Advice regarding Brokers and boat purchase!

[topfish]

My search for a quality restored sailboat. My view has always been get a boat from someone who is has decided to retire from boating. Usually word of mouth or just being in the right place at the right time.

I have been dealing with brokers out of state for certain boats meeting my criteria. Getting frustrated I call brokers used car salesmen (probably not very fair of me). I lost a potential boat because I was out of the area and I believe the broker sold me out! The term I am hearing is a Buyers Broker. My understanding is a broker works for the seller and his/her commission!

What I has been suggested to me by a close friend is hire a broker who will work for you (a buyers broker). Do they really exist? My understanding is a buyers broker has tools I do not have and can work with other brokers sharing a commission. This makes sense to me as I am wondering if I am missing something!

Not using a broker and attempting to purchase directly from owner using classifieds. I have found several boats which were sold months ago and the add still remains. This is why I am still leaning towards a broker. Something that does bother me is when a broker tells me I don't have the boat your looking for But I have this one- something completely different from what I am seeking!

Any reasonable input would be appreciated! Thank You greatly!

[VanIslandGuy]

A really good broker can save you a lot of money and wasted time. We used one in Vancouver who I think very highly of and made our purchase process run very smoothly. Likewise in Toronto.

For a major purchase, having an intelligent second set of eyes working with you the entire way makes a lot of sense, especially when they only represent your interests.

[moctrams]

1982 Cape dory 30. Asking $32k. Location southern Maryland.

[topfish]

Originally Posted by VanIslandGuy

A really good broker can save you a lot of money and wasted time. We used one in Vancouver who I think very highly of and made our purchase process run very smoothly. Likewise in Toronto.

For a major purchase, having an intelligent second set of eyes working with you the entire way makes a lot of sense, especially when they only represent your interests.

Very much appreciated and I share your viewpoint. The current broker I am dealing with out of state is against a buyers broker. Said sharing commissions is not going to fly! I will not name him or establishment out of deference. I am still a class act!

Thinking this might be different using a broker for a private sale. A little extra money for a broker might be money well spent!

Thank You for your kind words and input!

[topfish]

Originally Posted by moctrams

1982 Cape dory 30. Asking $32k. Location southern Maryland.

Very nice classic plastic. I found one in WA state still listed but was sold months ago. I would like details if you have any? Realize I will be shipping it so that is an added expense. It is still pretty small for a 30 foot boat.

I am in lust over a PSC 31 Less then a 100 were made. Many deals on the PSC 34 which does not speak to me (no offense to PSC 34 owners).

Thank you!

[thinwater]

Originally Posted by topfish

...My view has always been get a boat from someone who is has decided to retire from boating....

Maybe. But often as not the person actually emotionally checked out a few years earlier and has only been going through the motions lately. Overdue maintenance lurks in hidden places.

A person moving on to his next boat is still a sailor and is perhaps more likely to invest the effort to get her ready. He needs the money for the next boat.

At least that has been my experience. The retiring sailor may offer the cheaper boat, but it isn't always the better value, not unless you really know boats and boat repair. Since you said you wanted a "restored" boat, you need to buy from someone that still loves her. It will also cost more and will be worth it.

[S/V Illusion]

It's no surprise you broker told you that. At least he was honest in that regard that he doesn't want to share.

Brokers don't like buyer brokers for the obvious reason that any commission must be shared. As brokers neither need or want to do that for 'sellable' boats, they often won't deal with a buyer broker. Consequently, you are limiting the universe of potential purchases to lazy brokers or those representing crap boats that are difficult to sell directly.

[sailful]

You NEED your own broker. The sellers broker is working on behalf of the seller, he doesn’t care about you. If you see a a boat listed in another city, contact a broker that works for a different company, he will work on YOUR behalf, getting the best deal for you.

[contrail]

He or she is still getting paid by the seller, no?

[sailful]

Originally Posted by contrail

He or she is still getting paid by the seller, no?

Yes. Seller pays commissions.

[S/V Illusion]

This isn't a question of what it cost or what the seller receives in a sale. Rather, it's an issue of whether a buyer's broker is a good idea.

One has to consider the motives and incentives of any broker who is operating a business and trying to maintain a good reputation. As it relates to the typical selling broker, he/she obviously prefers twice the commission compared with sharing it between two brokers. There is no incentive for a selling broker to work with a buyer's broker as he/she can sell the same boat to the same buyer and make twice the commission.

[Robert E]

Originally Posted by topfish

My search for a quality restored sailboat. My view has always been get a boat from someone who is has decided to retire from boating. Usually word of mouth or just being in the right place at the right time.

I have been dealing with brokers out of state for certain boats meeting my criteria. Getting frustrated I call brokers used car salesmen (probably not very fair of me). I lost a potential boat because I was out of the area and I believe the broker sold me out! The term I am hearing is a Buyers Broker. My understanding is a broker works for the seller and his/her commission!

What I has been suggested to me by a close friend is hire a broker who will work for you (a buyers broker). Do they really exist? My understanding is a buyers broker has tools I do not have and can work with other brokers sharing a commission. This makes sense to me as I am wondering if I am missing something!

Not using a broker and attempting to purchase directly from owner using classifieds. I have found several boats which were sold months ago and the add still remains. This is why I am still leaning towards a broker. Something that does bother me is when a broker tells me I don't have the boat your looking for But I have this one- something completely different from what I am seeking!

Any reasonable input would be appreciated! Thank You greatly!

It is very important to find a broker you trust and is working in your best interests. The second most important step you can take is to find an excellent surveyor. Do not rely on the seller surveyor. Find your own. Good luck. Robert

[Biomed]

I have had one bad experience after another with "buyer's brokers". Yes, they should split the commission, usually 50/50. In reality, it still comes out of the 10% commission built into the price you pay for the boat. The higher the savings, the more the earnings of the seller's AND the buyers broker are reduced. Prices for likely boats quoted to me by my "buyer's broker", who stated on a stack of bibles that he only had my interest at heart, were inflated by many hundreds of thousands of dollars. That was easy to ascertain, after repeated massive price reductions. My broker told me from the beginning,that the inflated price was very fair and a bargain at that. Yeah, right. The latest offering, involved my buyer's broker sending me a professional recommendation for a boat. In in it, he wrote that it had no crew or captains accomodation. The boat had both. His reply to my remarks: it was a page from someone else's website, and he had no idea what the boat was really about. If you think that someone like him puts your interests first......
This guy is a licenced and bonded broker, the cream of the professionals. So he says.
I am pretty much done with them. I'll get (a) top professional (s) to look over all aspects of the boat, and pay them their fees.
They work for me, and me only on that boat. Their reports will dictate whether or not I make an offer, and go for survey and haul out. Prices for similar boats will judge the asking price reality, and they can give a pretty good idea regarding any issues with the boat and accurate and realistic cost guidelines to set them right. Hell, I even had a buyer's broker tell me that a boat was grp, when its own description detailed steel plates in the hull that were replaced. The idiot even gave me a price recommendation! I have read through a lot of blurb on websites extolling the virtues of " buyer's brokers" aka "buyer's advocates", and gave goodly few a chance. If they had been what they said they were, I would have bought my boat a while ago. But they weren't.
Consider getting a hull, rigging, electronics and engine pundit to have a look. And take their advice to heart! Best money spent.
Fair winds!

[Cpt Mark]

Brokers operate like real estate salespeople. Commission gets split at the end of the sale.

Most boat brokers in my experience (and I have a lot) are unprofessional. The boat I own now the selling broker would not answer my calls, emails. I got fed up with him and used Roger Drill from Waterline Boats in Seattle. He had just helped a friend of mine buy his boat and I was happy with how he worked.

I asked him if he wanted to be part of the deal I was looking at in CA. He agreed and proceeded to contact the broker. Long story short, it took me almost 2 months to buy a boat I wanted to buy, the owner wanted to sell and I had cash. The selling broker was the issue. Roger provided excellent advice throughout.

I used to work with brokers from all over the world. A good broker will help ypou no matter where the boat is and should have experience in doing so.

[Seighlor]

Twice, as a buyer, I have been represented by brokers. In each case I ended with great boats I would not otherwise have found and at prices that were remarkably low. The transactions went smoothly and, when there were glitches in the paperwork and documentation, my brokers were there for me.