Boat suggestion sought for the Loop

[Chuck Hawley]

My college roommate from 40 years ago just finished the Great Loop in an Albin 28, recently repowered with a large Yanmar. While he could cruise in the high teens, he burned a lot of fuel.

I am interested in some of the themes expressed in this thread, so allow me to list them in my areas of interest:

1. Sailboat hulls are efficient, so you can go a long way at 5 knots or so with very little diesel (or gas, but let's stick with diesel)>
2. Sailboats are also extremely seaworthy if you're going to get caught in a Great Lakes squall or storm. Self-righting at least.
3. Sounds like the sailing is marginal.
4. Sounds like bridges are a hinderance to tall air draft boats.
5. Headroom is a requirement.
6. I have to assume that cost is an object, or at least it would be for me.

Therefore, I think the solution is to buy a used FG sailboat from about 20 years ago that has been repowered (or came with) a two or three cylinder diesel auxiliary. Something like an Ericson 29, or Cal 2-29, or Catalina 27, etc. Pull the rig and put it in a safe place for the next year to two. Make sure you have a very reliable, oversized autopilot that's integrated into your chartplotter. Add a couple of batteries so you don't have to diddle around with your electrical system capacity when you're not underway. Buy a boat with a dodger so you can stand watch and stay dry.

When you finish your trip, re-step the mast and you'll have a resellable boat that's not too peculiar, and you won't lose more than a couple of thousand dollars in depreciation.

Cheers,

Chuck

[letitia pierce]

We cruised from Baltimore down the ICW and on to the Bahamas and back in our Nauticat 36 pilothouse motorsailer ketch. The mast passed easily under the fixed bridges and the 90 hp diesel allowed us to maneuver when waiting for the drawbridges. The very flexible floorplan has good headroom throughout and plenty of storage. And the 36 sails pretty well in a variety of sail configurations. We hope to do the other part of the Loop eventually with the mast stored on deck through the Erie Canal. This admiral thinks the Nauticat would be a great choice for what you are planning!

[jmczzz]

Didn't mean to highjack op's thread but wanted to share my loop project.
Not at all as expert as most.
My choice for the loop, budget and extended living/traveling time (2 YRS). is a Catalina 25, swing keel, standard rig. Keel up draft 30 inches, down 5', air draft 35' weight fully loaded approx 6000 lbs, headroom 5'9" wife 5'2" me 5' 10". 1975 yr model, hull # 808, bought it from estate sale cheap spent a year in the yard rebuilding bottom, keel, all hanging and lifting hardware, refitting sealing ports, painting in and out. I didn't do a lot of refitting rig as sailing is secondary to motoring on loop. But have inspected and replaced obvious weak components. Has good used main with 1 reef, working jib, 130 genoa and a storm jib, 3 anchors. Built a take apart A-frame, line "baby stays" to solo step, on water or hard. autopilot, new depth sounder, low-end chart plotter w/inland & coastal chart card, VHF, thermal couple cooler, foam mattress. hand shower, extra 20 gal water tank to add to stock 18 gal, 10 hp 4 stroke electric start long shaft high torque prop, two 6 gal tanks, house and crank batteries. Rewired, LEDs according to guides.
Read these cruising post daily, Studied Loop cruising guides, recommendations and info from Steady, Stu, Uncivilized, Ann, and Looper expert and author Capt John. Now in Kentucky Lake waiting on a warm front to head south on TN-Tom to arrive in Gulf at end of H'cane season.
74 yr old retired teacher, from Gulf Coast, some owner and sailing experience coastal & inland on 22 to 30 footers.

[BandB]

You can de-mast before entering the Erie Canal and then put the mast back up in Mobile. That gives you about half the loop with and half without. You can put it back up for the Great Lakes and then remove it again in Chicago and that will give you more than 2/3 sailing possible.

That said, you see very few sailors sailing on the loop. Most sail boats motor all the way. Is your wife opposed to boarding any boat or just this one? If just this one, get one she'll go on. If all boats, she can meet you many places or....here's a novel idea coming up.

She can shadow you the entire trip. You do it by water, she does it by land. You by boat, she by car. You're with each other nearly every night but at worst every second night. At every stop you have the convenience of the car to go exploring. You both see the same towns, experience similar sites. Because she's faster in the car, she can provision and she may find things you never would.

Many do similar to this in Europe on the canals. We recently got into this pretty much by accident. We were traveling back and forth from Fort Lauderdale to a boat we had docked on the Lake Pickwick. It's the old story of "can't get there from here." Long drive. Now we typically have 6 to 8 people aboard and were planning 8. Can fly, then have to get a car and drive two hours as no airport close. Could charter a plane at those prices. Don't have a car or SUV that will hold 8. Could just go with 6 in an SUV. Or could get someone to drive us in a limo. Not any great answers. Could rent an RV but they limit you to 7 and are set up better for sleeping than riding.

So, in some flight of insanity we bought a Sprinter and took it to TN. But then decided that one or two would drive it between each stop, shadowing. They would pick up groceries, check out areas and we'd switch out. Oh the joy of always having a vehicle in each town that would hold us all and not needing 3 taxis or to rent a van or rent 2 cars. So we've fallen in love with shadowing. Much like shadow boats that follow megayachts around.

So, just tossing it out as an idea to consider. By road will be many fewer miles. She'd also have time for many activities on her own. Sounds crazy at first, but perhaps test it out on your next sailing adventure.

[Sdwcheney]

I would like to find 3 or 4 boaters who wan.t to do the Great Loop, with about $15K each. I know of a Searay 42 with Caterpillar diesels that would do the Loop in comfort. But have to know by Monday, or this boat is going to be gone.

[Stillwater1]

The owner of this boat is the friend of a close friend of mine. I almost purchased this boat last June. I spent 2 weeks looking it over, getting a full tour by Rob Hoffman the owner. He did most of the work on it himself and it is a pretty incredibly well done vessel with lot's of unique features. The mast is rigged to come up and down easily when it is on it's trailer. You would have to ask Rob how to do it when on the water doing the loop, that may require some assistance from others.

http://www.sailboatlistings.com/view/59300

[tsl]

I saw 5 or 6 sailboats up in the north channel doing the loop. 3 of them had their mast down or off the boat completely. This in some of the best sailing waters we have. When I asked as tactfully as possible, I received two reasons: One boat was simply on a mission to do the loop and to step at the exit of the Trent Severn waterway and then re-step Chicago might have been an expense or effort they did not want to incur. The other reason was that they wanted flat water coming down Lake Michigan and flat water and sailing don't go together on Lake Michigan. So yes they motored thru some nice sailing areas but the big leg was down Lake Michigan. I never felt I could ask them if they knew how to sail.

One point I'd like to make is that sailboat seats are made for sailing (facing athwartship) I think I would rather sit facing forward for the better part of a year. Plenty of diesel sipping trawlers out there.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by Chuck Hawley

My college roommate from 40 years ago just finished the Great Loop in an Albin 28, recently repowered with a large Yanmar. While he could cruise in the high teens, he burned a lot of fuel.

I am interested in some of the themes expressed in this thread, so allow me to list them in my areas of interest:

1. Sailboat hulls are efficient, so you can go a long way at 5 knots or so with very little diesel (or gas, but let's stick with diesel)>
2. Sailboats are also extremely seaworthy if you're going to get caught in a Great Lakes squall or storm. Self-righting at least.
3. Sounds like the sailing is marginal.
4. Sounds like bridges are a hinderance to tall air draft boats.
5. Headroom is a requirement.
6. I have to assume that cost is an object, or at least it would be for me.

Therefore, I think the solution is to buy a used FG sailboat from about 20 years ago that has been repowered (or came with) a two or three cylinder diesel auxiliary. Something like an Ericson 29, or Cal 2-29, or Catalina 27, etc. Pull the rig and put it in a safe place for the next year to two. Make sure you have a very reliable, oversized autopilot that's integrated into your chartplotter. Add a couple of batteries so you don't have to diddle around with your electrical system capacity when you're not underway. Buy a boat with a dodger so you can stand watch and stay dry.

When you finish your trip, re-step the mast and you'll have a resellable boat that's not too peculiar, and you won't lose more than a couple of thousand dollars in depreciation.

Cheers,

Chuck

Good Post Chuck.

[Steadman Uhlich]

Originally Posted by BandB

You can de-mast before entering the Erie Canal and then put the mast back up in Mobile. That gives you about half the loop with and half without. You can put it back up for the Great Lakes and then remove it again in Chicago and that will give you more than 2/3 sailing possible.

That said, you see very few sailors sailing on the loop. Most sail boats motor all the way. Is your wife opposed to boarding any boat or just this one? If just this one, get one she'll go on. If all boats, she can meet you many places or....here's a novel idea coming up.

She can shadow you the entire trip. You do it by water, she does it by land. You by boat, she by car. You're with each other nearly every night but at worst every second night. At every stop you have the convenience of the car to go exploring. You both see the same towns, experience similar sites. Because she's faster in the car, she can provision and she may find things you never would.

Many do similar to this in Europe on the canals. We recently got into this pretty much by accident. We were traveling back and forth from Fort Lauderdale to a boat we had docked on the Lake Pickwick. It's the old story of "can't get there from here." Long drive. Now we typically have 6 to 8 people aboard and were planning 8. Can fly, then have to get a car and drive two hours as no airport close. Could charter a plane at those prices. Don't have a car or SUV that will hold 8. Could just go with 6 in an SUV. Or could get someone to drive us in a limo. Not any great answers. Could rent an RV but they limit you to 7 and are set up better for sleeping than riding.

So, in some flight of insanity we bought a Sprinter and took it to TN. But then decided that one or two would drive it between each stop, shadowing. They would pick up groceries, check out areas and we'd switch out. Oh the joy of always having a vehicle in each town that would hold us all and not needing 3 taxis or to rent a van or rent 2 cars. So we've fallen in love with shadowing. Much like shadow boats that follow megayachts around.

So, just tossing it out as an idea to consider. By road will be many fewer miles. She'd also have time for many activities on her own. Sounds crazy at first, but perhaps test it out on your next sailing adventure.

That's a nice suggestion of a compromise for a couple.

[geoleo]

Originally Posted by tbodine88

Hello

I own a West Wight Potter. I plan to do the Loop, and other trips when I retire. My wife will not go aboard the Potter on any trip, much less this one

I'd like her to visit me at certain ports along the trip, so I am contemplating a larger boat. I'd prefer sailing when ever I can since I prefer that to motoring, but I don't want to need a crane to drop the mast for bridges. I am looking for suggestions of boats that a have mast tabernacles and can be operated fairly easily by a fit old man. Should have standing headroom for a 5 foot person. Shoal draft preferred for the skinny water around Florida and the Chesapeake.

Thanks in advance.

I suggest a canoe for the loop-it has unlimited headroom,

[barnakiel]

A tabernacle can be retrofitted into many boats with deck stepped masts.

Find a boat you like then see if you could modify the mast/deck fitting.

Cheers,
b

[flyingfin]

Sailboats are for sailing, trawlers are for going slow. You really need to buy a power boat just for the loop trip, then sell it when you are done. Plus, with many miles between pumpouts, you will need a larger vessel with decent size holding tanks

[rwidman]

Originally Posted by flyingfin

Sailboats are for sailing, trawlers are for going slow. You really need to buy a power boat just for the loop trip, then sell it when you are done. Plus, with many miles between pumpouts, you will need a larger vessel with decent size holding tanks

Well, a trawler is a power boat. Are you saying a trawler would be good for the loop or that it would be too slow for the loop?

My thought is, a trawler is a good boat for the loop unless you're just doing it so you can say you did it. There's hardly any point in doing 6,000 miles on the water as fast as you can go. To me, at least, the point is to see the sights, visit the towns and meet the people. 7 knots is about right for this.

What I haven't seen mentioned is "range". there are some places on the loop where fuel stops are over 200 miles apart.

Anyone considering doing the great loop would do well to go to amazon.com and look for all the books other people have written on the subject. Buy them and read them. Read them again. And of course there's the Great Loop Association. You have to pay to join but it's a great resource.

[Eleuthera 2014]

Think trawler..

[darylat8750]

Originally Posted by BandB

You can de-mast before entering the Erie Canal and then put the mast back up in Mobile. That gives you about half the loop with and half without. You can put it back up for the Great Lakes and then remove it again in Chicago and that will give you more than 2/3 sailing possible.

That said, you see very few sailors sailing on the loop. Most sail boats motor all the way. Is your wife opposed to boarding any boat or just this one? If just this one, get one she'll go on. If all boats, she can meet you many places or....here's a novel idea coming up.

She can shadow you the entire trip. You do it by water, she does it by land. You by boat, she by car. You're with each other nearly every night but at worst every second night. At every stop you have the convenience of the car to go exploring. You both see the same towns, experience similar sites. Because she's faster in the car, she can provision and she may find things you never would.

Many do similar to this in Europe on the canals. We recently got into this pretty much by accident. We were traveling back and forth from Fort Lauderdale to a boat we had docked on the Lake Pickwick. It's the old story of "can't get there from here." Long drive. Now we typically have 6 to 8 people aboard and were planning 8. Can fly, then have to get a car and drive two hours as no airport close. Could charter a plane at those prices. Don't have a car or SUV that will hold 8. Could just go with 6 in an SUV. Or could get someone to drive us in a limo. Not any great answers. Could rent an RV but they limit you to 7 and are set up better for sleeping than riding.

So, in some flight of insanity we bought a Sprinter and took it to TN. But then decided that one or two would drive it between each stop, shadowing. They would pick up groceries, check out areas and we'd switch out. Oh the joy of always having a vehicle in each town that would hold us all and not needing 3 taxis or to rent a van or rent 2 cars. So we've fallen in love with shadowing. Much like shadow boats that follow megayachts around.

So, just tossing it out as an idea to consider. By road will be many fewer miles. She'd also have time for many activities on her own. Sounds crazy at first, but perhaps test it out on your next sailing adventure.

Excellent idea.

My wife and I have done the loop in a trawler. It will never be as fuel efficiect as a small sail boat but if you stay below 7 or 8 knots (depending on the length ) they aren't as bad as a lot of people think.

If I had done the loop in a 30 something foot sailboat I would have had to do it alone. A walk around berth that she doesn't have to climb on to make, a head with a separate shower so she doesn't have to wipe down a toilet right after she showers and a TV so she can watch the evening news and Boom! I had a partner.
I should add that she has done a good portion of the IntraCoastal in a 30' sailboat but she was just not willing to camp for the amount of time it takes to do the loop. It did take us 3 years but was Great Fun.