Turning old Racer into Cruiser

[joejoeshoeshoe]

Hello all,

I have an interest in modifying the attached racing boat into a cruiser.

I understand threats on this very subject exist, but this (to be) cruiser would be used for 1-2 night trips, not overnight 30 day/night voyages.

Description of the boat as is:

-Tech Joubert Nouvelle Custom 33, Custom made Carbon Fiber racing sailboat, by Hi-Tech Boats (John Heinemann)

Nomex core and all carbon Fiber construction.
PHRF racing boat with a rating of around 104.
Forte Carbon fiber mast and only used 3 or four seasons

Boat stored inside when not used.

All halyards are high. Tech, Spectra or equivalent. Titanium shackles, Fractional rig, Spinnaker pole, Aluminum boom,Tiller steering, Lewmar 44’s three speed winches, Lewmar 40 ‘s (3) on cabin top ,

Harken traveler and blocks with wind war sheeting car.

Nomex Honeycomb core with no bales core, keel stepped lead fin keel.

Large forward hatch, two pipe berths.

Tacktick wireless race master compass and wind shift indicator, speed and depth. Includes custom built trailer.
[B][/B]
LOA- 33 feet, max draft 6 feet, approx 6000 lb displacement.

My goals:

Install put a 8HP outboard engine on the sloped transom for getting in and out of the harbor. Then, use the sail for the main power source. I understand a diesel inboard is more preferred and probably
Better, but I am trying to do this on a budget

Restoring Galley/V Berth/Lower Deck:

I would love to be able to sleep on the boat. As you can see, the inside is TOTALLY gutted, but at one point I believe there was a small Galley, head, etc. Previous owner tried to make the boat lighter and faster by stripping it. Where would I begin with this restoration? Blueprints? Does someone have a boat that has a finished lower deck that I could trust to model it after?

Looking for suggestions for material for floor, as well as walls.

Thanks to everyone who provided feedback, as this forum seems to be a world of knowledges.

[sailorboy1]

well you need a small engine, a place to sleep, a place to poop, and a place to store food

for 1-2 days you COULD sleep in cockpit, poop in a bucket, and use a cooler with ice

[Sparx]

Keep it simple to start. Couple hammocks to sleep in. A composting head. A few water jugs with a pump . A propane camping stove and a box of cooking tools. An ice chest or Iceco electric cooler. A couple of folding chairs or bean bages to sit in.

After some nights in the boat you will know what further furnishings are to your taste

[HankOnthewater]

Of course, one can make any boat into a cruising boat, and as was said above, a few overnight trips can be done without much alterations or additions.

However most racing boats will not be good cruising boats, for a couple of reasons:
- the different between racing and cruising is often "comfort" , and when bringing all these things on board, the boat will float a lot lower on its intended waterline, become a more sluggish boat
- racing boats are generally sailed by a largish group of tough sailors, active and fit, trimming the sails and stuff nearly non-stop. Cruising sailors travel generally short handed, and may find sailing a racing boat that way difficult or just too demanding. To make some racing boats suitable for cruising, lot of sail/rig items need to be changed, and that in itself might not be possible.
- Making radical changes, one will likely end up having a bad cruising boat that now also a bad racing boat.

Despite the above reasons not to go ahead, I would say, go for it, and if you do not spend too much money, or make too radical changes, you won't lose too much money, and you will gain an enormous amount of experience and skills.

But before you start, sail that boat (as it is now) on your own or with your intended company, and see if you can handle that fairly easy. If so... proceed

[JPA Cate]

Ugh, outboard motor! It should work okay. Difficult to install on that sloping transom, could get drowned in a following sea, but might work out okay...

There's nothing wrong with re-upping the pipe berths for sleeping, can add foam to them. We also knew some folks who put their bed on the cabin sole. You'd have to install some floors for that, but it is a solution offering more privacy and more space for other activities than just the pipe berths.

You are going to also want convenient sail storage, so I'd consider storing the sails under the pipe berths, or on them when at sea and not sleeping. Straps to keep them in place. Or if you go bed on cabin sole, then you can even tack when the off watch is asleep without waking them first, and leave the sails in a jumble on the floor of the forepeak. I'd also consider having wet gear stowage up there, so maybe you need to make a sump to collect the water and grunge to pump out.

toilet even a portapotty, best amidships, or as close as possible, though some people like to have them near the companionway. Might want to consider a dessicating toilet, often called composting.

I'd keep the galley as simple and easy to use as possible, a simple two burner cooktop, with an oven/broiler, propane stove with thermocouples (possibly from an RV source, but the thermocouples are important safety features.) Propane lockers need to be vented to outside the boat, as it is heavier than air. [Heavier than air = hard to get out of boat if there were a leak, with a high risk of explosion from a spark.]

Honestly, I think if only two are going to sail the boat, one of your larger challenges is to make the boat easily single-handed, this means you'll want self-tailing primaries within reach of the tiller or wheel, for starters.

And, you're probably going to want some kind of dinghy for getting ashore; so you want to look at where and how you will keep that. Maybe go look at a bunch of 30 footers, there's not too much difference in layouts between 30 and 33 ft. See what you prefer.

Fwiw, I think you need some seating on both sides, too, a butt belt for the galley, to keep the cook from being thrown around. Galley needs to have space to store trays to eat off, as well as cooking gear and food. Some people use ice chests, for food storage, as one would if car camping. (Availability of ice varies with where you go. It's hard to find big solid ice blocks these days.)

Everything you do to the boat will slow it down. Your boat was maximised to go fast. Are you sure you want to do this??? In a way, it's a lot of money, time and effort to make it unfit for purpose.


Ann

[Uricanejack]

My boat was a little different. It was a small cruiser stripped out and used as a club racer.
It was a C&C 24. No interior. Small honda 9hp outboard.
I bought it cheep.
2 sheets of 3/8 Ply a skill saw. a cooler. a small camping stove(bad idea it nearly blew us up) A couple of camping foamy's a couple of sleeping bags and we were all set up for lots of weekends sailing around the San Juans and SGI.

My kids and i had a lot of fun with it. Did the round SSI race. Came last. We had fun.

If you keep it simple and cheep, just put enough into it, for basic needs. You will enjoy sailing it and going for short trips.
When you are done it will be easy to strip it again and sell as an older race boat. It will still be what it was.

Go for it, If its an affordable option to go sailing now.

[psk125]

The writeup and pictures of the boat make it seem like any previous galley and head consisted of a self-contained gas-canister cookstove from REI and a porta-potti lashed to the mast. Putting in a cabin sole and privacy bulkheads or curtains for the head is possible, but what does that do to headroom and being able to move around below? A motor on the end of the transom is going to do strange things to the balance of the boat and as others have suggested may not work well - alternately cavitating on the tops of waves or getting submerged in the troughs. If you will need a dinghy anyway, perhaps use it to tow the mothership instead of messing it up with something that will be problematic.It is possible to take weekend cruises in just about any boat. People do it in Lightnings, J/24's, and lots of other craft. Spending a lot of money to alter this design to those ends may not be worth it. Sparx has some good suggestions above to get started with minimal outlay of cash or effort.

[tanngrisnir]

Originally Posted by joejoeshoeshoe

I have an interest in modifying the attached racing boat into a cruiser.
...

As you can see, the inside is TOTALLY gutted, but at one point I believe there was a small Galley, head, etc. Previous owner tried to make the boat lighter and faster by stripping it. Where would I begin with this restoration? Blueprints? Does someone have a boat that has a finished lower deck that I could trust to model it after?
.

I assume you are looking at this one

https://www.histoiredeshalfs.com/Tro...art/Menace.htm


It was not totally gutted, that's how it was built. building an interior is not restoration.

Note in your interior photo, there is the engine bed in the middle of the boat, common design for the time to keep the weight centralized. Any interior you add is going to make it sail worse than it does today.

Honestly, cheap former exotic racers look like a great buy and a way to get into sailing but they are just a world of pain. A couple of things to consider:

• Built to sail with 7 people, it's going to be tender without that much weight on the rail, unmanageable short handed even in the design wind (i.e 10knts), there is probably not even reef set up in the sail.
• Looks like running backstays, these need a dedicated person to keep the stick in the boat. If you drop the rig, your going to have to dispose of the boat, you would be up for big $$ to replace it even with secondhand alu.
• Difficult to sail with high aspect foils, they punish you for trying to pinch, for not easing when bearing away and 100 other different ways.
• The draft is going to restrict where you are going to be able to go, makes your boat camping that little bit more cumbersome.

I've been down this path, using old exotic boats for recreation and the reason they are available so cheaply is they are no longer competitive as racing boats but they are too complex to use for recreation.

Please, think about how much of a budget you want to spend and spend it all on a boat suitable for purpose rather than this and associated "repairs". You will be sailing sooner and have a better time on the water.

Good luck!

[gulfislandfred]

It could be a great adventure
Go Simple! as others advise, at least until you have a season of experience on the boat.
I think an outboard will work for you. Not too hard to mount on that sloped transom with a properly built pad. You'll need electric start and power tilt.
Yes, it will cavitate in some sea conditions.



You will want an autopilot and a roller furling Genoa.


I would start with a portable butane stove with disposable canisters. No cooking underweigh, and good rails to keep it from slipping around at anchor.
Or a modern Origo type alcohol stove. They work much better than the old Princess type.

Plumbing in a proper Propane system is not for me. Others may differ.


Make as big a bunk as you can, with simple plywood and 2x2s. Make it high enough for storage under.



The boat is designed for quite a bit of crew weight. I think you'll be fine with the extra weight of a simple interior.


Sail handling: A big, roller furling genoa with make that boat fly, with nothing else up. You can leave the running backstays tight with just the genny up.

I had an old Seabird Yawl, gaff rigged, with running backstays (Most gaffers have running backs) I had no problem single handed. Just had to keep the main sheeted in until one side was loosed and the other tightened.

Great adventure! Go cheap and simple!

[Ryan]

Will you be short-handed or alone? Managing running backstays and a foil jib would be tough. The jib can be converted to hanks, but this doesn't look like a good basis for a cruiser or shorthanded boat.
Horses for courses.

[MerMike]

I have an 80's 3/4 ton racer that I cruise in. Great fun to sail, but it's sensitive to weight.

Tankage and stowage can be as important as sailing ability when cruising.

Does it have a windlass? Do you want/need one? What would it take to add one?

Outboard on the stern can be done, but it's got its drawbacks.

Seriously, if you want to cruise, buy a cruiser.

[MartinF]

If you want to build boats buy a project; if you want to cruise buy a cruising boat.
Also, you don't give any details of what you mean by cruising; if you want to blast across the bay with four of your college buddies, great; if you want gentle days for you and your wife - no. She would be over-canvassed and scary much of the time.
And you won't save money. That 33 feet of empty uninhabited hull will cost you every day it sits in a marina.

Good luck,
M

[MartinF]

Plus, in poor conditions you won't even be able to crawl out on to the counter to start your outboard - that is if you ever mange to mount one on that acute edge!

[gulfislandfred]

To all the folks who say she will be over canvassed, I repeat:
Big roller furling Genny. Single handed you can roll it in or out to suit conditions.


I have mostly sailed on Genny alone for ver 50 years. You won't go as high to wind as you will with the main up, but you can definitely go to windward.
If you're pointing high, and want the main, you will likely have the boom sheeted in tight enough to keep both backstays tight.


Plenty of people race cruising boats. Lot's of people cruise race boats.


That said, a modern (less than 20 years old) cruiser that's ready to go will sail quite well, and already have the creature comforts.
There's a joy in doing things outside the mainstream.
There's a price, as well.


Do what pleases you.
Enjoy!

[Down East]

I had a 33’ ex race boat and it was really fun, but I would only do this if you have experience with race boats and like the performance.
As others have said - keep it simple.
Here are a few things I’d say are important to look at…
Make sure the draft is okay for your area.
Running back stay’s/check stays - if the boat is a head mast rig, they’re check stays, which means they aid in sail shape, they aren’t needed to keep the rig from falling down - this is far better than running backs, which is a PIA (think about jibing in heavy air).
Make sure the boom has reefing lines or the ability to add (my boat didn’t and it was frustrating).
A headsail furler is a major plus - adding one will cost $ and require sail modifications.

I had a ton of fun with my boat, but this one seems expensive for a boat with a slow rating (a faster rating is valuable to put the boat in more competitive racing), no inboard and not even minimal overnighting ability (my boat rated 92, had a yanmar diesel, chart table & 7’ bunks P&S).