller extension and sit comfortably somewhere else.

As stated above, you'll be on autopilot most of the time for long passages.

[fretbrner]

Originally Posted by valhalla360

For offshore, you likely will use the autopilot the vast majority of the time with either system.

It's if you do something like run the ICW that you may be at the tiller for hours at a time and that could be multiple days in a row. Yes, constantly craning your neck around 90 degrees will likely leave it sore.

Define "serious cruising" for us. We've never really done the offshore thing but we've ran thousands of miles while full time cruising. does that make us "serious". (not being sarcastic just needing clarification on the question)

Sorry, I guess that came out wrong about serious cruising. I should have said blue water cruising, as I would expect someone who is fulltime would be considered serious. I meant where you could go a week or more before you see any land, from what I am told it can take around 4 to 5 days to get from Sydney to Lord Howe Island and nothing but the ocean blue in between.

Sadly, I don't plan to sail the ICW anytime soon, as I am on the east coast of Australia and not the US.

I would have autopilot and hopefully a windvane to take up much of the steering duties, but as mentioned, might be in a situation where I would have to rely on manual steering for hours.

[valhalla360]

Originally Posted by fretbrner

Sorry, I guess that came out wrong about serious cruising. I should have said blue water cruising, as I would expect someone who is fulltime would be considered serious. I meant where you could go a week or more before you see any land, from what I am told it can take around 4 to 5 days to get from Sydney to Lord Howe Island and nothing but the ocean blue in between.

Sadly, I don't plan to sail the ICW anytime soon, as I am on the east coast of Australia and not the US.

I would have autopilot and hopefully a windvane to take up much of the steering duties, but as mentioned, might be in a situation where I would have to rely on manual steering for hours.

As mentioned, multi-day offshore trips almost no one manually steers.

[TrentePieds]

If you are in a cruising boat, you should be able to find a sail trim that will generate just the slightest weather helm during periods of actually being on the helm. Most of the time your vane or AP will permit you to wander about the boat.

The strength required to helm is very little and you do not sit in a cramped position while you are doing it, so I think your apprehension is groundless.

TrentePieds

[KadeyKrogen38]

Tillers are great. They provide a much better feel for the boats trim. If trimmed correctly there will be little pressure at the tiller.

As well as already said you would most likely be on autopilotvorvwind vane.

[Lake-Effect]

I really like the tiller, but ours is a small boat. I think I would prefer a tiller up to about a 30 ft or so, but I've also had no issues with a wheel on boats 30 ft and above.


As already mentioned, there should be an extension on the tiller so that you can sit forward and lean back against the seat. or even turn to face forward with your legs straight out.


We also have a tiller lock/clamp (aka a "Tiller-tamer") that allows you to lock the tiller position. If the sails are balanced and the tiller's locked, you can leave it momentarily to tweak a sail, grab a bevvy, stretch, etc.

[MJH]

Originally Posted by fretbrner

Hey,

I am looking at a 32' with a tiller.

I have used tillers for most of my time on a boat but it was only on small day sailors and I haven't sailed for more than a few hours at a time when out.

My goal with this boat is to do extended cruises. I was wondering if anyone does extended cruising with a tiller equipped cruiser(Seems most serious cruise boats have wheel steering). Do you experience any neck or back pains that you may not get with a wheel after a few days or even weeks at sea?

I can get a wheel version of the same boat but they go for more for some reason and I like the idea of having more space in cockpit when at anchor and tiller pilots are simpler (and cheaper), among the other pro's of the tiller. But would rather spend a few more grand for the same boat with wheel if its not going to leave me crippled after a jaunt to the barrier reef, Lord Howe island or New Caladonia.

Anyone develop neck problems due to the years of sailing their tiller equipped vessel?

Cheers

From my experience you can't move a wheel but you can lift the tiller up actually giving you even more room in the cockpit than a wheel, usually while at anchor or at the dock. I have also heard that windvanes are easier to install with tillers than a wheel. The only negative, besides the current trend for not just wheels but duel wheels, is while sailing with a tiller in a small cockpit with other seated crew aboard. I had a tiller on my San Juan 28 and loved it. Never got those pains of which you speak even when solo going to Alaska or circumnavigating Victoria Island.

~ ~ _/) ~ ~ MJH

[boatman61]

You dont have to steer with a tiller just hanging on for hours in one position, switch sides, stand with tiller between legs.. My favourite when tacking as I can handle the jib sheets while the main looks after itself.
Also standing relieves numb bum and exercises the legs.
Some rig a forwards facing seat aft of the tiller and steer with their feet.. one guy I knew had a settee rigged like, that talk about helming on comfort..
Wheel steering hours on end is no fun either having done a couple of thousand miles like that.. it hurts.

[Pegu Club]

Originally Posted by Pete7

Surely for extended offshore passages you will be using a good quality autopilot or wind vane therefore not hand steering for any length of time. Also fit a tiller extension and sit out a bit.

Pete

This ^^^
Being at the wheel for long periods has its own aches and pains as well.

Fair winds,

[Halien]

My current boat has a wheel. After three years of getting used to it, I still prefer a tiller. Learn to love the tiller for your blue water cruising plans. You'll rarely use it on a passage. Various sheet-to-tiller self steering arrangements work well if your boat is balanced. Windvanes work well with tillers. Small tillerpilots attached to a windvane work well with tillers. The one thing that is sure to fail is a tillerpilot directly driving the tiller. I've had a few fail offshore. When you open one up and see how lightly the plastic parts and gears are built, you'll think twice about relying on it. My boat has a stout below deck autopilot for short trips, an Aries lift-up vane for long passages, and spare tiller pilots to use with the vane gear if the below deck pilot craps out. I can also rig my vane to my emergency tiller. I dislike the wheel, but I'm not going to convert to a tiller. As you may have guessed, I really dislike steering; the vane and autopilots do a better job anyway.

[roverhi]

Find a tiller way more comfortable for long term usage than a wheel. Once did 72 hours straight, mostly at hull speed on a reach, on 400 mile coastal passage with only head breaks. That was on a Westsail which isn't noted for a light helm or lack of weather helm. Steering with a tiller you can use more muscle groups to steer which means less fatigue.

As others have said, you spend little time actually driving on a well set up cruising boat. Last long passage was to Hawaii with a WindPilot Pacific Plus auxiliary rudder vane and a wheel pilot. Only steered by hand to get into a slip at the end. Have since pulled the wheel on that 35' boat and installed a tiller.

One cold wet passage on a boat with a wheel was enough to permanently turn me off on them. Every time my hand slipped on the cold wet stainless I'd bang my cold fingers. Soon ran out of four letter words to express my love for the device. Think the prevalence of wheels is a Yuppie thing, too many people want to play Captain Blye ordering their minions about from the poop deck while they drive. After all, a BMW has a wheel. Tillers were common on boats up to 40', there's a Cal 40 just down from me, and larger till the boomers could afford larger boats. Dumbest thing is a wheel on a boat under 30'.

A tiller has virtually nothing that can go wrong. A piece of 2x4 can substitute for a broken tiller so no custom emergency tiller and access necessary. A properly installed one will not have a shaft seal to go bad. With Pendulum Servo Self Steering, a tiller works way better without the drag and inertia inherent with a wheel snd more range of steering input. Tiller pilots work well under power and some use them for sailing. In conjunction with a self steering vane, a tiller pilot makes for very low drain compass steering.

[coastalexplorer]

I have always thought that tiller steering was used for racing because it makes going about for windward sailing faster and more efficient? typical length over five Feet.