Bluewater Boat

[storyinframes]

Sail Calculator Pro v3.53 - 2000+ boats

thanks for the link dingoman. its very helpful site

[silverp40]

What are the possible enhancements/structural additions and alterations one can do for modern light displacement boats to make them passageworthy?

Main things are to keep the boat upright and the sea out. So, thru hulls have to all be good quality, preferably bronze with closing seacocks and good hoses, bulkheads properly glassed/tabbed to the hull, mast in good condition and the stays/terminals also in great shape. Some boats have poor hull to deck connections (example Columbia 45) which should be remedied, less the joint opens up in a seaway. Pumps good quality and properly installed. Diesel should also be dependable.

Cheers

[Brent Swain]

Originally Posted by goboatingnow

Its a falacy that you can take a knockdown wooden boat and repair it cheaply, you can bodge it up thats it, but the proper materials can cost a fortune and thats not counting your time.

Equally with a old GRP, take a look at the replacement costs of engines sails, deck gear etc etc etc. sometime you could get the boat for zero and it would still cost a fortune, and that assumes you don't have " hidden " problems like core delamination etc. In my experience for every 1 dirt cheap boat that usuable theres 50 that are just junk.

Dave

You are assuming someone with a used boat, will buy everything new. We are awash in used gear, in nearly new condition, for a fraction the new cost,or sails for a fraction the cost of the materials in them.
Used engines , in good condition, can be had for $1,000
There are plenty of solid core fibreglass, hulls available for a fraction the cost of the materials in them.
One can get cruising with a fraction the equipment some consider essential today , equipment which was unavailable, or not yet invented, not so long ago. Not having it didn't stop anyone from cruising then.

[silverp40]

I fully agree with Brent...

[boatman61]

Aaaaaarrrrrr...... Swing that lantern... Jimlad ye scurvy knave...... wheres me damn parrot.....
Nice one Brent....

[storyinframes]

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I guess this is a video of Sydney-Hobart race. Amazed at the skill with which the skipper is riding. Awesome!

[bruce smith]

Were we to take away todays weather forecasting technology, fewer "performance" boats would be successfully making ocean passages.
Boats are crossing oceans without even hitting a squal, much less a gale. The speed is part of the survival equasion .

[storyinframes]

what i intended with that video was the "skill" of the skipper.
Average sailors would face severe consequences.
@Bruce Smith : weather reports are crucial for ocean crossing. Imagine getting stuck in a storm like this. After all how many yachties would have that kind of skill and stamina to "race" through that storm.

Can you ride out that kind of storm with sails down and may be trailing a drogue in water?

[bruce smith]

Been hit by hurricanes at sea twice. Most recent was Sergio 18/nov/ 06, 200 miles west of Acapulco. ( and Nana 95? north of Beermuda) So, yea, my boat rides em. out bare poles, no drogue or sea anchor.
Weather reports ARE crucial, for modern boats. For a true bluewater boat, they are a convenience.
Conditions in that video, I'd be going about 1/3 the speed, but reading or asleep in my bunk.

[NotQuiteLost]

Totally agree with the thought on this page thus far. Frequent (and accurate) weather reports, GPS accurate to the meter, electronic chart packages detailing underwater topography for every nook and cranny and immediate communications via sat-phone or the ever-improving SSB/HAM technology makes 'modern' boats viable, whereas fifty years ago they would have been (and WERE) considered deathtraps for cruisers.

Caught in a typhoon for four days, my big ol' steel job hove to and rode out the worst of it with nary a scratch. Never even threatened a knockdown in 60knots plus and 25-30 foot seas. I must say, it was comfortable and stable enough that I watched movies and played computer games until the winds came back down to a reasonable 40knots or so sustained, at which point the sails went back out and I was on my way once again.

edit to add: it is pretty shocking the first time a 30' wave crests and smashes into the side of your steel hull. I was sure I'd hit something solid, and was checking everything under the sole for incoming water. Turns out, water makes quite a racket when it hits metal with that much power behind it. I just smiled every other time it happened afterwards.

[blueprintbill]

Re a good 'bluewater boat' for short money, a few thoughts come to mind after a review of this thread.
One can go to sea in anything. Webb Chiles went in an open canoe. Thor Heyerdahl crossed the Pacific in a balsa raft. People have sailed in Cal 25's, Ranger 23's, Catalinas and Bendy boats. If you want to takes your chances have at it. However there has been a lot of thought and research put out there which outlines pretty convincingly to me , that the safer, more comfortable alternatives lie in heavier, longer keeled vessels, capable of being set up to steer themselves, and carry a reasonable amount of provisions, fuel, and water, and get there with a good turn of speed.
Lighter vessels heavily laden do not perform well.
I have often given the example of imagining setting to sea as a mouse in small vessel. How would I feel / survive in a plastic milk carton versus a glass wine bottle. The milk carton would skitter and bounce hither and yon
at the whim of the winds and seas. The wine bottle would be a much more comfortable craft in which to spend the crossing.
Think Contessa 32, Bristol Channel Cutter (or any Lyle Hess design), Cape Dory 31, 33, 36, or my own boat a Nicholson 31. None of them race winners ( except the Contessa in the 79 Fastnet ) but they will get you there comfortably and safely.

[ReMetau]

Here you go. This guy sailed this boat down from Miami to Key West on the way to Ft. Myers. He sleeps and eats on this thing. Notice the pan hanging in the cockpit.

[sneuman]

Originally Posted by NotQuiteLost

Totally agree with the thought on this page thus far. Frequent (and accurate) weather reports, GPS accurate to the meter, electronic chart packages detailing underwater topography for every nook and cranny and immediate communications via sat-phone or the ever-improving SSB/HAM technology makes 'modern' boats viable, whereas fifty years ago they would have been (and WERE) considered deathtraps for cruisers.

Caught in a typhoon for four days, my big ol' steel job hove to and rode out the worst of it with nary a scratch. Never even threatened a knockdown in 60knots plus and 25-30 foot seas. I must say, it was comfortable and stable enough that I watched movies and played computer games until the winds came back down to a reasonable 40knots or so sustained, at which point the sails went back out and I was on my way once again.

edit to add: it is pretty shocking the first time a 30' wave crests and smashes into the side of your steel hull. I was sure I'd hit something solid, and was checking everything under the sole for incoming water. Turns out, water makes quite a racket when it hits metal with that much power behind it. I just smiled every other time it happened afterwards.

What you said brings back some memories. Let me tell you, a 30' wall of water makes quite a racket on fiberglass, too! I went through one of those beasts that forms off the Philippines, in a 28' sloop. I wish I'd had a proper sea anchor at the time, because next time (I hope not) I'd do what you did instead of running with the storm.

[MichaelC]

80k? Check this: I have built/owned 15 sailboats, and am building one now. The 15 include: 34' aluminum Colvin schooner, 26' plywood Colvin sharpie, 2 Viking designed 17' faerings, 8 skiffs, 3 prams. Total cost of all of those 36k. I am building a 33' DE hard chined gaff cutter. I have most of the materials on hand already, and the cost at launch will be right around 10k. I have looked at perhaps five sail away [or close] FRP sloops, built in the 60s or 3arly 70s, all ocean capable and all for under 15k. Now it is true that I do not need a master stateroom big enough to sleep 6 women with me. I do not need more than one place to poop. I can cook quite well on a very small cook stove. I do not need an engine to sail a boat wherever I want. I do not need most of the stuff which drives boat 'costs' thru the roof. I absolutely love the building process, and I sneer at the Madison Avenue boat layouts. If you want to go cruising, buy a Pearson 30' full keel Alberg design for 10k and go. Quit talking about it. Or a Columbia 29. Sell the engine and use the space for cruising gear. A Pearson Triton. If you need two staterooms and a shower for three and you absolutely NEED to spend 100k, buy a condo. Look, if you buy a 40' boat you will probably NEED an engine. Buy a Triton or a Pearson 30, and you can SELL the engine for a third of what you paid for the boat. Pack it up with cruising gear [NO, not 5000 dollars worth of toys] and [if you are on the West Coast] do the Mexico-Hawaii-home circuit. Then you know some stuff and can make up your mind, and your total outlay has been 1/4 of that 80k. Just do it.

[storyinframes]

80k? Check this: I have built/owned 15 sailboats, and am building one now. The 15 include: 34' aluminum Colvin schooner, 26' plywood Colvin sharpie, 2 Viking designed 17' faerings, 8 skiffs, 3 prams. Total cost of all of those 36k. I am building a 33' DE hard chined gaff cutter. I have most of the materials on hand already, and the cost at launch will be right around 10k.

Hello MichaelC, thanks for the input. do you have a site where I can see some of your work?
what do you think of Southern cross 35/39s?
And, do you think Aluminium hulls are expensive to maintain compared to fibreglass?
and how cheap would it be to get a custom made aluminium32/35 footer?

quite a lot of questions for you? :-)