Boat cradles..whats the deal?

[Ferrari]

Originally Posted by TrentePieds

Laura:

Think it through :-) Your Landfall weighs 10 tonnes. Thassa lot of weight!

When she's in the water the weight is taken uniformly by the "canoe body", the underwater part of the hull sans keel. When she's on the hard, the weight has to be taken by the keel and the few small places of the canoe boy that actually touch something solid. That concentrates the weight enormously in a very few places.

So the way we deal with it is that the keel is blocked up to take ALL the weight. It can do that because for these purposes it's essentially a metal beam. Focusing ALL the weight on the keel stresses the boat somewhat, but obviously the rest of the structure of the hull is made sturdy enough to take it so that it will not deform.


So all we have to do now is keep the boat upright while it's "balanced" on the keel. That's where the cradle comes in. The "legs" (called "stanchions") are made telescopically adjustable, and the "pads" that the boat leans against can swivel in all three planes. Thus the cradle is universal (given it's the right general size, of course).

The fore'n'aft placement of the stanchions should coincide with the fore'n'aft placement of bulkheads which act as internal braces. Yard's cradles therefore have stanchions that can "lean" in the fore'n'aft direction and be adjusted for the distance twixt bulkheads in the particular boat that has to be cradled.

All good yards have very well made cradles, and they can generally be handled by ginormous forklifts when they need to be moved, even with a boat in them. Normal practice is to take an empty cradle to the slip serviced by the TraveLift or crane, haul the boat, set it in the cradle, adjust the stanchions and then transport the cradle with the boat in it to its assigned place in the yard. The cradle has a "backbone" to take the weight of the boat via the keel.

A wooden cradle is much more difficult to handle than a metal one and far less secure. Therefore yards will tend to refuse to handle wooden cradles. The rent of space "on the hard" usually includes rent of the yard's metal cradle.

Hope that clarifies things

TrentePieds

This is good stuff and I will suggest a simple way to increase the stability of any sail boat on the hard in any cradle.
Use the halyards on either side of the boat and attache to secure rings set in the concrete or drilled deep in other media.
This will make a huge improvement to the vessels stability. No need to over tighten.

[JimsCAL]

Our club stores boats over the winter in our parking lots. Years ago we used Jowi adjustable steel cradles. Now we use jackstands and blocking. All the yards around here use jackstands and their use is included in winter storage fee. Can't think of a yard that expects the boats stored there to have their own cradle.

[Jammer]

Depends on the boat, depends on the marina.

The marina I'm at puts boats either on cradles or trailers. Boats are stored on grassy ground, not gravel or concrete. There might be one or two on stands, if that. In general, here, even with the cradles, most people pull the mast in the fall and step it again in the spring.

Some people, in some places, buy their own stands rather than rent them every year.


Up to around 34' feet or so, there are some people who find that it is a better deal in the long run to purchase a trailer for winter storage, even if they don't intend to haul the boat over the road with it more than once or twice while they own it.


The cradles can be modified to fit another boat by cutting and welding the steel, which isn't especially difficult.

Generally, when switching marinas, paying someone to load, haul, and unload the cradle is part of the cost. Most cradles are narrower than the boats they support, and can be moved on a flatbed truck, usually without an oversize permit.


Another fact to consider is that the cradle must be stored somewhere over the summer. Cradle storage is included in my dock space contract with the marina, but that isn't universally true and some places charge for it.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by JimsCAL

Our club stores boats over the winter in our parking lots. Years ago we used Jowi adjustable steel cradles. Now we use jackstands and blocking. All the yards around here use jackstands and their use is included in winter storage fee. Can't think of a yard that expects the boats stored there to have their own cradle.

Sailboats having their own cradle is pretty standard up here on the Great lake where boats spend 6 months a year out of the water. It's a problem I'm dealing with now I need to get a cradle built for my sailboat for the YC that I'm joining on Lake Ontario (I'm renting one where I am now). I actually never saw a sailboat stored only on stands until I bought my current boat in Annapolis!

[klaspat]

I have a nice solid metal one in Iroquois I could sell you

[TrentePieds]

Laura is on Lake Ontario. She would be well advised to follow local custom, and he would have little interest in the customs obtaining in Florida, SoCal, Nova Scotia or even here in the Salish Sea.

She had asked SPECIFICALLY how cradles work. I quote: " How will I know the cradle will work? Are the pads adjustable? Are cradles specific to the boat or are they adjustable based on length? Does longer than needed matter?"

So the best thing we can do for her is to answer those specific questions. Our task, as "old hands", is to help "newbies" to think along lines that conduce to fundamental understanding, and thereby to intelligent boat keeping :-)

TP

[dfelsent]

Originally Posted by pcmm

Seen a few yards with the hydraulic trailer to move boats around from time to time but I've not yet seen a yard pack boats so close together that a travellift isn't the primary way of stacking boats. Its common on the great lakes, chesapeake, and hudson valley to do all the work with a travellift ( at least the yards I've used) anyway, we're drifting.



The OP if they are thinking long term should really think about investing in a good cradle. 3-4 supports per side. If they are getting a new custom cradle made I would go as far as to try to get the supports placed where the bulkheads are.

Where I am a hydraulic trailer is common as well as a travel lift. Some boats on stands, some on cradles. The yard I’m in uses cradles and stands depending on the boat and storage location.
Moonbeam sits on a cradle in the winter. It’s wood and beefy. It belongs to the yard. They made it fit with a chainsaw and a sledge hammer and pads.
They use an elephant, greased boards, and block and tackle to move the cradles. They have anchor points all over the yard and in the buildings to make it work.
BTW the elephant is big and gray and is a fairly serious diesel powered fork truck. With 2:1 the elephant drags 40k pounds of boat around. I think the elephant is from the 1940s. The yard is much older.

[CassidyNZ]

I’ve never needed to store a boat for any length of time but obviously the boat comes out for maintenance periodically. The yard I use has a “cradle of sorts that is simple, infinitely adjustable and strong enough to weather most conditions.

The image shows my boat in such a cradle. The props at the back and under the stem are to stop forward/aft movement. The beams up the sides are held against boat using substantial chains and bottle screws and the boat is very firmly contained. Sideways motion is almost impossible.

I guess though that in conditions of water inundation there is the chance that the fore and aft props could sink into the ground. Then I suppose it would come down to the boat’s design. Mine has a keel with a big enough footprint to limit the pressure on the props. Or it needs to be standing on a concrete apron.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by LauraleeG

We have a 38' Landfall C+C. It came with a cradle but an old , wooden, impractical thing, too heavy and a bitch to trailer where we are keeping the boat.
So whats the deal with cradles? If I buy used, what should I be looking for? How will I know the cradle will work? Are the pads adjustable? Are cradles specific to the boat or are they adjustable based on length?Does longer than needed matter?
Thanks!

Most cradles have a limited amount of adjustment (6 -12 inches of hieght max). If you find a cradle that is long enough and wide enough, typically on a 38' boat you'll want a cradle a wide as practical (8.5ft) to give the most lateral support and probably 16-20 ft long. to be able to support the ends of the boat. I don't like to have alot of overhang as things can get a bit bouncy feeling. but once you find a cradle that you think is a good fit, measure everything and compare to where the pads would land on your boat. The supports might need to be cut shorter or extended to fit. but could save you 50% of the price of a new custom cradle (they are not cheap!)

[ramblinrod]

Originally Posted by LauraleeG

We have a 38' Landfall C+C. It came with a cradle but an old , wooden, impractical thing, too heavy and a bitch to trailer where we are keeping the boat.
So whats the deal with cradles? If I buy used, what should I be looking for? How will I know the cradle will work? Are the pads adjustable? Are cradles specific to the boat or are they adjustable based on length?Does longer than needed matter?
Thanks!

Cradle fit is extremely important and for long term, or repeated storage are definitely preferred. I’ve worked with these people near you a few times with great success.

https://cradleridetrailers.com/

[sailingharry]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

We winter store at the same marina we dock. Some people rent jack stands at about $500/ year. Our steel cradle has paid for itself over the 25 years of owning this boat.

For us it’s both economic and peace of mind since we have to haul annually and sit on the hard for six months

As you consider the economic equation, remember three points:
* You will probably pay storage 12 months/year, regardless of where your boat is (go south for a winter, pay storage).
* If you have options about where to haul out, you have to move your cradle from yard to yard.
* If you sell your boat, you may have to pay to dispose of the cradle (I almost bought a boat in Toronto, I live in Maryland where I haul for a month every two years, I wasn't going to take the cradle).


Harry

[lewisa]

$500 dollars a year to rent jack stands$ That's highway robbery. I pay $100 per year for a 41 foot boat (Maine). The convenience of having the yard purchase, maintain, and store the stands is well worth it.

[pcmm]

Originally Posted by Tetepare

ETA talk to your storage facility. If they make cradles fine, if not, ask who does. Get a quote. Or, ask if the marina has an unused one that would fit.

Compare that to jack stand rental. In my observation, payoff is 4-5 years.

Note also after the big rains two years ago I saw at least a dozen jack stand boats that had tipped over when the stands- even on plywood- sank into the mud.

the savings of having a cradle doesn't pay off anywhere near that quickly. Don't forget during the summer when you're not using the cradle you still have to pay a storage fee for the cradle which is usually around $150-200. So in comparison with stands having a cradle typically saves you $100-$150 per year so it will take 10-15 years for the cradle to "break even.

more importantly though, having a cradle (preferrably folding as some marinas charge extra to store non-folding during the summer) that fits with a good wide base gives you extra assurance during the winter that the boat won't topple over. Gives you the security that the pads are in the right place and repeatable and can save some additional money if you don't demast as part of the winter haul.

[Connemara]

LauraLeeG:

Where are you keeping the boat, a marina or a club? First thing to do would be to ask what is required. Our club now requires a steel foldable cradle, although we have a couple of boats with grandfathered systems, including one with jackstands.

To answer the other questions, or some of them:

-- Steel cradles are adjustable to some degree. They'll have a central support for the keel and four to six pads to support the hull and stop the boat from falling over. The pads move up and down to allow you adjust the support and keep the boat as upright as possible.
-- if you're buying used, make sure it suits the boat. Length is not adjustable; a cradle built for a 25-footer is gonna be pretty short for 38-footer (and probably hazardously so). U might try speaking to other landfall owners if you can find some and ask what they have.
-- But it's probably easier to have one made. Many posters have mentioned Cradleman's; they've been making cradles in southern Ontario since Adam was a pup and can probably tell you offhand what you need..

In any case, given the season, you might be forced to use the wooden cradle this year, since haul-out time is approaching.

hope that helps

Connemara

[sailortype]

Marine Cradle Shop also well known and good quality, been around for years

https://cradleridetrailers.com/